 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ned
Date: 2009-10-28 09:10
Notwithstanding my comments regarding ''The Benny Goodman Story'', I watched TGMS the other night, with I'm happy to say, less bemusement than TBGS.
I guess the largest part of the plot revolved around GM and his search for ''the sound'', which was hammered relentlessly throughout the course of the film. It was far more acceptable than the depiction of the sucking up (presumably real?) practised by a young BG and the kowtowing (unreal, in my view) by jazz elders to BG (enough said).
To my point:
The story line reveals that GM's lead trumpet had to bow out after banging his chops on his music stand. This left GM in a quandry, because who could play lead?
He hit upon the idea of appointing a clarinet to play the lead - nice touch Glenn - I guess he didn't have a 2nd trumpet?
Anyway, at this point GM then suddenly hears ''his sound''. It's a nice romantic idea, perfect for the plot of the film.
Does anyone know if this story is true/ somewhat true/ complete bollocks?
I'd like to think it was true, because having a clarinet play the trumpet part certainly is different, and, whilst I have few recordings of the band, the rehearsal number in the film certainly seemed to have a discernible voicing.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2009-10-28 11:55
From the book "Glenn Miller and His Orchestra" by George T Simon, 1974 Da Capo Press -
Page 120:
"...It was a sound he had uncovered purely by accident during his Ray Noble days and had later revived briefly to give (Irving) Fazola something to do. "Peewee Erwin, now playing trumpet for Tommy Dorsey, was with us in the Noble band", Glenn once told me during a Metronome interview. "At the time, Peewee had a mania for playing high parts; he always asked me to give him stuff written way up on his horn. Sometimes I'd write things for him with the saxes underneath."
"...There came a day when Peewee left and a trumpeter who couldn't hit those high notes replaced him. In desperation we assigned those Bb trumpet parts to Johnny Mince, now also with Tommy Dorsey, on Bb clarinet, and doubled the clarinet lead with Danny D'Andrea, an octave lower on tenor sax. That's how the clarinet lead sound, which people call 'our style' started..."
A second reference which basically says the same and makes referernce to the Hollywood treatment of the clarinet story:
http://petekellysblog.blogspot.com/2009/02/glenn-miller-story1954.html
...GBK
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2009-10-28 16:11
Just ran through a TiVo of "the big band years" on PBS. What great stuff
And, in the GM Orch, they sat the 'bones in front of the saxes --probably allowed his reed men to be able to hear for more of their lives.
Bob Phillips
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2009-10-28 16:36
I do not think that Glenn Miller was the first to have a clarinet lead over saxes. Rather, I think that honor goes to Duke Ellington. However, Ellington had a completely different musical style and used different arranging techniques from Miller.
A big part of the Miller sound was using clarinet lead over saxes in tight 4-part harmony (with the melody doubled an octave lower by the 2nd tenor, and the baritone sax switching to alto) and most often on ballads. The saxes played in their high range -- thus, the need for the bari player to switch to alto in order to have clarinet, 2 altos, and 2 tenors. The use of the clarinet lead with Miller's voicing on slow ballads had an effect of the "Miller sound" being suspended in the air. It was very effective.
Ellington, on the other hand, often used clarinet lead in spread harmonic voicings that were more dissonant. The spread voicings enabled the Ellington sax section to play in more of a normal range -- different from Miller's saxes. This enabled Harry Carney's baritone sax to be used -- which was an essential part of the Ellington band's sound. Also, Ellington tended to use clarinet lead on faster tempo tunes. Finally, while Miller normally used a strictly vertical method of harmonizing his reed section, Ellington sometimes used horizontal line writing for having contrary motion to expand and contract the top-to-bottom width of his voicings. When Billy Strayhorn teamed up with Ellington, he used clarinet lead in truly masterful ways.
Roger
Post Edited (2009-10-28 16:45)
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2009-10-29 01:18
I don't know if the story is true or not but I know most big band sounds came from experimenting over time. One didn't just wake up one day and say, gee if the clarinet played this and the sax played that I'd have the sound I'm looking for. They would experiment with different arrangements and instrumentations based on their experiences and maybe by need in a case like this. It makes a great story. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: ned
Date: 2009-10-30 01:55
Thanks folks,
I'll read all your replies in detail shortly.
ned
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