 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: LonDear
Date: 2008-04-08 03:02
I'm primarily a clarinet player of all sizes from Eb through contras, mostly sopranos (Eb/C/Bb/A) and bass, but I gig regularly on tenor and soprano saxes.
My big band lead alto sax career ended about 22 years ago, and I have been called back to the bandstand for a musical that calls for several sizes of clarinets plus alto sax. My alto sax is in good repair and I have been able to give the alto sax a good workout to prove that it is in excellent shape. However, the mouthpieces for the alto sax that I have feels just terrible compared to any of my clarinet setups. My alto sax mouthpieces are a Dukoff D7 and a Vandoren A55. These are large mouthpieces that require quite a bit of effort.
My typical clarinet setup is a Grabner K14 with a Legere Quebec 3.5 with a Grabner coco barrel.
I'm looking for an alto sax mouthpiece that feels more like a clarinet setup; any ideas?
If I'm out of line wanting to have an alto sax feel like a clarinet, please let me know.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2008-04-08 03:48
You're not "out of line" wanting mouthpieces that have similar feels, but certainly alto sax is a very different instrument than clarinet, and you might be better off learning to adjust automatically to the differences between the instruments rather than trying to make them as similar as possible. It's like learning foreign languages -- use the similarities to help you start off, but savor the differences and use them to reinforce your knowledge of both.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2008-04-08 04:13
As we all know, the embouchure of the clarinet is different than the saxophone (perhaps less so for the smaller saxophones) but speaking as a clarinetist (my primary instrument) who plays a lot of alto saxophone, I've always thought that the Link sax mouthpieces felt the most comfortable.
Over the years I've tried or owned many alto and tenor sax mouthpieces, from Guardala, Dukoff, Berg, Lakey, Link, Meyer, Larsen, etc... but always gravitate back to the Link models...GBK
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Author: donald
Date: 2008-04-08 09:09
I play Classical saxophone for the Auckland Philharmonia for about about 5 or 6 programs a year, but am primarily a Clarinet player. In the last few years I have started using Vandoren Optimum Alto and Tenor mouthpieces (for some reason the name Optimum is used for ligatures as well as the Sax mouthpieces) and find them very easy to change/adjust to.
While I seldom have to swap directly in the middle of performances (ie, "double"), i've found my previous mouthpiece options required much more "adjustment". With the Optimum mouthpieces (TL3, AL3) I find i have little difficulty changing swapping over to my "alter ego" and use a very similar embouchure (with much more emphasis on the "flat/dropped chin" to reduce pressure on the reed, a lower tongue position and really really relaxed throat).
I've never loved playing the sax as much as I do now- it's great, and so much easier to play in tune than the clarinet! Last year a flute player visiting from Europe told me she'd "never believed the tenor sax could sound so beautiful" after hearing my solos in an Auckland Chamber Orchestra concert (i know that sounds a bit over the top, but i think she was genuine and certainly appreciated the compliment!). I just wish there was more time in the day to practise all the instruments I have to play.
keep playing the good tunes
dn
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-04-08 09:15
Meyer 5 or 6 would probably do the trick, or a Selmer S80 C** or D.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Iceland clarinet
Date: 2008-04-08 12:38
Donald would you please tell us what your setup is on the clarinet because that should have some affect on preffered sax mouthpiece.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-04-08 13:12
Iceland, see his original post.
I also find the meyer and Selmer C star to be close enough. The Meyer is more of a jazz sound whereas the C star is more mellow. Both are very easy to control.
The dukoff is a different animal.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-04-08 14:00
I used to play a Dukoff D7 on alto back in the '80s, but changed to a Lawton 7*BB in the mid '90s which I find much better (after losing my rag with the Dukoff during a rehearsal as it kept squeaking, when I put the Lawton on and stuck with it ever since) - it just has far better tone quality (more tonal depth) and tuning stability, and just much easier to get on with.
Also try the Selmer Soloist and Super Session mouthpieces.
Although you want a more clarinet-like feel to the mouthpiece, are you wanting to keep a certain edge to your sax sound (but not nearly as edgy as the Dukoff)?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2008-04-08 15:23
Actually, it was LonDear who said he uses a Grabner. Donald (to whom Iceland addressed his question) didn't say what his clarinet setup is.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: donald
Date: 2008-04-08 19:53
sorry- i meant to include this info as it is relevant
For the last 3 years I have been playing a Lomax A3 with a 1.08 tip opening (though may be changing soon). I use this with V12 4 or 4.5 reeds (or Rue Le Pec 4.5). I find that the 4.5 are too hard for practical use, but are usually spot on after they have been balanced.
dn
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Author: brycon
Date: 2008-04-08 20:26
I've never played a better alto mouthpiece than the old New York Meyers. I always found mine easy to play in the switch from clarinet and vice-versa. They are also good in a variety of settings- combo, big band, etc.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2008-04-08 21:15
? Is there a relationship of mp to the make of sax being played ? What little playing I still do, I much prefer my older Selmer mps, C* and best, the D, for my Mark 6 alto, to any others I have. Just PM, thots, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: hans
Date: 2008-04-08 23:24
LonDear,
I can't say that it will make your sax setup feel more like a clarinet, but in my case I find that the alto sax Selmer C* is an easy one to switch to from clarinet, on which I normally use a Vandoren 5RV (not the Lyre).
The C* is also inexpensive and probably easy to find.
Hans
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Author: Carol Dutcher
Date: 2008-04-09 00:14
I use a Yanagasawa mouthpiece for my alto - I tried a number of mouthpieces out in a music store one day. It is very nice. I think it was around $100.00.
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Author: John Scorgie
Date: 2008-04-09 06:13
Lots of good advice here but no one has mentioned the obvious.
Since you have already (wisely) chosen a Grabner clarinet mpce, why not call Walter Grabner and get his advice?
I doubt that he makes sax mpces but he may be willing to rework that Vandoren A55 into something more conservative and comfortable for you. If not, I am certain that he can recommend a sax mpce which will be compatible with your K14 / Legere 3.5 clarinet setup.
My own 0.02 worth of advice would be to include the Hite sax mpces with those listed by previous posters.
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Author: William
Date: 2008-04-09 13:26
I have two alto mpcs that I like, a Selmer metal "Jazz" C* and a "Hollywood" Gregory hard rubber. My alto is a Selmer "in line" Balanced Action, a predecesor of the Mark VI model and both those mpcs produce the kind of sound I need for big band, combo or (occassionally) orchestral playing. But no matter what mpc you choose, like clarinet, it's really all about the reed. My soprano clarinet setup is a Chicago Kaspar #14, Optimum lig w/parallel rail insert and V12 3.5 or 4.0, depending on how I feel. But on my saxes, I tend to use reeds that feel softer and are easy to blow. For clarinet, my embouchure is quite firm, but on sax, more like double lip with less tension. This is important when switching between instruments as in a frantic pit situation when you need your saxes to speak instantly after sitting on the stand. Whatever mpc you finally decide on for your alto, do as intense a reed search as you may do for your more "classically correct" clarinets--it is just as hard to find a decent reed for a sax as it is for a clarinet. But the good news--when you do find a good reed for your alto, it will last ten times as long as it's clarinet cousin. Fred Hemke, American saxophone virtuoso, says some of his best reeds seem to last "forever", even though they look like they are worn out. BTW, I do not have a favorite reed brand and am currently using a mix of Vandorans, Ricos, LaVoz and Symetricut. My only criteria, if it sounds and plays good, it is good. And I go through boxes of reeds to find a few that are sutiable for use. Not so much about the mouthpiece, but more about the reed and how it plays. Good luck.
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2008-04-09 20:23
LonDear,
I also use a Grabner K14 and Quebec on clarinet. Most of my playing is in doubling situations.
Here's my take on your question....
First, clarinet is clarinet and saxophone is saxophone. It's important to keep them separate.
That said, in my experience, there can be certain essential aspects of one's tonal conception on clarinet that can cross the clarinet-sax border to influence your tonal conception on saxophone. For me, I have a similar dark-warm-resonant-ringing-projecting tonal concept on both clarinet and saxophone.
With that in mind, I don't look for a saxophone mouthpiece that FEELS like a clarinet mouthpiece. But, I can have a saxophone mouthpiece that matches my dark-warm-resonant-ringing-projecting tonal conception.
I hope that makes sense.
The saxophone mouthpiece that, for me, is the closest tonal match to the tonal qualities I get with a Grabner Kaspar is a Ralph Morgan 6C. I find the 6C to have just the right balance between power and control. It's sound is dark, vibrant, and ringing. And, it has a remarkable level of projection. Simply put, the Morgan 6C is the closest thing to a Kaspar that I've found for saxophone. To my knowledge, the only place where one can order a 6C is through Dave Hoskins at Junkdude.com.
Hope you find a mouthpiece that works for you.
PS, to clarify one thing..... Ralph Morgan passed on last year. However, Morgan mouthpieces are continuing and being produced by Brian & Erik (the two mouthpiece craftsmen Ralph Morgan trained to follow in his foot steps). Junkdude.com is the internet point of contact for ordering or asking about Morgan mouthpieces.
I have no financial interest in either Morgan or Junkdude. I simply am a big fan of the 6C mouthpiece.
Roger
Post Edited (2008-04-09 22:45)
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2008-04-10 13:59
I use a Berg Larsen hard rubber on Alto with no problems whatsoever..as to the selmer C star I find the sound too small for show music. However, the c star Selmer is good for learning etc.
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Author: William
Date: 2008-04-10 14:17
Just to clarify, my Selmer C* is a metal "Jazz" model which has a bigger more "penetrating" sound than the basic C* and is quite adequate for big band, combo or show use. However, I now prefer to use my hard rubber "Hollywood" Gregory because I can produce more subtil sound colors from dark to "bright with a bite" more easily. Again, I like both--but with either one (or any other mpc) I still think it is more about the reed. You need to do as intense a reed search on sax as with the clarinet to find those few good ones that perform well for your work. And the good news, sax reeds will last infinately longer on the job than their clarinet cousins.
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Author: Kel
Date: 2008-04-11 14:05
I agree with donald's post about the Vandoren Optimum. I recently got one for baritone sax (BL4), and it is a truly remarkable mouthpiece, very easy to play, comfortable in the mouth, and with a full, rich sound. I plan to stay with Meyer on alto, but only because I am accustomed to larger tip openings than VD offers in the alto Optimum.
Post Edited (2008-04-11 14:06)
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Author: Ed
Date: 2008-04-11 14:32
Meyer 5 or the newer Vandoren V16 in a 5 will likely feel about right with the right reed. Easy to play and control.
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