 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: fmcat
Date: 2007-07-18 19:59
Hey, Everyone,
I'm currently on the market for a clarinet to change my tone, as I have noted the limitations in some of the registers of my Buffet B12.
I have a Selmer 10S in the shop being overhauled right now, but I was wondering, do any of you have any examples of less expensive models, such as Noblet or Yamaha, which have a very nice tone for pretty inexpensive money?
Thanks in advance
Buffet B12, ED II Ligature, M13 Mouthpiece, Strength 5 V12 Vandoren
Local 281 - Clarinet Player
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Author: GBK
Date: 2007-07-18 20:05
Getting a beautiful tone on the clarinet has less to do with the instrument and more to do with what is between your ears.
I'm betting that Ricardo Morales might sound quite nice on your current clarinet.
That being said, any intermediate or pro level clarinet with undercut tone holes and a polycylindrical bore would be (or might not be) a step up from your B12. ..GBK
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Author: fmcat
Date: 2007-07-18 20:07
Well, my issue is that I have a really really boxy sounding low E, and no matter how hard I try, I cannot get it to play in tune or "unboxy", as I can on my old Yamaha.
Buffet B12, ED II Ligature, M13 Mouthpiece, Strength 5 V12 Vandoren
Local 281 - Clarinet Player
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Author: bmcgar ★2017
Date: 2007-07-18 20:47
Well, I really can't figure out what you mean by "boxy," but if you're having trouble with only one note on your instrument, you may either have a leak in the lower joint pads or there's something queer about the bore at the end of the joint or the bell. (My guess is the lower joint pad seatings.) Either thing can be fixed.
Have you tried switching bells between your instruments?
Don't be looking around for a new clarinet. A problem with one note certainly isn't associated with a clarinet's brand or model.
B.
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Author: Charlie
Date: 2007-07-18 21:01
I understand your feelings. I played on a B12 before i switched to an R13. This is an entry level clarinet and has such a stupid tone compared to a wooden clarinet.
rockerchar@gmail.com
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Author: fmcat
Date: 2007-07-19 01:59
The B12 I do not think is an entry level clarinet. There are plenty of clarinets, including wood, with quality and craftsmanship far below the par set by the B12.
I would try the barrel from my yamaha, but I'm afraid the yamaha is a 442 not a 440 instrument, and thus the tenons do not fit.
Buffet B12, ED II Ligature, M13 Mouthpiece, Strength 5 V12 Vandoren
Local 281 - Clarinet Player
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Author: bmcgar ★2017
Date: 2007-07-19 03:39
Switch bells, not barrels.
And I'd play a concert with a B12 any day. Nothing "stupid" about its sound.
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Author: MichaelR
Date: 2007-07-19 09:17
fmcat wrote:
> Well, my issue is that I have a really really boxy sounding low
> E, and no matter how hard I try, I cannot get it to play in
> tune or "unboxy", as I can on my old Yamaha.
Would you please explain boxy? I've never heard the term used. In my (very large) collection of poor tones don't have one that I can associate with that description.
You got me curious.
--
Michael of Portland, OR
Be Appropriate and Follow Your Curiosity
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Author: fmcat
Date: 2007-07-19 11:56
Well, boxy, I guess is a very broad category to classify a sound as. I would say that the clarinet generally is pretty dark with my setup, but this one note sounds like it is being played in a tin can, for lack of any other analogy.
Another issue I have is that when playing low C and D, the tone from the clarinet vibrates so much that the posts start this awefully annoying hum. My instructor cannot hear it, but he is partially deaf from playing everywhere.
I also feel as if I may have not benefited by his preference for Vandoren reeds and his bashing of Rico. I know that the V12's are a great reed, a bit expensive, but there have to be other things out there, right? I do get an "airy" sound because I use a very hard strength (which is odd, i recieve a reed and it's soft, but after playing, it hardens and goes soft again). I've tried the softer reeds and found them to die faster and produce a much sharper pitch, something I could probably compensate for in my embouchure or by simply pulling out the barrel and bell.
The only way for me to find out? Play more.
Buffet B12, ED II Ligature, M13 Mouthpiece, Strength 5 V12 Vandoren
Local 281 - Clarinet Player
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Author: Iso
Date: 2007-07-26 01:47
Hey,
my advice is just the opposite of the others. Get rid of your clarinet, if it doesn't sound good to you, and get a pro one. I did the same thing, and I never regretted it. You'll find much more joy because they play more easily, and they WILL sound better - no wonder the price difference. As they say: always buy an instrument that is better than you. It's true, especially, when you practice: if you sound bad, you KNOW it's you, and not the instrument.
I don't believe in the "practice until you get better sound" thing. It's like: if you get REALLY tired, you'll be sleeping like a baby on the wooden floor. It's true, yet, most of us buy a nice, soft mattress. Why suffer?
If I were you, I would stay with the Selmer. Sell the B12 - that'll be money too!!! Don't go into Noblet, they're fine, but not that good -been there, done that- especially after the B12. I don't know, however, anything about Yamahas.
If you decide to sell your Selmer, on the ebay you can buy used clarinet for relatively cheap - like max $600 for a used, once top instrument still in top shape. You gotta wait a bit, and go for the right one you fall in love with. I bought mine, a Leblanc L70 /Leblanc's top of the line instrument in the 70s/ for 600 w/ shipping, that was virtually new. And man, it was worth every penny.
Go for it.
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2007-07-26 22:32
I think you might be dissapointed with a pro model because nothing can magically changes your tone to how you want it except for yourself.
My "fundamental tone" doesn't really change too much from horn to horn because I adapt to make it sound how I want it to on any instrument.
I can make my student yamaha sound the same as my Festival if i need to, expecially with the help of my set up... when I play on my student clarinet (outdoors, practice session... whatever) I always use the barrel and mouthpice set up i'm most used to. This will always make the biggest difference.
If your instrument is in brutal physical condition (sounds as this may be the case... ) then I would say buy a new one for sure.
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-07-27 02:28
If you have played 'better' clarinets and find an improvement, then there IS a difference.
As for your reed situation, try Rico Grand Concert. The 'traditional' might be the thing to make it work for you.
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Author: fmcat
Date: 2007-07-27 20:00
I don't own the Selmer yet. I've tried many many newer clarinets at my instructor's shop, and didn't really like any of the Buffet's. He suggested I take a look at a Selmer Paris, and I decided to go with it. He gave me a call up and he had one which was immaculately maintained by an army band without any key or body damage. He is a NAPBIRT regional director, so I have no question in the quality of his work, but I'm currently saving up for a lot of things and the $1000 he is offering me seems too steep, however, that does include having everything overhauled, a new protec case, and I can call him with any repairs I need done at any time. It's great because actually I brought up to him that my M13 was getting green, and he said, "oh, it's no problem, give it to me and I can have it right back to black", however I figured I wouldn't tie him up over something so small yet so tedious.
Hm.. I do agree with having a clarinet better than yourself. Tools are like that. Having a wife smarter than yourself is also a nice thing .
I will most definitely look into a Leblanc.
Buffet B12, ED II Ligature, M13 Mouthpiece, Strength 5 V12 Vandoren
Local 281 - Clarinet Player
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2007-07-28 22:19
Oooook... why are you playing on 5 V12s? Parhaps this is part of the problem?
That's like playing on a 2 by 4 in my opinion... was this suggested by your teacher?
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: fmcat
Date: 2007-07-28 23:25
After being consistently unsatisfied with my reeds at lower strengths, I moved up. Every time I try a lower strength reed, the tone quality seems to suffer. Each reed also manages to collapse very quickly at lower strengths.
I'm sure that the tone quality could be improved by changing my embouchure, however, I find it much easier to just play on a 5. Whenever I play on say a 4, not only is the E sharp, so is the whole clarinet.
Buffet B12, ED II Ligature, M13 Mouthpiece, Strength 5 V12 Vandoren
Local 281 - Clarinet Player
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Author: sherman
Date: 2007-07-29 06:12
Looking at your original posting, there is one suggestion I will make for your consideration. And you can try it for nothing. It will change the sound that you make.Comparatively, the sound will be not strident, nor will the low register bother you and the sound will be even. It will be intune in the low register and will have a polycylindrical bore. It will be much less expensive than any other new clarinet available today. Investigate the Lyrique Custom designed and distributed by William Ridenour.
Sherman Friedland
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2007-07-29 20:13
I used to use 4 V12s but I've developed a palatal air leak and I HAVE to play a reed no stronger than a 3.5 or it gets really bad because of the increased pressure required to play in the different registers. My tuning does not suffer... you adapt.
Try dropping to a 4, or even a 3.5, and concentrate on creating the same quality of sound you prefer with the 5. It is possible, and you'll find you have more fluidity in your sound. Most mouthpieces are not designed to properly accomadate such a hard reed.
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: marshall
Date: 2007-07-31 03:28
5 V12s sound awfully hard for an M13...I play on an M13 lyre and am using 4 V12s...a close friend of mine is playing on the same with 4.5 Rue Lepics. There aren't any set limits of what reeds you shoud be playing with a certain mouthpiece, but there are guidelines. 5 just seems too heavy for any Vandoren mouthpiece other than an M15. You should be choosing a reed based on what sounds the best with the mouthpiece...not because you can play that strength without blowing your lip.
And on the topic of choosing a reed, like I said I think you may want to try a 4.5 or even a 4 with that mouthpiece with V12s. Also, try Traditional and Rue Lepics. I don't know why...but in my opinion a Rico Grand Concert is still a Rico...and I may be completely brainwashed by my teacher, but any Rico is sub-par in quality compared to Vandoren. It isn't even the cut of the reed itself, it's just that I've found their reeds to be of lesser quality cane, they lose their life faster, they tend to be more inconsistent, and I can't seem to get the bad ones to play well even after putting a lot of work into them.
(To all Rico users...please don't kill me).
One redeeming quality about Rico is they own the Mitchell Lurie franchise...which is second only to Vandoren IMO. Try those as well. They do tend to be lighter than Vandorens of the 'same' strenth and they lose their life faster, but they do tend to be more consistant than most Vandorens.
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