 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Ashley91489
Date: 2009-03-01 00:48
From what I've heard in my studio, these are some of the best mouthpieces out there. How are they compared to Vandoren's, which seem to be the standard professional mouthpieces? I'm currently using an M30, V12 3.5 reeds, Rovner Eddie Daniels, and Buffet R-13.
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Author: NBeaty
Date: 2009-03-01 01:11
Ashley,
If your studio seems to prefer them, perhaps some of them have Hawkins mouthpieces that you could try?
They are generally more resistant and less flexible than the M30. I've only tried a few, but have heard many players play them. Most gave too much back pressure for my taste.
-Nathan
(Disclaimer: I play a Vandoren)
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2009-03-01 03:18
Nathan has definitely made a great suggestion!
I would add that you can find friendly advice in this area, but since no one can tell you what you will experience the only real option that you have is to try for yourself.
I have only ever tried one Hawkins mouthpiece, back when I first started playing E flat clarinet. I preferred at that time a Vandoren mouthpiece. Now that I'm a better player, things might be different.
I also do not consider Vandoren to be the "professional standard" by any means.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: awm34
Date: 2009-03-01 12:02
I've been playing a Hawkins "B" for about three years. My teacher was astonished at the improvement in my sound the moment she heard it (unannounced).
I'd been playing a B45 and then a R13 Lyre up until then.
I'm now 74 and have been playing for 6+ years. Work fairly hard at it (one hour a day, typically) but I'm certainly not gifted.
Alan Messer
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2009-03-01 14:22
I have an M30 and a hawkins B. I much prefer the Hawkins B. Every richard hawkins mouthpiece I've tried (including the few I've sent to him to have refaced) have been great. I give it a thumbs up. Is it what I'm using CURRENTLY? No. Do I still have the Richard Hawkins B model currently and keep it as a backup? Yes. And I haven't found many mouthpieces that can touch it as far as playability.
Alexi
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Author: MBrad
Date: 2009-03-01 15:06
I became less fond of Zinner blanks after switching to a Vandoren M30. The resistance I recall being somewhat similar, though I was using harder reeds on the Hawkins than I am now. It was more difficult to pop out high notes clearly, and it had less "push" in it before the sound became distorted. Try as many as you can as they are quite variable. A friend of mine (a former student of Hawkins) had a newer model and was able to achieve a remarkably beautiful, sweet, lyrical tone with it.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2009-03-01 23:43
James said, I also do not consider Vandoren to be the "professional standard" by any means. I can't remember many of the names but I've heard that many professionals in major orchestras use Vandoren MPs. I think your statement is wrong because I've heard many players sound very nice on them. It all depends on the player. There are signature MPs on the market that I really dislike, can't get a decent sound on at all but I know fine players that use them and sound very good. That doesn't mean the mouthpiece is not good it means I don't like them.
Ashley, There's the right mouthpiece for every person. I've heard some very good sounds on a Hawkins, and I've heard some that I disliked. It depends on the player. I always stock at least one of his MPs that I've picked out of several for my students to try. Some sound good on it, some sound terrible. I suggest you try a few with several different reeds to determine if it not only sounds better than what you're using now but has the articulation and general feeling that you're comfortable with. That is one of the reasons you need to try it with several different reeds. ESP www.peabody.jhu.edu/457
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Author: NBeaty
Date: 2009-03-02 02:18
Just for the record, there are a number of players in major orchestras that play Vandoren mouthpieces. My teacher, of the Montreal symphony, plays an M30. Greg Raden of the Dallas symphony has used an M14 off and on. Illya Shterenburg won the San Antonio Symphony job on an M13 lyre, and played it for several years with the symphony. Michell Estrin, professor at University of Florida plays vandoren and subs with NYP.
I know there are many more to add to that list, those are just the ones I know off the top of my head. I've personally played many vandorens that sounded\tuned better than many handcrafted zinner blank mouthpieces (as well as Kaspars and others). I've also tried quite a few handcrafted and vintage mouthpieces that play better than many vandorens.
I think we are sometimes too quick to write off Vandoren mouthpieces as a cheap and generic. If you find a good one (which isn't that hard to do if you try 3 or 4) it can sound as good or better than many mouthpieces costing much more.
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2009-03-02 03:01
So how does one define "professional standard"? I doubt that Vandoren has any majority of clarinetists in comparison to another mouthpiece maker. And everyone has crafted a real dog here and there!
I'm certain that any of those pros who use Vandorens could also use a "boutique" dealers' mouthpiece to same result, and vice-verse. The distinguishing characteristic of these individuals is that their sound concept is certain...they would sound like themselves on ANY mouthpiece. They choose Vandoren (or something else) because the facility it allows them to express themselves freely.
There are many clarinetists who are at the mercy of their equipment, without any idea of how to put THEIR sound INTO the instrument. Those folks are the ones that are always chasing the unicorn.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2009-03-02 14:56
James asked, "So how does one define "professional standard"? A professional standard mouthpiece is one that several professionals find has a high enough quality to be used my professionals as proven by the post that NBeaty wrote. You don't hear of professionals using a Golden Tone MP because it is not a professional standard mouthpiece. ESP
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2009-03-02 16:42
Hi Ed,
I see your point, and perhaps I should have phrased my statement differently. Perhaps I inferred too much from the original posters comments! Having re-read them I believe that I have found my error:
I read that there was the presumption that Vandorens were THE professional standard. I agree with you (Ed, NBeaty) that Vandoren is well represented in professional ensembles.
My statements above oppose the idea that Vandoren is THE professional standard, which would imply that all mouthpieces be judged against them. That assertion was not made in this conversation.
Sorry everyone for muddying the waters!
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2009-03-02 19:48
Ashley,
BTW, I too use Rovner Eddie Daniels and Vandoren V12 3.5 reeds. On the M30 I find that I like reeds SLIGHTLY softer. 3.0 vandorens or 3.5s shaved down a bit as compared to the richard hawkins (which seem comfortable at 3.5 vandorens).
Just letting you know. So if you try a Hawkins, make sure to match a good reed to it as the size you are currently using may not necessarily be the best match. What I usually do is adjust a reed each to be VERY good on that particular mouthpiece and THEN compare them side by side. Instead of comparing both mouthpieces with a reed that might just play better on one than the other.
Alexi
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Author: weberfan
Date: 2009-03-02 21:35
The Hawkins mouthpieces sound terrific. I've read through archived posts, looking for statistical comparisons with, say, Vandoren mouthpieces like the M13, M15 or M30. Does anyone know how the Hawkins models stack up? Facing length? Close or open tip, etc.?
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Author: reprise
Date: 2009-03-03 02:07
I switched to a Hawkins this fall and love it. I'm playing with the Eddie Daniels Rovner and Vandoren V12 3.5 reeds. I'm having an easier time with the altissimo register since changing, and also like how my tone sounds. One of the things Richard says about his mouthpieces is that they are designed with an eye toward encouraging a good embouchure -- I've found this to be the case. It has made it really difficult for me to get lazy -- which I appreciate.
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Author: 68fordfalcon
Date: 2009-03-03 15:32
Regarding the original question, I believe Richard's mouthpieces to be worth the price. As far as the issue of resistance is concerned, if you order 3 or 4 to try, you will most likely receive mouthpieces of varying resistance and flexibility. I am partial to Hawkins mouthpieces, but I think some Vandorens are nice too. I would say there are certain qualities about both that are admirable and worth investigation. I should mention that there are certain qualities to the Hawkins mouthpieces that I have used that I have not been able to achieve on Vandorens.
Campbell MacDonald
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Author: Iceland clarinet
Date: 2009-03-03 15:57
Well what I think is: Endorse what you like,pay the price for that gear if you can afford it and play happy the clarinet. Since we had many discussing on Backun mouthpiece and if they are worth the price well I have to say is that obviously someone think that because they are for sale and have been for couple of years. It's all matter availability and demand. I mean why do you think Grabner,Ridenour,Behn and Smith among others have different prices on the same Zinner blank based mouthpieces ?
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Author: Tode
Date: 2009-03-05 03:47
I play on the Hawkins R and love it! It has a beautiful, focused tone and the high notes are particularly in tune and speak easily. I tried two B's and two R's and one of the R's was less resistant but less focused. I used to be a big M15 fan and found many similarities between the two mouthpieces.
I used to use a Rovner Eddie Daniels ligature (noticed that Ashley91489 was playing on that) but have switched back to the inverted Bonade. Both worked well with the mouthpiece.
I personally think it's only worth the price if you find one you like. Otherwise, there are plenty other options around.
What works for some, may or may not work for you!
~Sarah Todenhoft~
Geaux Tigers!
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Author: Tode
Date: 2009-03-06 02:29
Traditional 3 1/2's. I used to play on 4's for a while but the ended up being too hard for me.
~Sarah Todenhoft~
Geaux Tigers!
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2016-03-12 23:18
A very good clarinetist gave me a Hawkins R on a zinner blank and it is very good. In fact it is very easy to play and has a superb tone in the throat area which is very hard to get on most mouthpieces. So kudos go out to Mr. Hawkins as his work is superb.
David Dow
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2016-03-15 02:24
I've known Richard a long time. Since he was 18 or 19 I think. He surely knows his craft. The mouthpieces are worth the price, if you find one that fits you. He's a good guy and a really good player. As a player he may be underrated but he has the skills to sit principal pretty much in any symphony in the country. I think he primarily uses Zinner blanks. I haven't taked to him lately, but I heard he may be using another blank too. I'm not positive about this.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: TomS
Date: 2016-03-16 04:03
I owned and played a pair of Eddie Daniel MPs back in the 1990s (made by Hawkins with Zinner blanks) ... there was somewhat different playing between the two. I think I was using V12s at the time. I broke the best one and gave the other away. They had redeeming features, to be sure. This was not long after Richard started his craft and I suspect he has gotten much better and consistent with his facing and finishing work.
Really super nice guy, humble and friendly. His "standard" MP that he has been making since 1994 is only $185.00, which is a bargain. I think the facing was based on a fairly close one that Everet Matson used often ... and apparently touchy to replicate. Very responsive. He was also refacing some Gigliotti MPs for the principal clarinetist of a local orchestra that I played in for 9 years.
Good guy to work with!
Tom
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Author: Agomongo
Date: 2016-03-17 07:58
I LOVE the Hawkins mouthpiece. Especially worth the price since I got it for free, haha, but seriously it is a great mouthpiece, IMHO. Great tone, intonation, and feel. Like what Mr. Bernardo said he is a great person too.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2016-03-19 17:35
Go to iTunes and download Professor Hawkins' album and you will be very impressed with the wonder agility and sweetness of timbre (with a warm covering at times) that he achieves. These pieces are not for the traditional fan ... very modern and abstract. But these really showcases what Richard can do.
I'd like more recordings ...!
And, Legere fans, his MPs should work with those reeds very well.
Tom
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