 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-10-14 14:51
I would like to inquire about the lengths of Clarinets...
1. Is there a standard measurement for Bb and other keyed Clarinets?
2. If so, what are they?
3. If not, is it the barrel only that makes the measurement vary?
4. Are the mouthpieces counted in the measurement, when measuring?
5. Are there any other measurements on the clarinet that are absolutes?
6. Such as bell widths? Etc?
Thanks.
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2011-10-14 15:02
Elkwoman46 wrote:
> I would like to inquire about the lengths of Clarinets...
>
> 1. Is there a standard measurement for Bb and other keyed
> Clarinets?
Yes and no. Most modern (low pitch) boehm system Bb clarinets will measure ~23.5" from the end of the barrel to the end of the bell when assembled. This is not a hard number as some clarinet use different bore sizes and this will cause the length to vary a bit. An early high pitch clarinet will be about an inch shorter so they are pretty easy to spot.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2011-10-14 17:19
Every maker has their own design and with that, multitudes of different measurements from joint diameters, bore diameters and shapes, barrel, joint and bell lengths and shapes, tonehole diameters and shape, placements, depths, undercutting and tapering, fingerhole chimney heights, speaker tube length, diameter and shape, key heights, positioning and ventings, thumbrest position, pillar heights, key lengths, spring length, gauge and tensions, screw thread sizes and lengths, etc. so no two clarinets from different makers will be the same.
Mouthpieces are also infinitely variable, but the starting point when choosing a mouthpiece is the tip opening and length of lay as that will determine what reed strength is suitable for both them and yourself and also how easy they are to play. A close tip opening and long lay will require harder reeds compared to a wide tip opening with a short lay which work best with softer reeds. Internal dimensions will also affect the playability, tuning and tone colour so it's best to try as many as possible to find the one that suits you best and the same reed that works well on one mouthpiece may not work so well on another.
A good starting point when trying mouthpieces is to try a Vandoren 5RV Lyre.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-10-14 18:45
Thank you every one for getting me square with the world on the measurements...had been wondering about that.
Also, Chris, you said something about the mouthpieces that really caught my attention, and it meets something that I think I have been struggling with, and it just might be the mouthpiece and reed thing!
Years and years ago when I first started on a clarinet and took lessons, I remember so well, that my teacher was a bit surprised because I was doing all the hard stuff easily and the easy stuff hard...I think I was having a much easier time on the higher notes and what he called "the break", for example. And here I am with another instrument (a wooden one no less) years later and realizing that I am having a lot of trouble getting the higher notes, and I truly believe it is the thing about the mouthpiece and reed, I really do. I am not even sure what I had back then, and it might have been an average brand that came from a pawn shop. This is where I mentioned previously that the same teacher sold me one of his own synthetic creations, a reed. But I think the reed probably equated to a 3 or so reed strength, although I probably used some other strength regular reeds.
Well, this instrument went to someone else who had a need many years later, and I did not play for a long while. I say all this, to ask, what are some of the mouthpieces that have a wide opening? And how does the Vandoren B45 rate as far as openings? Is it considered an average width? Here is the thing about it though, I understand that 3.0 or 3.5 is recommended reed for this one, but I don't think I am ready for that right now...although I may have been ready for it a long time ago.
Anyway, I realize that whatever is going on for me right now, I am struggling with higher notes, and I think it might be the very thing Chris brought up. Perhaps too light/thin of a reed for this Vandoren B45 it came with. Any suggestions? Thanks. And what kind of opening is on that Vandoren 5RV Lyre? How does it place?
Thanks ever so much.
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Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-10-14 18:48
Steve, just to be sure, when you speak of "bore", you are referring to the entire length of the inside chamber (tube), yes?
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2011-10-14 19:11
Elkwoman46 wrote:
> Steve, just to be sure, when you speak of "bore", you are
> referring to the entire length of the inside chamber (tube),
> yes?
I am referring to the inside diameter of the clarinet.
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Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-10-14 19:20
Steve, thank you so much!
Do you think that in orchestras and symphonies, that folks are more or less restricted to certain measurements and sizes? Or does it matter?
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2011-10-14 19:37
Elkwoman46 wrote:
> Do you think that in orchestras and symphonies, that folks are
> more or less restricted to certain measurements and sizes? Or
> does it matter?
That's somewhat of a touchy subject. In the US today most clarinetist in orchestras play on instruments with a bore measureing around 14.6mm primarily because that is the bore size of most new professional clarinets. Undoubtedly there are some players using a smaller bore size (i.e Selmer Recital at 14.3mm) and some using larger bore sizes, but they are a minority.
As for whether it matters, it probably shouldn't matter what bore size you play but you will find no shortage of people who will insist otherwise.
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Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-10-14 19:46
Wow, Steve, I sure am delighted to breathe in all this information!
Totally fascinated by it all.
And thanks so much.
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Author: rtmyth
Date: 2011-10-14 20:08
Many years ago, Lee Gibson suggested to me that the new Leblancs may have been improved acoustically by adding about 1mm at the top of the lower section.
richard smith
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2011-10-14 22:45
A mouthpiece with a close tip opening will make the higher notes much easier to produce than a more open one, so a 5RV Lyre with a relatively close tip opening will be much easier for the high notes in comparison to a B45 which has a wider tip opening.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2011-10-15 02:56
I would add to what Chris has said about the effect of mouthpiece facings on the reed strength needed to produce all notes in the clarinet's range comfortably. Closer tips and longer curves tend to allow the use of harder reeds, but there are also resistance effects that result from baffle and chamber shape as well. I have a number of mouthpieces that all have the same facing measurements but give different feelings of resistance to the extent that I need to use as much as a full strength less on some of them than on others.
Karl
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