 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Brendan Martin
Date: 2009-08-15 07:31
Hi and thanks for reading.
When I am going from Middle C# using my right pinky to B natural on my left I find i get a very slight pause in the sound and a feeling of the mechanism "jarring" however, if I have my left hand pinky on the B natural key while I play the C# and then just take my finger off the C# key the B plays without any issues.
My question is, should I always look to put my left pinky down on B when i play C# or is there an issue with the horn that needed looking at (its still in guarentee so I can send it back if needed)
Phew! I hope that makes sense.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-08-15 08:34
Close the B just before releasing the C# and you'll get a much smoother transition.
The only clarinets I know of that have an articulated F#/C# key (like the articulated low C# on oboes and saxes) were the Selmer full Mazzeo systems, so you could keep the F#/C# key held down and then closing the E/B key would automatically close the F#/C# pad with it. There may have been others with it fitted.
Most simple/Albert systems and all modern German/Oehlers have the 'Patent C#' which means closing the (LH) E/B key on its own will give F#/C# - then add the (RH) F/C key for the E/B. You have to close both LH and RH keys together for the E/B.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2009-08-15 08:37
If there is a small leak in the C# key, the B won't sound. That can happen if you play the B while the C# key is very slightly still open. You can hear/feel this by playing B, and then pressing the C# key very slightly, not enough to play the C# note, but just enough to raise the key a bit.
There are a few reasons this can happen.
1. When you leave C# and press B, moving both fingers together slightly interupts your coordination, causing the situation I described to happen. Or possibly (though less likely) this coordination causes you to lift another finger for a moment (for example from the third right hand ring key).
2. The C# pad is not perfectly aligned over the tone hole, for example, hitting at the back first. This means the C# closes, hits the back first, still leaks slightly, and then in "slow motion" (from the resistance of the pad) closes fully.
Or a combination of these two options.
This assumes you mean the note "chokes" as opposed to, for example, a slight out of tune (if pressing B too early) or just another note between them (D, when releasing C# too early).
Post Edited (2009-08-15 11:11)
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Author: Bob Barnhart ★2017
Date: 2009-08-15 15:51
I had a (perhaps) similar issue with my Yamaha CSG A clarinet in which there seemed to be an interruption of the sound when transitioning between the B-C# keys, particularly in faster passages. If I did the transition slowly, even keeping the B key down or depressing it early (which sounds fine on the CSG), the problem was less noticeable.
In my case, I felt that the spring tension on the C# pad was too low, and once I had this increased a bit, the problem went away. I think the acoustic "burble" was actually caused by the pad "bouncing" on the C#-B transition, preventing it from truly sealing. Once the spring tension was sufficient, it no longer bounced and the problem went away.
I hope this helps.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-08-15 18:32
Getting the F#/C# spring balanced well on Buffet clarinets is a pain due to how the spring is mounted - too light and it'll bounce, too heavy and it'll feel sluggish.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2009-08-16 01:34
"Getting the F#/C# spring balanced well on Buffet clarinets is a pain due to how the spring is mounted "
Also because it is too short for its diameter, which makes the finger force needed increase too much during the travel, which the player interprets as sluggishness.
"When I am going from Middle C# using my right pinky to B natural on my left I find i get a very slight pause in the sound and a feeling of the mechanism "jarring""
Other possibilities:
1. The F/C pad &/or the E/B pad are not sealing easily with light finger pressure. You may be altering your finger pressure slightly with the different fingering configurations you describe. It is extremely common for these pads to be closing at the "back" before they seal at the "front", This can be because of pad thickness, the way they are installed, &/or play in the pivots. The pause in the sound occurs before you press your left finger a little harder to get a full seal.
2. Take a look at where the left low note levers connect with the right low note keys. Sometimes, when the F#/C# is travelling up while the E/B is travelling down, the linkage arms of the keys rub against each other. Or the linkage pins rub against each other. Or he silencing material in the linkage rubs against the other key.
3. For pin type linkages between these levers and keys: Because the linkage parts both travel around arcs, the pin on a lever needs to move slightly across the hole in the key during the travel of the key and lever. If there is not enough space for this to happen, or if the pin is not correctly aligned with the centre of the hole, then a feeling of binding occurs during the travel of the parts. Usually, you can visually check for what is actually happening only if you remove the silencing material and then operate the key/lever system.
4. "When I am going from Middle C# using my right pinky to B natural on my left I find i get a ... feeling of the mechanism "jarring""
There will of course always be a slight "clonk", because as you lift the F#/C# key, the crowsfoot on the F/C key will lift. Before this crowsfoot rises to reach the "touchpiece" of the E/B key, you press the E/B key down, so there is a slight "clonk" as the E/B touchpiece hits the crowsfoot.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2009-08-16 16:13
Doesn't this also bring up the "cross fingering" question ?. I usually try to be sure that both are as equally accessible as possible, so decision can be made on "note sequence " as well as atriculation . Comments on a Clar. 101 question for our "newbies" . Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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