 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: SVClarinet09
Date: 2008-03-13 02:18
Is there a such thing as being over expressive sightreading at contest festival?
We returned today and a judge did not give us a superior because we were "over expressive". Another question, as a judge, would you penalize a band for playing a piece of music that was out of the norm (a Holsinger piece, Gmyway's Revenge to be exact) along with Hounds of Spring in the same concert saying it makes the band lose it's "warm tonal qualities into a bright thunderstorm of calamity"?
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2008-03-13 02:56
I have yet to hear ANYTHING performed to an over expressive degree. You may not agree with what the person is saying to you, but one cannot say that the form with which the message is expressed is "too much."
The converse is too terribly common to even address here. So often I listen to performances that hang in the air like a stale odor, just wishing for ANYTHING the least bit controversial.
...........Paul Aviles
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Author: tdinap
Date: 2008-03-13 03:21
I think "over-expressive" is a poor choice of words on the judge's part, but I'd assume that he meant the band was too extreme in their interpretation--which is certainly possible. [edit]I just saw Paul Aviles' post, and I agree wholeheartedly. I'd much rather have too much "expression", or whatever you'd like to call it, than too little.[/edit]
As for the second comment, I'd assume he just wanted more contrast in the selections, probably something calmer to offset a more energetic piece, but again, it doesn't seem like he expressed that very well. I just listened to Hounds of Spring, and while it does have some intense spots, it's hardly a "bright thunderstorm of calamity"--there was plenty of opportunity to create a "warm", pretty band sound.
Personally, I think he was just desperate for a chance to use that ridiculous metaphor.
Tom
Post Edited (2008-03-13 03:23)
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2008-03-13 05:16
I think "over expression" is a decent term. My teacher beats me up for "micro phrasing," in which I try "expressing" each note --instead of flowing through a complete phrase.
With my evolving judgment, I'm agreeing with him and trying to "build longer phrases."
Bob Phillips
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2008-03-13 14:00
Ooh la la, mais non, a greasy bag of FREEDOM fries! ;-)
Yes, I think it's possible to be overly expressive, although I don't think I'd choose quite those words. It's possible to play with overly-exaggerated phrasing: staccatos t' sh'rt, legatos tooooooooo loooooooooooonnnng, notes that crescendo into sobbingly wah-wah-wah-wide vibrato, fortes TOO LOUD, pianos fading into inaud.... Add plenty of physical mannerisms, as well: a dip here, a swoop here, soulful expression, head thrown back with clarinet pointing skyward, eyes rolling back to show the whites.
Now, I'm not suggesting you did all that. Of course you didn't. Nobody would. (Oh, wait, there's Kenny G--but he plays soprano sax.) But you see what I mean: There's such a thing as too much, with the result, usually, that the music takes on an aura of cloying sentimentality or brutish aggression or something else the composer didn't write--something that distracts the audience from what the composer *did* write. If it's good music, let it speak for itself.
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
Post Edited (2008-03-13 14:02)
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Author: John O'Janpa
Date: 2008-03-13 15:20
A more common term for playing with too much expression is Smaltzy.
An example would be someone singing Happy Birthday as though it were the greatest aria ever written.
Of course this can happen to varying degrees, and becomes very subjective at times. Beauty is in the ear of the beholder.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2008-03-13 15:46
I always think of P.J.Proby and "Somewhere" when I hear that expression...
--
Ben
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Author: Philcoman
Date: 2008-03-13 15:53
"...a bright thunderstorm of calamity?!" Now THAT'S what I call "over expressive!" :-)
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Author: Tony Beck
Date: 2008-03-14 02:21
It happens all the time. Sergei Rachmaninoff is a perennial victim of over expression. In fact, I understand that he complained about the tendency himself. Chopin is another that often gets schmaltzed up. Rag Time pianists do this quite a bit too, usually playing with excessive tempo changes and generally far faster than the music is marked. Generally, if you are playing a lot differently for the score notation, you’re either over or under expressing.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2008-03-14 04:14
That to me is just very subjective. If you feel you are expressing yourself through the music and someone else found it "over expressive", so be it. Are you happy with the way you played it? If so, then that's the way you SHOULD play it. Unless you're really fighting to win at all costs. If you're just interested in winning, then play it the way THEY want to hear it. Might be the same as you'd like to hear it, may not be. If however music is more of a hobby to you and you play for your own enjoyment (regardless of what other's think), then forget what they think. Play for YOU. I guarantee that if you play as YOU feel it should be played and you're happy with it, there's an audience out there that will like it.
Myself? I'm a toss-up. I play for enjoyment. I enjoy playing. So I tend to play/practice how I'D like to hear it. Problem is that I'm in an army band so we have to play and practice how our commander wants to hear it. It's not bad, it's a job. If I'm getting paid to play, I have to play to those who are in charge of me. But when I'm on my own, I play differently.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2008-03-14 16:02
Lelia,
You're explanation clearly summarizes my "over/mini phrasing" problem. Thanks for clearing out the confusion.
Bob Phillips
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