 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-12 13:47
Good Morning All:
Recently, I began experimenting with both the Legere Signature Series and the Forestone reeds. I have found them both to be greatly improved and more refined over other manufactured reeds of the past.
With that said, I believe that products of this kind may in fact be the future of our art form. What is clear, with a quality manufactured reed there is market share to gain.
I would like to hear from others whom have sampled both, and perhaps switched to one or the other and describe their experiences.
Further, I pose the following questions: What can a player expect is the long term longevity of either of these reeds “hours of playability”? For what period of time can a player expect either reed to hold its original playing characteristics?
Thank you
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-14 22:08)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: William
Date: 2010-02-12 14:32
I am still using a pair of Forestone #4 reeds that I first used during a performance of Peter & the Wolf last May--and they are showing no signs of wearing out. I do alternate between four others for rehearsals, practice sessions and performances--and all are proving to be exqually as durable. For what it is worth, I have found that Legere reeds also seem to last "forever", especially those that I use on my bass clarinet. A durability comparison between the two??--I think that it is a toss up. FWIW, I play orchestral, wind ensemble and jazz--and am using Legere reeds, exclusively, on my bass clarinet and saxophones. I prefer the Forestones for my soprano clarinets--just like the sound better.
Cane--never again!!!!!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-12 15:45
Thank you for your reply,
I’m working right now on Artie Shaw’s solo “Nightmare” and putting the two manufactured reeds to the test. I thought this piece would best exemplify my playing and style. My first impressions are: I’m finding is the Legere tends to allow a little more vibrato, yet hesitates to jump from clarion B to Altissimo F#. I find myself adjusting my embouchure over and over with the Legere. This however is not the case with the Forestone; I find it responds very quickly to registry changes with no embouchure adjustments, and so far less flexible vibrato. However, with more playing time I believe this will be a non-issue.
As of right now I’m leaning heavily towards the Forestone reeds.
One thing for sure, like you. I've purchased my last cane reed.
Please post your thoughts....
Thank you
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-14 22:08)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: William
Date: 2010-02-12 16:27
I will be performing Artie Shaws, Concerto for Clarinet, this summer with out Capitol City Band, and so far, in practice, I've had no problem with the Forestone 4 taking me right up to the final C7 every time. In past performances with cane reeds, that final high note has always been kind of "iffy", but with every one of my current batch of six F's, C7--right on, every time. Good luck with your "nightmare" lol.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: John J. Moses
Date: 2010-02-12 16:32
Hi All;
As many of you know, I have tried & tested the best Forestones and find that they do not work for me. So longevity is not an issue with them.
I have been sent many LEGERE reeds from Canada, and find them to be excellent in all the ways I have previously mentioned in former posts.
The issue of longevity is a newer question, and difficult to answer simply.
I play at least 3-6 hour a day, every day, perhaps more than some of you. My LEGERE reeds on Bb/A Clarinet, Eb Clarinet, Bass Clarinet, and the Saxophones, have lasted an amazing amount of time, but I do "rotate" them. Perhaps a session or two on 1 reed, then the next day or two I use another excellent LEGERE. I have a supply to draw from, so my reeds are lasting longer & longer. That is, months not weeks!
In comparison, the Vandoren & other cane reeds I used for over 40+ years of playing never would have lasted as long or sounded as consistently good as the LEGERE reeds I now play on exclusively!
I remain firmly in the belief that these new synthetic reeds are the reeds of our future as woodwind artists. Use whatever you choose, but do have fun always!
Cheers,
JJM
Légère Artist
Clark W. Fobes Artist
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-12 17:02
After several hours of playing and putting the two reed products in a side by side test today, I’m going with Forestone. In short, for my playing style Forestone has a winning product. I am absolutely and utterly taken back by the flexibility and sound color achievable with these Forestone reeds. That having been said; I just purchased 2 Forestone reeds from their web page.
When placing my order I was pleasantly surprised to find that they are running a special: first time you order from Forestone, if you purchase two or more reeds, you can receive an additional reed free of charge.
Here is the link.
http://forestone-japan.com/eg/order2.html
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-14 22:09)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: William
Date: 2010-02-12 20:11
As I have previously suggested to Lars at Forestone, I think that more clarinetists would be willing to give their (rather expensive) reeds a try if they offered a replacement for reeds too stiff or soft like Guy Legere does. What good is a "three for the price of two" first time buyer option if you really have no idea what strength to order in the first place? Comparitive charts simply do not always work and Guy was a smart enough businessman to realize this and make his reed product attractive to the first time buyer. Legere is the more consumer-friendly product, but--at least, for me and my playing--Forestone (once you find your strength) is the superior reed.
For the record, I am not subsidised in any way by Forestone. I just happen to like them and prefer them over the Legeres.
Post Edited (2010-02-12 21:07)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: John J. Moses
Date: 2010-02-12 20:38
William PLEASE!
I have stated in many of my posts about LEGERE reeds that I am:
A LEGERE artist, and they supply me with their newest products to try out and evaluate. I am not paid for my services, but I DO receive their excellent reeds to try out and keep, if I so choose.
Am I obligated to restate my commitment to LEGERE and their products each time I post?
No offense taken.
JJM
Légère Artist
Clark W. Fobes Artist
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: gigaday
Date: 2010-02-13 13:40
You guys are obviously much more experienced and expert than I - no really! I am just am amateur with a couple of years playing.
I have tried several synthetic reeds and I didn't get on at all with either Forestone or the Legere "classic". My preference is for the Hahn reed:-
http://www.saxalley.com/hahn-synthetic-reed-bb-clarinet.html
There is very little about these on this BB but my opinion is that they have a better sound, feel and dynamics than any of the synthetics that I have tried.
What I would really like to see though is what an experienced (professional) player would think of them.
Has anyone else ever tried them?
Tony
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-13 13:43
Good Morning All;
I wanted to post a follow up to my side by side testing of these fine reeds. Reed strength is always a question when selecting a product and this is my personal comparison thus far:
Forestone--------------------------F3----------F3.25
Legere Signature-------------------3.25--------3.5
Mitchell Lurie Premium-------------4-----------4+
Rico Grand Concert Evolution-------3.5---------3.5+
I have other reeds and strenghts to sample; I will continue to post my results. I hope this is helpful in some small way.
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-14 22:09)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: srattle
Date: 2010-02-13 15:31
gigaday:
The website you posted only seemed to have soprano sax reeds and no clarinet reeds. Are they the same thing? do you just use soprano sax reeds on clarinet?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: William
Date: 2010-02-13 16:21
The heading clearly identifies the pictured reed as "Bb clarinet" although it does look like it might be a soprano sax. While I do know of one rather famous US jazz clarinetist who used soprano sax reeds a few years ago, most of use clarinet reeds--for better or for worse..........
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: gigaday
Date: 2010-02-13 16:43
The company (SaxAlley) is mainly saxes but the link posted is for Bb clarinet.
All the photos are the same, I think - sax or clarinet, my Bb clarinet reed looked just like the picture when it arrived.
Tony
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2010-02-14 00:32
John,
Have you been able to try the new Legere Signature tenor saxophone reed? If so, what are your impressions compared with the standard Legere saxophone reed?
Several are being sent to me for a trial and I'm looking forward to trying them.
Roger
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: rossbu
Date: 2010-02-14 12:42
I've tried and own both - I haven't found them to be at all like cane - for me, the biggest difference is with the high notes - they just sound and feel totally out of character. I did recently have a Behn mouthpiece for trial and with it, the Forestone sounded fine.
Any opinions as to why I'd have such a different reaction than most of you?
thanks,
Burt
ps - my main mouthpiece is the Ridenour Harold Wright model.
bross141@comcast.net
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-14 13:59
Good Morning All,
I read through the growing list of postings and thought about the emerging market for synthetic reeds. In my opinion the key manufactures are: Forestone, Legere, Fibracell, Bari & Hahn. I personally have played all with the exception of the Hahn manufactured reeds. That having been said, I have found the Forestone produces a full range of tone colors and sound quality. In all honesty, if every cane reed played as well; with the same repeatable results I currently achieve from the Forestone, I would not be switching to them.
For me it is time to focus on the artistry of playing and dispense with the nuisances of finding, shaping and adjusting that less than perfect cane reed.
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-14 22:09)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-14 15:21
Good Morning,
In terms of mouthpiece, I'm currently using an ED1 with a tip opening of 1.04 and a Vandoren Optimum ligature. I did some experimentation with the Rovner Dark and MKIII; I was less satisfied with the results.
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-14 22:10)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: William
Date: 2010-02-14 17:16
Regarding mouthpieces, I am using Forestone #4's on both my Chicago Kaspar #14 and my Glenn Bowen customized Woodwind G8 with great results. I am also using a cut down Forestone #3.5 on my Charles Bay custom Eb mouthpiece. They are proving to be mouthpiece "friendly", at least, for me.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: whole note
Date: 2010-02-14 19:15
I'm hoping these debates between Forestone and Legere underscore the fact that both brands are so good that we are now splitting hairs. As with cane reeds, it's now just a matter of personal preference among brands. We are lucky to have these!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-14 20:02
Good Evening All;
Depending on your particular playing style and desired sound colors each offer something different. None the less, I believe that the future for manufactured reeds is at hand and it’s time to invite them in. The desire for better reeds has long been in the making and one only needs to go back to Mr. Robert Willaman’s book “The Clarinet and Clarinet Playing”(1946) where he discusses back then, the search for substitute materials. Mr. Willaman on page 56 goes on to describe his ideas on the issue of substitute materials for reeds; “One of them may someday approach or even surpass natural cane in the important features of tone quality coupled with instant resilience and light weight”. I think we all are in agreement that these new reeds certainly meet those standards. Further, and I just chuckle when I read this page 57; “It is thus possible to play a “a hot lick on a cold stick” with on worry that the reed has crinkled on the tip.” How much time has any of us wasted on getting warmed up, then set it aside, resoak, or money spent on that perfect humidity controlled case: and on and on. Not to mention all the devices for reshaping and refining that less than desirable reed. Mr. Willaman's concluding thought on the topic of substitute materials was “It may offer the best hope of solving reed troubles that now beset all players.” Over half a century has passed sense these words were printed and how true they resonate today in spite of the time that has gone by.
I’m convinced the search for me is over; each of these reeds has something to offer every player.
It is time to focus on the artistry of playing and dispense with the nuisances of finding, shaping and adjusting that less than perfect cane reed.
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-15 20:20)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2010-02-14 20:34
I've mentioned this on the SOTW Forum; but, I cannot help but think it bears repeating here....
It's been my experience that it's problematic to consider a reed without viewing one's set up as a whole (of course, the player is also included).
As an example of this, today I spent more time working with a Morgan 6C alto saxophone mouthpiece that Erik Grifenhaggen recently refaced. Comparing this mouthpiece to another 6C I have (not refaced), it has much more "life" in its sound. With this in mind, the same Legere reed used on the two mouthpieces produces somewhat different results in overall performance. I found that I actually needed to tone down the Erik G refaced mouthpiece by using a Klassik string ligature -- instead of the Optimum that I've been using with Legere reeds on saxophones and bass clarinet -- in order to have the tone color that I want on alto. After letting the Erik 6C and Klassik set up grow on me, I am extremely happy with how Legere reeds are working for me on alto. However, with an Optimum ligature, the set up has a very slight hint of harshness.
This experience reminds me how inter-connected and subtle our set ups can be. With even one thing different, Legere reeds can sound stunningly beautiful or not so good for me. After I fine-tuned the set up on each of my reed instruments I've been perfectly happy with Legere. For me, the time and effort has been worth it as, now, I put on a Legere and I play essentally care-free regardless of the conditions of the performance space.
Roger
Post Edited (2010-02-14 20:44)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: leonardA
Date: 2010-02-15 03:43
I have only been playing for a few years, but I do find the Legere reeds to have equal tone quality to Vandoren cane and they are sturdier, meaning that if I get tired and start to bite they don't give way, so I don't lose tone quality. I am using them more and more.
Leonard
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: John J. Moses
Date: 2010-02-15 15:56
Hi All:
Happy Presidents Day!
My last word (probably not) on the new synthetic reeds is:
1) Find one that works for you, they are not cheap, so take your time with each choice. Again, Légère does offer a return or exchange policy.
2) Try not to go back & forth between your old cane reeds and your new synthetic reed choice. Give the new reed a chance to "break-in" and give yourself a chance to get use to the new "feel" of a synthetic reed.
3) Don't be discouraged at first, these new fine products take time to adjust to, like a new instrument or any new piece of equipment.
4) Synthetic reeds are not for everyone, for various reasons. If you've tried the very fine Légère reeds or Forestone, or whatever, and none work for you, then perhaps cane reeds are still your reeds of choice.
In closing, I personally believe that all of these new synthetic reeds are the reeds of the future, and an attempt to make our playing easier with less hassles. The amount of time I have spent "adjusting" my cane reeds might add up to hundreds of wasted hours taken away from glorious music making & serious practice time. So, if we can find a "great" synthetic reed, and they are out there, we can get on with making beautiful music all over the world...and wouldn't that be nice!
Have a good day, the reed choice is yours,
Disclaimer: I am a Légère Artist & promote their products.
JJM
Légère Artist
Clark W. Fobes Artist
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-15 18:17
Good Afternoon All;
What a wonderful program; Legere offers a return it for refund or free exchange of strength. I wish more manufactures offered such guarantees.
There is the link for terms and conditions:
http://www.legere.com/index.php?page=guarantee
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-21 15:56)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-21 13:27
Hi All;
I just wanted to make an updated posting this morning on my success with Legere Signature Series Reeds. To keep it short, I started playing those LSS 3 ¼ with a Vandoren M15L and all I can say is WOW. Sometimes I’m so surprised how a simple change can make such a huge difference, considering there is only a tip opening .05mm difference between and ED1 and a M15L. To jump right in, I was playing a couple of Artie Shaw tunes and hitting F#6 & G#6 care free. I was able to growl and howl, like never before …..it was out of this world. For the first time in a long time, I was able to concentrate on the art of playing.
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2010-02-21 14:04
Not so, I returned my initial choice of Legere reed to the dealer (Brass'n'Woodwind, Melbourne, Australia). They replaced it with a different strength reed with no hesitation and did not charge a replacement/restocking fee. Go to:
http://www.legere.com/index.php?page=guarantee
to see the Legere policy on this.
Tony F.
Author: CWH (---.dr01.mdtw.ny.frontiernet.net - ISP in Middletown, NY United States)
Date: 2010-02-15 18:17
Good Afternoon All;
Legere's replacement policy:
http://www.legere.com/index.php?page=guarantee
Tony F.
Post Edited (2010-02-21 22:29)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2010-02-21 14:40
CWH,
It's been my experience that when one mouthpiece works beautifully with Legere reeds and another is absolutely terrible, it has more to do with the tip & side rails and facing curve than simply a very slight difference in the size of the tip opening....assuming that in most other ways the mouthpieces are reasonably similar in design. I've especially found the width of the tip rail to often be be a smoking gun; however, it's likely that other factors could have been involved. For whatever reason, I've found Legere to work much better for me with mouthpieces that have a somewhat wider tip rail. I've found Walter Grabner's Kaspar-style mouthpieces to be a good benchmark with Legere.
Roger
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-21 14:59
That's great Brass 'n' Woodwinds exchanged them directly for you. On a personal note, I have found the wonderful people at Legere to be completely committed to the player and willing to assist you in getting the correct reed strength for you (including exchanges). Again, I wish more manufactures were this accommodating and supportive.
For these reasons, I have made the switch to Legere.
The information on their guarantee from their web page:
http://www.legere.com/index.php?page=guarantee
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-21 15:22)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CWH
Date: 2010-02-21 15:07
Roger,
I completely agree, with your assessment of the tip and rails design. When I examined the ED1, the rails are curved inwards (tapered) towards the back; reducing the lay of the table. This however is not the case with the Vandoren M15L. The answer could be as simple “reduction in table size”.
What a fantastic product the Legere Signature Select (LSS) is, I’m completely sold on this is the future.
CWH
Study, Practice, Play and Enjoy.
Post Edited (2010-02-21 15:31)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2010-02-22 09:48
I'm looking forward to trying the new Legere Signature tenor saxophone reeds. Some are on their way to me to trial. I'll post a message after I've given them a good workout.
Roger
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2015-06-28 17:09
Hi All,
I'd be interested in any updates on this topic since the thread is over 4 years old and I am in my 5th month of conversion to Classic Legere' reeds on soprano and bass clarinet. I really love them.
The question on longevity is what I am interested in. While I still use my original #3, now a #3.25 seems to work and interestingly, a newer #3 plays better than my original #3.
For the more long-term users (Forestone or Legere'), how many reeds do you have in your arsenal? Do you detect any significant changes in playability over time?
It is now time for me to begin to switch to Legere' sax reeds as well.
Best regards,
HRL
PS The entire 1st clarinet section of my current concert band (including a couple of orchestra players) use Legere' reeds.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: kilo
Date: 2015-06-28 20:42
When used in rotation they will last a long, long time. I have five tenor reeds (#3 Studio Cut) in my Selmer reed case and two of them are 2 - 3 years old. I've got six soprano clarinet reeds (#3.25 Quebec Cut) with similar longevity. I use two bass clarinet Classic reeds, one #2.5 for pop gigs and a #3.25 for concert band. They must be close to a year old, maybe older. I've discarded a few really old ones — they seem to get stuffy and lifeless, develop cracks, or "fur" up on the sides. I'm extrapolating and thinking they may have had the equivalent of 6 months steady, daily playing.
I have noticed some inconsistency in Legeres which I'm at a loss to explain but if I get one that's a bit "different" it still goes into rotation — I just make sure to mark it as such.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2015-06-29 16:18
Kilo,
Just the info I needed. I have noticed the "stuffy and lifeless" in one of my #3 clarinet reeds. Yes, rotation and marking so that I know which reed is which.
I may mess around with the Studio and Quebec cuts as well.
Great intel. Thanks.
HRL
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: TomS
Date: 2015-06-29 22:33
I get considerable variance in Legere reeds, but I still love them and use them.
For example, just bought a pair of Signature 2.75 and they are probably 1/8 strength apart from each other, and they both sound different as well. I've also found that the Signatures run about 1/2 harder than advertised in respect to the Classic cut. In other words, I have to use a 2.75 Signature to match a 3.0 Classic. Legere suggests using a 3.25 Signature to match a 3.0 Classic ...
The Signatures definitely have better articulation than the Classic Legere and most cane reeds. But, they are fussier and harder to find a MP that works OK. The Reserve X5 works pretty well with the Signatures, for example. Not as well with Vandoren, but I like the the feel, resistance and core sound of the VD better.
The Signatures seem to have some funny qualities, like you have to keep encouraging them to vibrate, something like just "on the edge" of not speaking ... hard to explain. You have to keep after them. The Classic seem easier, friendlier, kinder/gentler.
I rotate, and keep a new reed around as a reference. When they start mushing out, I mark them and set them aside. They may return some or work OK with another MP.
Tom
Post Edited (2015-06-29 22:41)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
