 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: Gobboboy
Date: 2007-01-30 19:07
I am teetering on the edge of parting with some serious cash here so HELP!!!!
I have always played Buffet (Bb, A, Eb, and all sorts of basses that I've borrowed over the years!) but am now on the hunt to buy a Bass and I have heard so many good things about the Selmer Privelige that I was wondering if I could pick the brains of this ever knowing Board to offer any experience or likes/dislikes between the Selmer Privelige and the Buffet Prestige.
I have played on both in the shop and at present am leaning towards the Buffet , and I know that I should go with what feels right... but it's a lot of dough you know!!! so was after some opinions on the two instruments before I sell the kids and take the plunge!
My only tech bit is - Having always played Buffet I feel that the keys down the left side of the instrument are a lot easier to hit - eg: a diminished 7th run down from F to low F on the Buffet I hit every time but can easily miss on the selmer - should I try to get used to the selmer (if it is a superior intrument?.....about a thousand quid more superior too!) or go with what feels more comfortable?
& how many gigs to pay the thing off?.....
as you can tell I'm quite lost at this juncture..........
G
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2007-01-30 20:24
With the older instruments (1970s), the Buffet had a deeper, rounder tone, but unreliable keywork. The Selmer was slim, easy to handle and responded faster than the Buffet, but with (for me) a less pleasing tone. The split among players was about 50/50, with Selmer having an edge. Best of all were the very old Selmers, with manual register keys.
The current Buffet models are much improved mechanically. There is perhaps less sweetness in the sound, but they respond better than the older ones.
The new Selmer Privilege is physically enormous, but easy to finger. I've heard top players sound great on it. I've held one but haven't played it, so I can't really talk about how it compares in response or tone.
It all depends on which feels best to you, and whether you find an exceptional instrument, regardless of who made it.
Some very good players use the Yamaha bass, including Ed Palanker in Baltimore. And depending on what you're looking for, Steve Fox's bass, with a bore close to the German bass, should be on your list, too.
Ken Shaw
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gobboboy
Date: 2007-01-30 23:53
Thanks Ken
I hadn't considered a Yamaha but maybe I will give one a try anyhow.
The Buffet is a sweet sounding instrument, I am just fascinated by the huge interest in the selmer and am so curious to know why it is worth SO much more than the Buffet?
With such a massive difference in price one would expect a massive difference in product? surely?
My opinion is that it is most probably down to the mouthpiece & reed set up and the mouth on the end of it!
Forgive me for being sceptical but, like I said...it's a lot of dough!
and you wanna make the right decision!!??
G
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-01-31 06:22
About the price - I have noticed you are from the UK, and Selmers are just a lot more expensive than Buffet there, as far as I know. For example, I just looked on an American website and the price of the low C buffet is more than the low C Selmer, over $1,000 more. So don't think the Selmer is necessarily better because the price is higher where you live.
Regarding the different models, here is a what I wrote very recently on the same subject on another forum (edited out irelevent information):
I have especially a lot of experience with Buffet and Selmer bass clarinets. I've played about ten 1193 low C Buffets, and one 1183 (same but low Eb version). I've played a low C Series 9 Selmer, two low C Selmer 37, two low Eb Selmer 35, and three Selmer Privilege (two low C and one low Eb).
My own instrument is a Buffet low C. I first started to be interested especially in the Buffet and Selmer bass clarinets when I had a slight resistance problem with legato intervals on the Buffet, from low notes (anything lower than thumb F) to the clarion notes E, F, F#, G, G#, A. After I thought it might be me, the mouthpiece, or reed, I've tried the same setup on a Selmer 37 model and didn't have the problem! I started to investigate and after a LONG time found it is a matter of the size of the register hole. I enlarged the neck register hole on my Buffet from 3mm to 3.5mm and it pretty much solved the problem (actually I have threaded tubes that go into a bigger tube so I can change sizes).
After this problem was solved I was able to make a much more fair comparison between the Buffets and Selmers. I personally prefer the Buffet overall. What I like about the Selmer is that some notes are still more free blowing, around the clarion register. It doesn't mean a better sound, just a tiny bit more free. This is the only thing I prefer about the Selmers (the 37 is even more free than the new Privilege).
About general differences, I found the Selmer is overall louder and more aggressive. The Buffet has a more clarinety (less aggressive) sound. This is especially in the low notes, let's say from around C down, and really noticable from G down to the low C. This is a matter of preference, and I like the sound of the low notes of the Buffet much more. The Privilege is slightly less aggressive and the low notes are a tiny bit more like the buffet, but still closer to the Selmer 37. I also like the overall sound of the Buffet on all notes which is also less aggressive.
There is also a very big difference in keywork. I was used to the Buffet before I ever tried a Selmer so I'm not completely objective, but I prefer the Buffet keywork much more than any model Selmer. The Privilege model is like a Selmer that was slightly Buffeted but it is one of the least comfortable bass clarinets to me. Especially the right hand stack keywork (bottom right side from the actual keys) touches my palm while I play. The 37 has to me uncomfortable pinky keys (especially left side). Intonation is excellent on both without a noticable difference IMHO (i.e. I was able to play in tune on both).
This is my opinion and experience, and I would completely understand why someone would have a preference for one over the other, for many reasons. Though, most can't really make a fair comparison. In my opinion the original register tube doesn't do the Buffet justice. I even spoke with the expert of low clarinets (especially bass clarinet) from Buffet, and spoke with him about my threaded register tubes (he is the one who originally told me about the register hole size problem) and he liked the idea. He even tried different size tubes and let me know how they were for him. Buffet still makes the register hole smaller (I can think of only very little advantage for it, and maybe only for classical orchestral players). Of course it is impossible to try a bigger register hole on an instrument you haven't bought (the store won't make it bigger for you to try!) so it is a situation where someone who is looking to buy an instrument can't really know how the Buffet can play......
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-01-31 07:12
Oh another thing I just remembered - a big keywork difference is that on the Buffet you have a low D on each side, and the three low thumb notes are D, Db and C. A friend who owns a Selmer Privilege told me the three low thumb notes on the Privilege are Eb, Db and C. I don't know if the Privilege have a low D for both pinkys. Can someone with a Privilege please conferm how it is exactly?
Thanks.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BassetHorn
Date: 2007-01-31 15:26
I tested a Selmer 37 last year so my memory is a little faded, if I recall correctly its three thumb keys are C, Db, and Eb, and low D for both pinkies. Not sure if Privilege kept this configuration.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: mnorswor
Date: 2007-01-31 15:43
On the Selmer instruments, there are two thumb keys, for the low C# and C. No Eb or D on the thumbs, those are left for the pinkies.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarinerd
Date: 2007-01-31 15:50
BassetHorn wrote:
> I tested a Selmer 37 last year so my memory is a little faded,
> if I recall correctly its three thumb keys are C, Db, and Eb,
> and low D for both pinkies. Not sure if Privilege kept this
> configuration.
I own a Privilege bass and this is correct for it as well.
I do not have experience on both buffet and selmer basses, however I love the sound and keywork of the Selmer. It is possible for the pads to seal very well while not comprimising the spring tensions.
I'd say the biggest problem with it is the low E/B 12th. The E is about 10-15 cents flat at a mezzo piano dynamic and the long B is about 15 sharp at a F dynamic for me. Other small intonation isssues are easily fixed with tape, but that E/B 12th would be a longer project. I play a B40 mpc for those who are interested. I am aware that this is a problem on many other bass clarinets, but I really am itching to have a vent built.
Good luck with your decision.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gobboboy
Date: 2007-02-01 22:07
Well,
Today I brought home a Brand new Buffet 1193 Bass Clarinet (to low C) on approval
So far I absolutely love it....
On the thumb it has low D, C# & C with a low D on both the left and right hand stacks as well.
It also has an extra tone hole cut in the bell to resonate the Low C
The fact that it is new and 'just works' aside the instrument has a quality in its sound that I have never felt before, rich and powerful down low with a sweet silky feel in the upper registers.
Intonation all over the Clarinet is so accurate it feels SO comfortable it truly is a joy to play.
We agreed in the shop that is like driving a Mercedes Benz - A Luxurios and spacious ride with perfect suspension with the power under the bonnet to wipe the floor with any competition!
Now I figure out how to pay for it.............gulp
What price do you all think I should be paying?????
(In British Sterling if possible)
G
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
