 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ljp
Date: 2008-02-07 04:04
We are considering buying a clarinet for my daughter. This is her 5th year playing. One of her school bands is doing Grade/level 4 material. She enjoys playing in the band; but doesn't practice at home. Her report card says she is working on air support and getting fuller tones. She is a long way from mellow.
I would like to get better than student quality, perhaps wood. However, we are on a beer (student) budget. I've seen reconditioned wood/vintage clarinets advertised between $300-$400. I don't understand why these are so much cheaper than other wood (intermediate) clarinets. In Alberta used student clarinets (Vito, Yamaha, etc.) are available for $300-400.
Enlightenment about clarinet pricing would be appreciated.
Larry Phillips
http://www.clubwebcanada.ca/l-pphillips/
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2008-02-07 13:51
Hello Larry,
Vintage clarinets do not appreciate in value (as fine string instruments do).
There are many things that can happen to the instrument over time that reduce its' value, including becoming "blown out". You can search the BB for this term...there's been quite a bit of discussion.
Some of these instrument might be quite fine if they were completely rebuilt by a qualified technician ($450). When I say qualified...not the technicians who are providing the horns on that auction site.
If your daughter were my student and you asked me the quesiton, I would reccomend searching that auction site for the (wooden) Selmer Signet (100, special, soloist, whichever...they're all Selmer Signets) which can be often had at or beneath the price you talking about.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: kilo
Date: 2008-02-07 14:49
And don't be too determined on getting a wooden clarinet. Chances are a reconditioned intermediate model will be superior but sound and general playability are ultimately more important than the material. Might be time for a mouthpiece upgrade as well, it might help with mellowing the tone.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2008-02-07 15:16
Larry -
The closer a part of the clarinet is to your body, the more difference it makes. The reed is vital, as is the mouthpiece, and the barrel has a large effect. Below that, changing things has much less importance.
Thus, you must keep your daughter supplied with fresh reeds, or get her a Legere, which is excellent (even though plastic) and lasts a long time.
Next, a good quality student mouthpiece, such as Fobes Debut, at $37, will make a tremendous improvement.
For your $300-$400 budget, you should consider a matched professional quality mouthpiece and barrel, such as those made by Walter Grabner http://www.clarinetxpress.com/. You can get this combination for around $350. I've put my handmade mouthpiece and barrel on a plastic Vito, and while it didn't feel quite as good as my Buffet, I was amazed at how well it played.
With five years of experience, your daughter should consider taking private lessons. After all, the closest thing to your body is your body itself. A good player can sound excellent on any setup. A teacher can spot problems immediately and work on proper blowing, embouchure and tongue and soft palate position, all of which will help create the mellowness everyone wants.
If your daughter's clarinet is a student model from a good maker, such as Buffet, Yamaha or Vito, the most bang for the buck is a mouthpiece and barrel. However, it's worth taking her clarinet to a repair shop and making sure all the pads are perfectly seated and the mechanism is properly adjusted.
Good luck to you both, and keep us informed of progress.
Ken Shaw
Post Edited (2008-02-23 13:16)
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Author: ljp
Date: 2008-02-23 02:55
Thank you for your replies. I'm trying to get a feel for our options and your comments are helpful.
Larry Phillips
http://www.clubwebcanada.ca/l-pphillips/
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2008-02-23 15:48
I would never suggest you buy an old wood clarinet without having a person you can trust play it first and see if it tunes decently, not two mention has a decent tone quality. I’ve had some students that really had problems with “vintage” wood clarinets. One had bought an old Buffet thinking he got a great deal, after spending $1200 trying to get it to play in tune by one of our countries most well respected repairmen he would have been better off buying a new student model. I agree that a good barrel and mouthpiece would make a world of difference but the clarinet has to reasonably in tune with it self first. Wood changes in time and many times it gets worse, not better, assuming it was good to begin with. ESP
www.peabody.jhu.edu/457
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Author: Chelle
Date: 2008-02-23 15:56
Yeah, I difinitely wouldn't buy a vintage/antique clarinet for a student. I play almost exclusively vintage instruments, and every one has a bunch of little quirks that I have to make adjustments for. I think that having to learn and adjust for all those quirks on top of learn the instrument will just make things more difficult in the long run.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2008-02-23 23:35
I disagree with Chelle, because (all false modesty aside) when I restore a vintage clarinet I also 'engineer' the quirks out of them -- so they play just like new instruments, only older.
Disclaimer: I sell the stinky old things from time to time.
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Author: Chelle
Date: 2008-02-24 00:37
But would it actually be cheaper to get an older one and have a supurb technicial remove all the quirks or to get a newer one? (since budget seems to be an issue).
I know when I had my bass clarinet (1967 Noblet) overhauled, it cost $500 and it still has a lot of the same quirks (but I've been playing it for 10 years so I'm used to it. Plus, I don't play anything insanely difficult - just community band type stuff & pit orchestra).
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2008-02-24 03:54
Chelle,
It is economical to take an old clarinet and have it rebuilt!
In the professional world we buy a completely new horn, break it in, and then spend $500 to have it rebuilt (if we buy Buffets!). You can buy an old Buffet on the cheap and then have it restored for the same amount.
The real issue is that in these cases is that you don't get to play-test the instrument ahead of time, and so you are gambling to some degree (as described by Ed Palanker above).
A professional overhaul, performed in collaboration between tech and musician, can solve many idiosyncrasies.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2008-02-24 03:55
Speaking for myself only, and at the risk of appearing to solicit business (which I'm NOT trying to do, Mark and GBK), my overhauled vintage clarinets with "quirks" removed are very cost-effective compared to newer clarinets.
End of self-hype, I will say no more.
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Author: stancl
Date: 2008-02-24 07:01
I agree with Tobin that wooden clarinets like the Selmer Signet can be very good value and can be found on auction sites for only a couple hundred dollars (or even less).
I was very pleasantly surprised recently when I bought a Selmer Signet Special as a backup for my Selmer Series 9, which at the time was in the shop. My Signet arrived in very good condition, but I realize any clarinet purchased in this fashion might benefit from a professional checkup/overhaul.
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Author: ghuba
Date: 2008-02-24 11:49
A brand-new Rideonour Lyrique clarinet (albeit the lower priced model) is just a little more than the "beer" price being discussed (more like an imported beer, such as a Canadian one, in the U.S.). I am curious how other contributors to this thread would compare the Lyrique at $625 to the probable cost from an auction clarinet (and a good one at that plus a $250 overhaul) to the Lyrique, especially since the Lyrique will come with Ridenour's support. The Lyrique also includes a Ridenour mouthpiece and barrel.
I am also curious whether other contributors to this thread think that paying a few hundred dollars more for a student's instrument -- at this level -- is a "good deal" or not factoring in the likelihood that the student will enjoy playing more on a slightly more expensive instrument and be more likely to continue into adulthood.
George
PS. With the current exchange rates, a clarinet bound for Canada, and paid for in U.S. dollars, has progressively less expensive.
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