 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: jnc8
Date: 2009-08-08 00:53
Hey all ... I am a college student and I am trying to find a new ligature for my mouthpiece (Vandoren M13Lyre). I am using my teacher's old model of a Rovner Dark which is not made the same anymore. Does anyone know anything about Bonade, Gigliotti, Luyben, or Vandoren ligatures (other than Optimum)? I used an Optimum ligature but I got too bright of a sound with it. Any help on the issue would be welcome, along with any personal experiences you may have had with the ligatures. Which ones should I look into?
Best,
Jeff
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Author: mrn
Date: 2009-08-08 01:10
I've used the Bonade and Gigliotti ligatures. My complaint about the Bonades is that it's sometimes hard to get them to fit on larger mouthpieces (like the Gigliotti mouthpiece I used to play on), and when you do get them to fit, they have a tendency to scratch up the mouthpiece. My complaint about the Gigliottis is that you have to be very careful not to overtighten the screws, because they snap very easily.
I used to use the neoprene rubber Rovner Dark. I now have one of the new fabric kinds (it's a Mark III, not a Dark, though). It works just as well as my old one, if not better.
I think conventional wisdom says that the Bonade and Gigliotti ligs will brighten your sound but may make articulation a little easier. (Someone please correct me if I'm wrong about this.) You really have to try them yourself, though, to see what works best for you.
Post Edited (2009-08-08 01:58)
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2009-08-08 02:02
In general (my personal thoughts), I find that ligatures that have "ribs" or something similar to hold the reed on and are not made of cloth will have a brighter sound, with easier articulation. Fabric or leather ligatures that cover a larger area of the butt of the reed tend to have a more covered (darker?) sound while sacrificing some of that tonguing position.
I like the bonade, but it doesn't fit all mouthpieces. I've snapped more than my share of gigliotti screws, and plastic screws with plastic threads would be prone to strip easier. I don't like the luybens. Just doesn't seem to work with me. I had a vandoren string lig which worked pretty well, but I needed something more secure on the mouthpiece. The optimum (IMO) is overpriced and not worth the $$$.
It's all about the compromise for playing characteristics/cost/ease of use for me. Myself, I have an eddie daniels ligature. A little pricey, sure (although no optimum), and I lost the plates almost as soon as I got it, but I use the metal contacts when I have a reed that sounds a little stuffy, and I use the leather contacts with the reed sounds too bright or edgy. And one screw design makes it easy on/off.
If I had to have only one though, and couldn't afford/didn't want to spend more than 20 bucks or so, I'd own a rovner dark (although that Rovner Evo-5 looks intriguing as you can reverse the ligature and put the metal contacts on the reed.....similar to an eddie daniels at a lesser price....)
Just my opinions, and you'll find plenty of opinions on this board, but my vote is to spend the $$$ on an eddie daniels lig. Or check out the Evo 5. It looks very intriguing and I intend to try it out next year (yea christmas present to me!)
Alexi
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2009-08-08 02:02
Check Rovner's website, Rovnerproducts.com, he still makes the dark model and several others that are very good. Don't give up on his. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Old Geezer
Date: 2009-08-08 15:36
All of the best selling ligatures are OK. All of that stuff about how this one makes your tone brighter, this one is best for tonguing ,etc. is fantasy. The best jazz clarinetist I ever heard used a big old rubber band.
One thing that is not fantasy is..."Practice makes perfect." Follow those short and simple words and someday people will say of you; "He plays so well, maybe it's the ligature!"
Clarinet Redux
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Author: leonardA
Date: 2009-08-08 15:46
I have a Luyben that I like a lot. I have good tone, and I thiink the plastic luyben is a good compromise between metal and cloth. It's built like a traditional metal lig, but the plastic is softer, which I beieve allows the reed to vibrate more freely. I have also sued the bonade inverted (metal) which was good also. and may have more prjection than the Luyben because the metal may give the sound a little more ping. They are so inexpensive, that you might buy one of each and switch around for different situations.
Leonard
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Author: BobD
Date: 2009-08-08 15:46
The Rovner Ed Daniels is my "regular" but I also use the Optimum occasionally.
In my experience the Luybens are tight when new but loosen up with use and I have had the metal screws strip out the plastic threads. But you can buy more than a few Luybens for the price of the expensive ones.
Bob Draznik
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2009-08-08 19:03
I pretty much reflect Old Geezer's description, BUT having tried and am now using all 3 ligs, I seem to prefer the Gigliotti to the others, partic. when I go searching for "dark". I believe that the Luyben is the least expensive. but like all plastics, it can be ruined by over-tightening. A "side note" , having read that B G often? used a standard 2 screw metal, turned some 80-90 degrees [as rec'd by Kell !!] , so that it holds the reed by 2 parallel horizontal bars, like the M Lurie lig I prefer on Bass cl mps. Keep trying, the most secure one IMHO is the Bonade. Gig's patent # is 3,410,170 . Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: pewd
Date: 2009-08-08 20:23
You can try out a Luyben for very little $ - less than $15 the last time I looked. They are excellent ligatures. I played one for over 20 years before it finally broke.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2009-08-08 22:43
The Gigliotti Ligs are not designed to be tight at all - just until it feels that it hits the end of the open thread, then slightly more but not more than that and the reed won't move.
It will practically never strip, slip, nor break if you use it like that (how Gigliotti said it was supposed to be used).
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2009-08-09 17:00
Hi,
My #1 is a Gigliotti had I have "customized" with a Dremel (removed the center of the two ribs that contact the reed leaving just the ends "ala-Portnoy ligature"). I have a couple of great Mitchell Luries and still have my 1970s Luyben. All get rotation.
I have never broken a ligature screen. Blumgerg has it right "not designed to be tight."
My sensibilities do not allow me to spend more that a few bucks on a ligature. Also, I've never had any complaints about my Leblanc L200, Selmer 9*, or B45 with the chip in the tip that I got off a junker clarinet.
One does not have to spend a lot of $s to have very good equipment.
HRL
PS I still shot in the 80s with a demo set of Tommy Armour T100 irons ($250) and a couple of old Big Bertha woods.
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Author: Neal Raskin
Date: 2009-08-09 22:06
For me and my M13 Lyre mp, I use #3 Trad. Vandorens and the Rover Mark III ligature.
Works great and sounds fantastic.
www.youtube.com/nmraskin
www.musicedforall.com
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2009-08-10 03:22
The Optimum is a great lig. Try putting some material...perhaps felt to dampen the tone a bit. Glue it in. Alternate material....Rovner material or leather.
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: ABerry
Date: 2009-08-12 20:07
Jeff,
Vandoren also makes a leather version of the Optimum, they also make a great string ligature...the Klassic.
Allan
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Author: CK
Date: 2009-08-13 01:57
Try the Spriggs Ligature it is the most responsive ligature I have used
Also Phil Muncy has a good Bonade ligature with the center cut out.
Prof. of Clarinet Broward College
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Author: Rob Vitale
Date: 2009-08-13 04:24
Yes as CK said, the spriggs ligature is a really nice one. I want one but I can't seem to make enough bread to buy one. My teacher and friends have used them with lots of success. Although they all seem to agree that they play best after they have been stepped on at least once, then bent back to shape... Go Fig?
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Author: graham
Date: 2009-08-13 06:40
Old Geezer (and Don)
The objective differences between ligatures used for a given set up may be minor from the perspective of the audience. But the subjective differences for the player are considerable. Perhaps they are less considerable the truer the mouthpiece used, but then that opens up a bigger debate still about what is desirable in a mouthpiece. The idea that ligatures make little discernable difference to the response of your set up seems to me to be cloud cookoo land. Different ligatures make a big difference.
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2009-08-13 10:05
I'm sticking with my recommendation to alter what you have. It's like buying a suit with pant legs that are too long. You try shortening the pant legs or stretching your legs before buying a whole new suit. I will take up my own advice and try putting some material on the optimum. Your original point I'm assuming is the optimum is too bright or not warm enough. I'll get back to you on this. All the best.
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2009-08-13 17:59
What HE said ^ about the fabric on the ligature you already have if you're trying to save up some dough.
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Author: bassclarinet101 ★2017
Date: 2009-08-15 03:06
I was at a lesson with Walter Grabner where we were going to try a bunch of different ligatures (my mouthpiece was a Chicago and the reeds were Vandoren 56s (Strength 4) the one I found opened my sound up more without sacrificing the darker tone I prefer (which I prefer almost to an extreme for fair warning) was the Olegature. Not a fabric, but it still didn't brighten the sound as much over what I had with the Rovner initially. Another mouthpiece that was a close second was the BG Revelation, if you're curious. I don't remember the others I tested though.
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