 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: kkocman
Date: 2007-01-01 19:20
Hey everyone. This is my first post, I just joined the site. I am a 10th grader, 1st chair at my school. I have an E-11 right now with an M-30 vandoren mouthpiece. I am looking to upgrade some parts of my clarinet without having to shell out a couple thousand bucks for a nicer clarinet (my parents won't let me). I was planning on upgrading my barrel. Which barrel produces the best tone in your opinion? Tone is the only area of playing in which I am struggling.
Thanks!
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Author: GBK
Date: 2007-01-01 19:34
A different barrel is not going to change your tone, per se.
It MAY help with tuning, resistance and clarity of certain registers.
A better approach would be to get a clear sound image in your mind of the clarinet tone you are striving for.
Do more listening to clarinet artists, both past and present, to get a better conception of the tone quality (and playing characteristics) which you find desirable.
There is no magic piece of equipment which will suddenly yield the "best tone" (your words)
Use the above suggestions and learn to play what you currently have...GBK
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Author: kkocman
Date: 2007-01-01 19:56
I'm looking for something that will help make the throat tones (Bb in particular) more pure and clear. Also I am looking for something that will make the transition from the lower register into the higher register seamless and not so obvious. Is there any piece of equipment that would help (not necessarily barrels)?
Post Edited (2007-01-01 19:57)
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Author: pewd
Date: 2007-01-01 20:06
have your instrument checked by a tech for maintenance issues.
then the magic piece of equipment you want is called 'practice'
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: Escsrc
Date: 2007-01-01 20:07
Yes. It's rather expensive though: time. A LOT of practice goes into those issues (at least, they do for me). For the Bb in particular: listen to the alternate ("proper" fingering; A + 3rd side trill) and then go back and try to get your chromatic Bb sounding as close to it as you can. That always helps a bit, I've seen.
If theres any other one piece of equipment that you'd want to pick up, that's more books! There are tons of methods out there, if you only stick to one it'll get dry, and some really do have exercises that target specific issues like the ones you've mentioned. They're also the cheapest next to reeds
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Author: Mags1957
Date: 2007-01-01 20:36
To answer you question, there are many different barrels that some people feel help them with intonation, throat tones, etc. As many have mentioned, it's not a "fix", you'll still need to work on those problem areas. BUT many have had succes with Chadash, Fobes, Backun and other barrels. I have a Backun barrel that I realy like, and before that I had a Chadash - both of these barrels I thought were much better than the "stock" barrel that came with my clarinet. Try to find a music store with these barrels, or check this board's sponsors - many of them sell very nice barrels. They should be able to send you a few barrels on trial, and they are returnable if you don't find what you want (you will be charged for the shipping).
Another route to take is to make sure you are always playing on great reeds. Make sure you are buying a premium reed (Vandoren, Rico Grand Concert, Gonzales FOF, etc.) and do a little research on how to break them in and work on them. I believe David Cane has a good article on reeds on that website - or do a search on this board. I highly recommend the ATG reed system by Tom Ridenour - you can get it directly from him on his website. It's super easy, it really works, and it comes with everthing you need to make 95% of your reeds very very playable. Good luck, and when you get the perfect barrel/reed, pull out the Vade Mecum and get to work!
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Author: kkocman
Date: 2007-01-01 20:45
I was thinking of buying the Chadash because intonation is another thing that I need work on. And the stock barrel that came with my E-11 is way too short. So I always have to pull out a lot just to remain in tune. The website I'm looking at says that it comes in 66mm and 67mm..is there a big difference between the two? Sorry I'm asking so many questions =p
Post Edited (2007-01-01 20:47)
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Author: GBK
Date: 2007-01-01 20:47
The E-11, with the stock (64.5mm) barrel is pitched at A=442 ...GBK
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2007-01-01 21:29
Disclaimer: I make and sell barrels.
Fuzzy throat tones can be helped by barrel changes. BUT, I would first check the register and A/G# keys etc. Also see how you sound with someone else's instrument and vice verse. Also consider how far out you have pulled the barrel...do you need a tuning ring?? What about the mouthpiece bore size?
Following this analysis, you can then consider barrel hunting.
So many variables, so many acoustic equations, no wonder "golden ears" beat physics most of the time
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2007-01-02 00:55
Out of curiosity, are you studying with a good private instructor? If so, what does that person recommend? If not, perhaps that would be a good place to look, first, before seeking out a magic bullet to fix what may be curable with applied work.
As to your question about barrel length, obviously, shorter barrels play sharper. Longer ones will lower your pitch to the point where you do not have to pull out so much. The difference between the 66 and 67 mm barrels is (obviously) one mm. Which one will best address your needs depends on your individual circumstances and is best determined by trying out a few at a store that stocks these accessories. If that is not possible, check with a mail house that will send you several "on approval."
Jeff
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Author: pewd
Date: 2007-01-02 03:30
>intonation is another thing that I need work on. And the stock barrel that came with my E-11 is way too short.
now i have enough information to prompt a bit different response.
as stated above, e11's are too sharp (a-442).
you can either switch to a 13 series mouthpiece or a 65 or 66mm barrel.
i'd probably go with a 66mm buffet or segal barrel first, and if its still sharp, switch from a M30 to a M30-13 mouthpiece.
it won't solve the tone quality issue, thats mostly a practice issue - long tones...
the throat Bb - are you using the A key / 2nd trill key fingering wherever possible?
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-01-02 05:01
as far as tone and frusteration goes, here is a bit of advice that helped me when I was in High school. my band teacher gave me one idea that stopped me from undue upset. here it is, 'Your tone is a result of how your muscles work and your bones and muscles are not fully grown. be patient and practice, but don't worry so much about tone until you are fully grown.' I waited, and when I was 18 I had the sound I wanted. Patience is a virtue.
-S
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Author: Caco185
Date: 2007-01-02 07:26
Here is something to try kkocman:
Professor Kennen White at Central Michigan University introduced what he calls; "resonance fingerings," to me. For B-flat using the A key, along with the register key, you want to add the third finger on your left hand, the third finger and the "C/F" key on your right hand.
These work wonderfully for me and students. Improves intonation, resonance and tone quality. :-)
I also agree that tons and tons of practice will help. It's all about practice my friend.
Please.. Let me know if this works..
Best wishes!!!
Dale Huggard
Clarinet Performance Major, Michigan
Buffet R-13 - Silver plated
Genussa Excellente
Spriggs Floating Rail Ligature
Vandoren V12 #4
Post Edited (2007-01-02 07:30)
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Author: Caco185
Date: 2007-01-02 07:30
Mags1957.. Do you happen to have the URL to David Cane's website? I would love to read his article on reeds.
Thanks!
Dale
Dale Huggard
Clarinet Performance Major, Michigan
Buffet R-13 - Silver plated
Genussa Excellente
Spriggs Floating Rail Ligature
Vandoren V12 #4
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-01-02 08:05
About resonance fingerings - try as many different combinations using everything from one to all other fingers to find the best fingering. It might be a different fingering that works best for each throat note.
It's also very possible that the A pad is too low, which will cause both the A and Bb to sound stuffy. What I did was to put a pretty chick cork on my throat A key, and very slowly sanding very little and checking every time until the tuning was as flat as possible without damaging the tone.
I suggest not to buy a new barrel to improve the sound, but only if you need a longer (or shorter) barrel. If you do get one, make sure (if possible) you can return it. Best if you can find barrels in different lengths in a store and try them all to see which one works best. Personally I wouldn't buy a barrel, but save to buy a better clarinet later.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2007-01-02 11:21
Caco185 wrote:
> Mags1957.. Do you happen to have the URL
> to David Cane's website? I would love to read his article on reeds.
http://www.daviecane.com/Pages/FAQ.html ...GBK
Disclaimer: I am listed on the Davie Cane website as an artist/endorser.
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Author: LarryBocaner ★2017
Date: 2007-01-02 13:06
I have had a number of students with E11's who have experienced the same problems as "kkocman". In many cases replacing the original barrel with an R13 66mm barrel improved both the tone and the intonation of the clarinet.
Local (Alexandria, VA) repairman Tony Valenti has made barrels for some of my students, at a very affordable price and with excellent results. (One of them is so good that I'm using it on my R13!).
One student who was having intonation problems solved them with a "new" bell from Dave Spiegelthal's junk drawer. In as much as Dave is only a few minutes from Manassas (?) you might go that route first.
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Author: KellyA
Date: 2007-01-04 19:23
Don't doubt your E11. A friend of mine who plays on call for the MN Orchestra says that some of her students have E11's that play better than some of the R13's she has played. The m30 is also a nice mouthpiece as well. Others have given you great advice so far. For my Bb, I will "vent" it by holding down my whole right fingerings all the way to low F. I only do this for sustained passages where the stuffiness is obvious. This seems to help me with clarity. And remember, there are no set rules to "venting" as long as it doesn't interfere with tuning, so experiment till you find what works.
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