 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: salsacookies
Date: 2011-11-18 07:10
...an entire orchestra. It's almost tempting. I'm in medical school right now and probably have no chance at ever playing in a AFM symphony, so it doesn't really matter to me if I get "blacklisted". I would simply play for the sake of playing and make pretty good money(well good money for me) doing it.
http://www.louisvilleorchestra.org/wp-content/uploads/National-Call-Flyer-Email.pdf
My setup
Leblanc Legacy Bb with grenadilla barrel and bell, B45 w/Optimum lig.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-11-18 08:47
The situation in Louisville is VERY sad. There is a management comprised of business people who are trying to run an orchestra purely as a business model and wonder why it's not working. The orchestra itself (at least BEFORE this crisis) was probably one of the most underrated ensembles in the country. They were the opera orchestra, the ballet orchestra and the symphony orchestra, and for my money on par with the Atlanta Symphony in technique and musicality.
Here is a city with the old moneyed class that runs the Kentucky Derby and much of the country's horse racing establishment and they can't throw enough spare change at this group to keep it going - pathetic.
.................Paul Aviles
Post Edited (2011-11-18 16:57)
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Author: William
Date: 2011-11-18 14:32
Dear Louisville Orchestra management, if you are intending to replace an AFM clarinetist, if you should stoop to call me--a Life AFM member--I will be "NOT AVAILABLE".
Post Edited (2011-11-18 14:33)
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2011-11-18 14:47
I auditioned for Louisville back in 2003, maybe I should give them a call...?
Peter Cigleris
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2011-11-18 15:35
I'd be careful, Peter. Even though you're from the UK, it could damage your relations over here with the AFM to do it. If you check into some of the things that happened as a result of the Detroit stike last year, you'll see that things can get pretty heated, and some folks have very long memories.
I'll be keeping a close eye on how this plays out. I know some of the musicians involved--very fine players all of them, and it's a shame it's come to this. I sincerely hope it does not come to their being replaced permenantly--this is a brutal market to be dumped into, and I don't know where they'd end up.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2011-11-18 19:04
"There is a management comprised of business people who are trying to run an orchestra purely as a business model and wonder why it's not working."
HA! Making ends meet selling tickets for an 80-piece non-touring niche-music band doesn't work as a business model?
Are the auditions held behind a screen? I'm tempted to apply, then show up and play all the excerpts on contra. At sounding pitch, of course. If people can play A parts on Bb, I don't see why I can't play them on a different member of the clarinet family as well, as long as the same notes come out...
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2011-11-18 19:08
Thanks for the advice Eric, my fiancee is from the US so I may well end up living across the pond. I wouldn't want to scupper any chances I might have.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: gsurosey
Date: 2011-11-18 20:03
What is AFM? My guess is a union?
----------
Rachel
Clarinet Stash:
Bb/A: Buffet R13
Eb: Bundy
Bass: Royal Global Max
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-11-18 21:36
Alex,
Did you just refer to classical music as a 'niche market.?'
I will calmly just say that in a manner of speaking you're right. This is why you have 'patrons' listed on the back page of programs. There are individuals with a great deal of money (not many mind you, but they exist) who will just DONATE money to have such an entity in their community. When enough of this money is collected and invested the group (or museum, whichever you prefer) becomes fully FUNDED ............ like the N.Y. Philharmonic (another niche group).
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2011-11-19 00:00
Paul:
That's about how I would define niche market, yup, and I think the classical world would actually be far better off if it embraced rather than denied its niche status.
Eric:
I do really, sincerely want to take an audition that way some day, though. It would be a blast! Doing it at a union-busting audition seems a more appropriate venue than most.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Joseph Tomasso
Date: 2011-11-20 02:39
I now live in florida, but about 3 years ago I got put on their sub roster. Because of the distance I have had to turn them down enough times that they removed me from the roster last spring. I have to say, while it is a sticky situation, putting that kind of pay up there is going to attract a lot of players who are looking for work. Totally unfair to the striking musicians, and totally unfair to the 'new' musicians. Even though I was "on their side" i would be terrified to apply for a permanent position. What happens if they resolve their conflict next year and you're out a job? Yuck, scary!
Of course i'd love a full time performing job right now, just not under those circumstances. Anyone else willing to offer though, i'm ready!
Bachelor of Music, Sax/Clarinet Performance (2005, 06)
Master of Music, Multiple Woodwind Performance (2008)
Master of Music, Oboe Performance (2013)
Gainesville Chamber Orchestra (Clarinet)
University of Florida 2010-2011(Visiting Lecturer in Woodwi
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2011-11-20 03:43
Joseph Tomasso wrote:
> i would be terrified to apply for
> a permanent position. What happens if they resolve their
> conflict next year and you're out a job? Yuck, scary!
>
This actually has me a little confused. I thought, naively, perhaps, that the NLRB had regulations against hiring *permanent* replacements for striking workers. Temporary replacements (spelled s-c-a-b-s) get to work for a while from time to time, but they go in, if they're realistic, knowing they'll be leaving when the contract dispute is settled. But if an employer can permanently replace striking workers, why would the orchestra even continue negotiating with the fired players who didn't re-audition. I suspect the AFM will appeal or already has appealed this to the NLRB. Except for the situation with air traffic controllers in the early 1980s, I've never been aware of this kind of tactic succeeding unless the organization first goes out of business and then starts up again as a new entity.
Karl
Post Edited (2011-11-20 14:23)
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Author: epssax
Date: 2011-11-20 22:13
The musicians(union) turned down the final offer by the board. It was $925 per week for 30 weeks, due to a short season. A lot of players have left town and I was told the first chair clarinetist left for another job. Used to be a fine orchestra but the business climate in Louisville is not good and a lot of the "old money" businesses have been bought by Fortune 500 companies. So the rich patrons have sold their businesses and don't contribute as much. The orchestra went bankrupt months ago but was given a break by the judge and they didn't have to repay a lot of debt. It is not pretty.
Been playing clarinet 53 years. Studied with Jim Elliott and James Livingston in Louisville. Been a professional musician 51 years. Play a Buffet R-13. Also play a Buffet tenor sax, Martin Baritone sax, Jupiter also sax. www.thecountryclarinet.com
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2011-11-21 23:23
Does it pay better than the $25-40/night the theaters pay up here in DC to the musicians in the pit? Maybe I'll move to Louisville and get rich playing in their well-endowed bankrupt orchestra.
Ya gotta love the music "business". I can make more money flipping burgers at Greasy Mac's.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2011-11-22 03:05
Do not audition for them, period. If we allow orchestra managements to treat their musicians we will all become servants as they were treated in the 18 and 19 century. Have enough respect for our industry and those trying to support their family's by making even a meager living. The symphony orchestra situation in America is in very sad shape, don't contribute to it by making it worse. Support those out of work musicians, they gave into numerous demands. We're not talking about basketball players making millions of dollars here. ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-11-22 03:11
Even when things were chugging along, I believe the typical salary was around $30,000. I'm sure most of them had 'day jobs.' As I said, particularly sad when I think of the tremendous amount of gigs per year amongst all the various entities (ballet, symphony, opera), how incredibly they played and how 'under paid' they were. pure tragedy
.................Paul Aviles
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Author: Dileep Gangolli
Date: 2011-11-22 13:05
I second what Ed P. has said.
This is a very sad situation and any clarinetist or musician with integrity (aside from the threat of career suicide) should stay away from this situation and let those that are tenured members of the LO, with the help of the AFM (and AFL CIO) resolve this as they see fit.
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