 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: chlpuduk
Date: 2008-08-28 03:44
Hi, all.
I am having an intonation problem for my throat Bb on my A clarinet. Tuning is generally good for most of notes, however, this Bb is seriously flat. Adjusting my embouchure, tongue position, etc, hardly fix the problem.
I've tried replacing thumb tube on A clarinet to the one on the Bb clarinet, and it kind of worked for the throat Bb, but it made other notes really sharp. So, I had no choice but to keep my original tube.
Does anyone have this kind of problem with your A, and how did you bring the pitches up?
Jong
Post Edited (2008-08-28 03:46)
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Author: Mike Clarinet
Date: 2008-08-28 08:06
This is the worst note for tuning on any clarinet, due to the dual function of the speaker key as a Bb key. I don't know if this will help, but where possible, try playing the Bb with the A key and the 3rd R/H trill key (the one you use for Bb - Bnat trills). The tone can be improved by putting down the L/H 2nd & 3rd fingers as well. You may need to experiment with those fingers for best tuning / tone. I understand this works like a resonator on a xylophone, adding a tuned length of tube below the open holes which mirrors the length of tube above where the open holes are (someone will now tell me that this is wrong, but it works for me). Also check the register key opens far enough. The techs here can tell you how to do that.
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Author: William
Date: 2008-08-28 15:04
I use my "side" Bb4 almost exclusively on my A clarinets, and often on my Bb because when properly vented, it sounds better than the conventional "pinch" Bb. I think that Bb4 is "bad" on most A clarinets and you either use the side trill key or kill your embouchure lipping it up.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2008-08-28 15:12
Its a VERY frequently discussed question here, with many comments/possible-solutions in our archives. A Search will help with many of your problems. Luck, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: John O'Janpa
Date: 2008-08-28 15:42
Besides often using the "side" Bb key, I specifically adjust reeds to play the pinch Bb. I can usually make a reed play it better, but it still isn't as clean as other notes.
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Author: chlpuduk
Date: 2008-08-28 15:48
I appreiciate all of you for your help.
My A and Ab are slightly lower, but they are hard to tell.
I am playing Tchaikovsky No.5 beginning of the first movement on my audition. The Bb that I am having a trouble with occurs in 6/8 section where side fingerings don't work smoothly.
As Mark adviced, I will search in the archives.
Cheers, Jong
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2008-08-28 16:12
It's worth checking you don't have the tone hole "nests". These are like nests of dirt at the bottom of tone holes, and are mostly impossible to see without removing the keys. You also need strong (direct) light to see them. A sheding swab can cause them, and they will mostly influence the throat notes, since that's where you'll have them the most. Though in this case I am guessing you don't have this problem.
You should also make sure the pads are opening enough. The throat notes can easily be too flat and/or stuffy if the pads don't open enough. That's where a good repairer who can play clarinet can help. If you don't mind taking keys off yourself, check intonation with keys removed.
Check for regular dirt in the tone holes and register tube too.
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Author: arundo
Date: 2008-08-28 21:41
Chlpuduk:
Another, but admittedly more expensive possible solution, is a custom made barrel. There are many fine examples (e.g. Grabner, Segal, Moenig, Fobes). In their ads they claim to improve sound and intonation. I have Clark Fobes barrels on both A and B-flat and they do just that. Good luck.
mark dickman
7738565490
markdickman82@hotmail.com
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Author: chlpuduk
Date: 2008-08-29 03:20
Thanks again for all.
My set up is R-13 with Eddie Daniels. I am using Zonda 4L and Vandoren Optimum with two lines, and my barrel is 65mm.
I am planning to get a Backun Barrel 64.5mm or 64mm.
Jong
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Author: RAB
Date: 2008-08-29 12:43
I would first check the inside of the tube as suggested in an earlier post, then if you have a cork pad on the vent have someone bevel it, also correct opening height is a must. also my teacher had me try different covered fingerings to improve this note. If all of the above are done and the problem is still there, then try different barrels. A barrel will fix certain problems but if the instrument is out of adjustment you can get the "perfect: barrel and it will not matter.
Good luck
RAB
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2008-08-29 14:05
Among the many good suggerstions above, you might consider Ave Galper's [a fellow Canadian] tube etc "kit" which I believe is still available. You will find his patent number in the archives, I believe he intended his improvements to be used on Buffets, Bb in particular, on an A ?? His description/solution should be of interest. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2008-08-29 14:56
It’s my belief that a barrel or mouthpiece won’t fix just one note. How does it know to raise the pitch on the Bb and not the surrounding notes, it’s not a computer? I had a similar problem years ago but it was sharper than the surrounding notes. I believe it’s the tube because that will effect the Bb and not the A, Ab or G. I went to Guy Chadash in NY and he raised the tone hole for the vent key and built me a new tube. At first it was too flat, likes yours, but he kept changing the diameter of the tube until it played in tune without effecting the upper register. Now it’s great. It wasn’t cheap but well worth it. I know other techs can do that too so either go to him or find someone closer that builds their own clarinets and knows how to do this. The other answer is to find someone that has a good collection of tubes and experiment. ESP www.peabody.jhu.edu/457
Listen to a little Mozart
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Author: Ed
Date: 2008-08-29 15:27
Unless there is a problem with debris in the tonehole or a venting issue, I completely agree with what Ed Palanker says. Guy has all of the machinery and the understanding and can do wonders. I don't know of anyone who has the knowledge and finesse with a clarinet that he does.
Post Edited (2008-08-29 15:29)
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2008-08-29 18:48
Earlier, I have puzzled over the possible influences of the several variables in tbe location and sizing of the Reg. Tonehole tube. My 2 A's, both old, a Kohlert and my fine Selmer [HS] 1929 wood, have good intonation. On both the reg. tube is locatedabout 87 mm above the top of the thumb hole. On my Bb's, a Sel CT in particular, this separation is about 84 mm. I guess I suggest making a similar measurement on your Buff, as this location seems important. I also found that Selmer's and Leblanc's tube structures and their tube "penetration" into the bore [partially outside] resulted in cleaner Bbs. Just my PM thots on a complex subject. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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