 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: golfnclarinet
Date: 2009-07-09 17:17
I'm wondering there is tonal change or anything when I pull my barrel out to tune. I noticed little bit of volume loss but not quite sure.
Thanks.
Post Edited (2009-07-09 17:18)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-07-09 17:39
Use plastic tuning rings between the lower barrel socket and top joint tenon to take up the gap left between the tenon and socket when the barrel is pulled out.
You can find the correct thickness tuning ring by pulling the barrel out to where you want it to be, and then using the tuning rings as a feeler gauge in the gap between the socket ring and top joint shoulder, and use the one that's the best fit.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: aero145
Date: 2009-07-09 17:40
Yes, there is a tonal change. That’s why people have come up with things like these:
http://www.paulus-schuler.de/
I know the guys that make these, but I haven’t tried them, and I am by no means advertising their stuff. I just wanted to come this into discussion here somehow (please delete if inappropriate!) because I find this discussion-worthy stuff.
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Author: William
Date: 2009-07-10 15:09
I've never noticed any change in tone quality or volume related to pulling the barrel, mouthpiece or middle joints for tuning--as long as you keep your embouchure the same after the pull. FWIW, I usually pull the mpc rather than the barrel--no accoustical reason, just seems easier. At least two clarnet accousticians--clarinet designers and makers, not shoppe repair persons--have told me that the gap left when pulling joints is of no accoustical consequense to the clarinets tonal performance. But the gap has always been controversial and many choose to use tuning rings or longer barrels to avoid them. Whatever works for you, I guess........
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Author: Grabnerwg
Date: 2009-07-10 20:27
The gap left inside the barrel tenon socket when pulling out for tuning purposes will cause intonation changes, especially in the throat tones. This can be either a good thing or a bad thing. If your throat tones tend to go sharp, this can actually be beneficial. Usually it is a problem.
Anyway, that's the reason for using tuning rings.
I find tuning rings fussy things to work with in rehearsals and concerts. If I am pulling out one millimeter or more, I prefer to use a longer barrel.
Walter Grabner
www.clarinetxpress.com
New Buffet Clarinets
World Class Mouthpieces
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2009-07-10 22:01
A couple of thoughts/reactions:
1. I don't notice a change in timbre unless I'm pulled very far out. You would expect to hear some difference in tone character as the pitch becomes audibly lower. For the slight changes you need to make to tune a clarinet that is normally in tune to a tuning pitch that is reasonably close to what is normal in your area shouldn't make a significant difference.
2. Keep in mind that most clarinets are designed so that the normal position of the barrel it is meant to use is pulled out slightly - otherwise you'd have no flexibility upward.
3. I personally use tuning rings - sometimes. But the problem with them is that you need to close the barrel firmly against the ring once you've picked the best one for your need. If you leave it loose in the joint, it could vibrate and cause annoying side-effects. So the adjustment is no longer a continuous one but can only be made in discrete steps that correspond to the thicknesses of the tuning rings.
4. The same disadvantage applies to the ratchet-adjusting barrels I've seen - you have to move to the nearest position to the one you need and then make any additional adjustment by other means.
Enough for now. A little more in another post.
Karl
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2009-07-10 23:52
I agree with Walter, if you always have to pull out more than one mm you should be using a longer barrel. I don't notice any tonal change if I have to pull out one or two mm but If I had to consistently pull out more than one I would get a longer barrel. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2009-07-11 00:04
Ditto to what Walter and Ed stated.
Perhaps not so critical in a big tutti part, but if it is exposed, add the tuning ring (I keep them loose under a barrel compartment or mouthpiece space) in my case, or I switch barrels.
There are some people who can actually notice the sound change that results from a gap. I believe David Weber was able to tell a student whether or not the tuning ring was in place....without looking.
I personally favor the delrin tuning rings over metal.
Also....and here is a little trick....cut a small notch on the circumference of the ring, enough to be able to pry it out with a small hooked tool (think paperclip)...otherwise they sometimes get stuck.
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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Author: huff n' puff
Date: 2009-07-11 10:55
Hi, all......... normally, I just bash on regardless, as long as the tuning is reasonable and copeable with- but one aspect of this has me wondering.
Lengthening the bore lowers the pitch of the clarinet, but widening the bore raises the pitch, and this is effectively what happens when the barrel is withdrawn without using rings. This makes me think that the two things are working against each other, and rings should be the answer.
Has anyone had enough time to waste to try to find an answer to this?
Interested to hear....... H n' P.
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2009-07-11 19:01
I think the other way....putting rings in brings the pitch up and hence you have to pull out even more. I don't experience any harm in pulling out 2-3 mm with my barrel... Beyond that I might try tuning rings.
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: Grabnerwg
Date: 2009-07-14 22:08
"Lengthening the bore lowers the pitch of the clarinet, but widening the bore raises the pitch, and this is effectively what happens when the barrel is withdrawn without using rings.""
There is nothing about pulling out at the barrel (or the mouthpiece) that would act to raise the pitch. Lengthening the bore and widening it at any point can only lower the pitch.
One of the problems of "pulling" out, is that you are making an adjustment at only one place, therefore altering the notes near that area more proportionally than the notes that vent farther away from that spot. However, it is one of the few easy ways we have of lowering pitch when we are too high.
The biggest problem in "pulling out" is that it makes that sudden enlargement in the bore, making the wall of the tenon socket effectively part of the bore, Hence tuning rings or the use of longer barrels.
Walter Grabner
www.clarinetxpress.com
World Class Mouthpieces
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2009-07-15 04:13
"widening it [the bore] at any point can only lower the pitch"
If that's true, why does running a shoelace down the bore of a clarinet lower the instrument's pitch throughout?
Best regards,
jnk
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