 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-04-16 15:51
Hello
I have a question (or two) about copyrights please.
I'm composing a few pieces and want to use quotes from a book as the names for the pieces. I checked and the author is dead for only 30+ years if that makes a difference. I'm only going to use one sentence or 'phrase' for each name, but I think for someone who is familiar with the book(s) good chance they will recognize it's from there, but the sentences are just normal and could be just something someone use in the language anyway.
I think there aren't any copyrights issues with what I want to do, but I'm not sure so any help will be appreciated.
Another quick question to make sure - Everything composed by Hildegard is fine to use even for a public CD that will be sold, right?
Thanks & best wishes!
Nitai
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2007-04-16 16:02
Alas, there are no easy answers. Hyperion Records has been practically bankrupted for using a modern edition of a 400 year old work without paying the editor.
Make up titles for yourself. And keep your notes.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2007-04-16 16:07
Ken is absolutely right ... if you're performing music by Hildegard then you're performing an (your?) arrangement I presume, and the arrangement could infringe, even if by accident.
You can ask permission from the copyright holder for the quotes. In the USA there's a "Fair use" clause, but that doesn't apply for commercial usage, and is not widely applicable world-wide.
Copyright law where you are may be different from where I am.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-04-16 16:21
OK thank you.
The Hildegard piece is from a CD, so I'll contact the group and ask them about the arrangement.
I'll try to contact whoever it is that has the copyrights for this author's books and ask. I think the phrases are too unclear because they are just regular sentences who are associated with the main character (he just says them a lot). I'll try to find out.
Thanks again.
Nitai
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2007-04-16 16:29
Ah, good old Hildegard. I've just come off half a semester of studying her Ordo Virtutum in a history course here at the conservatory. Of course, her music per se is out of copyright, but her scribes put it down in 4-line medieval notation. Throughout the following centuries and still up to today, her music has been transcribed and edited into many editions (from the Riesenkodex of 1180s to the Davidson of 1980s) to fit modern performers. It is very likely that your edition, especially if it is in modern 5-line notation, may be one still under copyright.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-04-16 17:49
OK, I contacted some people who might know or at least get me in touch with the copyright owners of the quotes and the Hildegard arrangement (Kevin, I don't have any sheet music for it I only heard it on a CD).
How about this totally made up example - a famous author had a main character, in a series of books, who once saw a green elephant, and then every time something weird happened he used to mention the green elephant. For those who know the book, green elephant had an association with this character. Then someone wants to call a musical piece Green Elephant. Is there a chance for copyright issues here? This is identical to what I want to do.
Thanks again,
Nitai
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Author: Bubalooy
Date: 2007-04-16 20:35
If you are referring to nondomesticated wool producing animals, there may be an issue.
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Author: DougR
Date: 2007-04-17 01:41
This is actually a pretty tricky question, and you might try the Authors Guild website, or possibly the Writers Guild of America, or Writers Digest online, and/or do some creative Googling using terms like "copyright violation" +"similar names" or something like that.
I take it you're talking about titling one of your pieces, let's say, "We'll always have Paris," and another one, "Here's looking at you, kid" or something along those lines.
I'd like to say "what could possibly be wrong with THAT?!" but the mind of an intellectual property lawyer is a strange and fearsome thing.
I'd check Writers Digest or some of the other writing magazines, see if they have online chats or Q&As, and pose your question there. Or, if you want to really take the bull by the horns, go to Literary Marketplace (it's in the reference section of the library) and look up the publisher who holds the copyright, find out who there is in charge of "Rights and Permissions," and just call-em-up and ask! (I'd exhaust every other avenue first, though.)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2007-04-17 11:55
Again, the answer is complex. Anyone can refer to the green elephant without liability, just as you can refer to Superman. On the other hand, a commercial featuring a robot that looked and acted like Vanna White was found to use her personality for commercial purposes and thus violate her ownership rights.
The dividing line is fuzzy, and new law is constantly being made. If you wrote a Green Elephant Detective Polka, or even a Green Elephant Polka, the character's creator could easily claim that you used the elephant's fame to sell your music.
The courthouse door is open, and the clerk will accept a legal complaint against you from anyone who pays the fee, regardless of whether the claim is tenable. You'd probably win a Green Elephant Polka suit, but it's not 100% certain, and you'd have to spend thousands of dollars, and probably tens of thousands, to hire lawyers to defend you.
We're in a terrible period for creative people who want to use protected images that are in common use. We're also in a terrible period for owners of intellectual property, who see their valuable images being spread all over the Web without being paid for. There are strong arguments on each side.
To use Hildegard's music, protect yourself by getting a copy of the original MS and transcribe a line for your own use, keeping your drafts to prove it's your work. For the title, make up one of your own.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2007-04-17 12:38
The best place to read the current laws and explanations of them is:
Library of Congress Copyright Office: http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/
As others have indicated, the law is fairly complicated. My rule for "borrowing" from other authors is: When in doubt, leave it out. It is possible to quote titles (which are not copyrightable, but beware anyhow, because the title may be or may contain a trademark, under a different set of laws) and very short snippets within the rules for "fair use" and, if you're a critic or a teacher, it's possible to quote somewhat more extensively under the separate rules for critical analysis. However, it's better to read the rules on that authoritative web site and query the Copyright Office directly (links on the site) than to try to get advice on a site like this one that's not a specialized copyright site.
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2007-04-17 13:11
Lelia Loban wrote:
> The best place to read the current laws and explanations of
> them is:
Depends on the country.
> As others have indicated, the law is fairly complicated.
IP (Intellectual Property) law is arguably one of the most complex areas of law - certainly one of the more malleable sets of laws and guidelines.
> very short snippets within the rules for "fair use"
"Fair Use" is an American extension to international copyright law and (as far as I know) doesn't have a corollary outside the US.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-04-17 13:39
OK thanks again.
"Anyone can refer to the green elephant without liability, just as you can refer to Superman."
This made me realize that my 'green elephant' example wasn't very good. The quotes that I want to use (which are not necesarily exact quotes) are not made up fictional stuff, but things that actually exist in reality, and existed long before this author wrote them. That's why Superman is different - it was invented by someone and didn't exist before. The problem in my case is that each quote on its own would definitely be ok, since they are just normal but all of them together would have the connection. I have reasons to use these names instead of making my own names. I'll wait for replies from the publishers.
Thanks,
Nitai
Post Edited (2007-04-17 13:47)
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