 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Aussie Nick
Date: 2006-04-11 06:52
Hello. I've been playing ona Greg Smith 1++ Chedville mouthpiece for a few years now and have just started post graduate study and changed teachers. The new teacher is suggesting a change of mouthpiece so I have been through a whole bunch of Vandorens and Lomax and Selmer. What works best for me was the B40 and a B40 13 but it was too low in pitch for me. I am going to try and M30 again, but I wasn't really into it when I tried the M30's.
My question is IF I were to order some mouthpieces from the states to try, what do you think might suit me or be similar to a B40? I'm thinking of brands like Pyne, Bay...and god knows how many others. I have to do some more research myself, but any advice on similar mouthpieces?
Cheers
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Author: Clarinetcola
Date: 2006-04-11 11:02
I use M30,but it needs a stiffer reed than B40 to work well. I really like it
Nathan
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Author: graham
Date: 2006-04-11 11:06
refer to the following for further ideas:
www.pillingermouthpieces.co.uk/Facings.html
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Author: Yellowhornblower
Date: 2006-04-11 15:00
Aussie Nick,
I don't know what kind of music you are studying, but it doesn't matter because I am recommending you to try the (crystal) Pomarico mpc. Particularly, the Nigun model is very easy-blowing and not to heavy. If you play jazz, they also have a mpc called - you guessed it - jazz. There are two sizes of the jazz mpc: * and **. The latter has a larger opening tip than the former. I play the jazz*, and it sings.
The thought of a crystal mpc may sound strange to you, but once you try it, there is a chance you will never want to blow another ebonite mpc again!
I hope this helps.
My profile can be viewed at www.thangthecolumnist.blogspot.com
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Leblanc Sonata clarinet and a Yamaha YSS-475 soprano sax
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Author: Tom Puwalski
Date: 2006-04-12 02:26
Sorry I'm a incredible sceptic, I don't play on Greg Smith mouthpieces, but these fall into the category of good gear that people play and sound very good on. If I had a student and I thought this student needed to sound in some way differently, the mouthpiece would not be what I'd be looking at. Has the teacher articulated what they think a new mouthpiece will fix? I'd look first at embouchure, voicing, and breathing and most importantly tonal concept! Now a teacher might say, you're playing a facing that's too open, to short, too long than what you're playing. You mentioned that you're playing 1++, I just looked at Gregs web site, I don't know his facings I would presume it's more open than the 1, so why not get another Greg Smith in a different facing? I'll say this once, BEWARE OF TEACHERS sugesting equiptment changes.
Tom Puwalski, former soloist with the US Army Field Band, Clarinetist with Lox&Vodka, and Author of "The Clarinetist's Guide to Klezmer"and most recently by the order of the wizard of Oz, for supreme intelligence, a Masters in Clarinet performance
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Author: bufclar
Date: 2006-04-12 03:14
Greg Smith mouthpieces are some of the best made mouthpieces on the market right now. I would be skeptical of a teacher who wants you to change equipment. And a teacher saying to ditch the Greg Smith and try Vandorens is crazy. Use caution Aussie Nick.
Greg is very helpful and can alter your current mouthpiece at any time. Also as Tom said, maybe try a different facing.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2006-04-12 03:23
I would seriously question changing mouthpieces. I tend to switch mouthpieces very often, but only because I personally feel the need or have found something I like better. I've been through a lot of great mouthpieces, but I really would feel VERY skeptical about changing equipment as per the suggestions of an instructor. Especially if I'm comfortable with what I have. Are you comfortable and do you like the Greg Smith? If so, I would just stick with it and explain (try to anyway) to your teacher that you like your current setup.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
Post Edited (2006-04-12 03:38)
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2006-04-12 05:35
FYI
Vandren B40 is for thin(2.5-3) reed player. It was developed by Guy Deplus. Greg Smith is for 3.5-4.
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Author: graham
Date: 2006-04-12 07:44
If you seriously question the equipment advice of a teacher then you have seriously to question whether he or she is the teacher for you. In theory there should have been a good reason in any case for going to that teacher (at post grad level). If the first thing Aussie Nick is going to do is apply scepticism to his teacher's suggestions, then he might as well give up lessons and just play the thing as he wishes.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2006-04-12 08:19
"What works best for me was the B40"
By best do you mean better than the Greg Smith mouthpiece? If yes you can look into trying the B40 with a shorter barrel maybe (unfortunately that would mean spending even more money)? As far as I understand (and I'm no expert) a lower pitch mouthpiece, the same as a longer barrel, will affect the open notes more than the closed notes, so a shorter barrel could be a solution.
For me the 13 series mouthpieces are very flat so I'd say don't even bother with them if the regular B40 was a little flat.
"saying to ditch the Greg Smith and try Vandorens is crazy"
I don't see that the teacher said anything like that. Either way, many top professional clarinetists play Vandoren mouthpieces. The poster even said the Vandoren was better for her than another hand finished mouthpiece - Lomax. It's possible that a Vandoren mouthpiece would be better for her than the Smith - which might be the best mouthpiece for someone else.
To quote mouthpiece maker Chris Hill from a recent thread: "There are many mouthpieces out there that work well for people, so please don't make blanket statements putting down what others believe is the best for them."
About the mouthpieces you asked about - Pyne, Bay and other American mouthpieces (or is Pyne British?) I've tried a lot of them, but not many from each type. For Bb clarinet I've tried a couple of Pynes, Bays, Grabners, Fobes. I've also tried all of those for bass, but only one of each.
My personal favorite was the Fobes, with the Grabner very close. I didn't like the Bay and Pyne mouthpieces at all, and that was the same for both Bb and bass.
Last thing I will say, is sometimes you need to be careful who you trust on these matters. For example, we have a very good teacher here, and his students and some of the best players. Unfortunately he takes every chance he gets to ask me if I want to start saxophone too. Why? Because if I buy a saxophone from the store connected through him, he gets big discounts for buyng stuff from them. The more people he brings the bigger discounts he gets. He is also a connection to a very good mouthpiece maker from my country (who is now living abroad) and last two times I saw him he suggested I buy a mouthpiece. Of course, he will get a commision for it, and he doesn't care at all if I actually need this mouthpiece.
We have learned to take the good things from him and just ignore all his "commercials". Make sure this is not the case with your teacher.
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Author: Aussie Nick
Date: 2006-04-12 08:29
The only thing I was really asking was for some similar mouthpieces (in design etc) to the B40. Graham is right, there is a good reason for being with this teacher who is very well respected (plays with Sydney Symphony and has played with London Symphony). I've been using quite firm reeds (4's) on my Greg Smith, and this teacher plays very soft reeds on a Selmer he has refaced himself. He wants my sound to open up more and not sound as pinched and tight as it was. To do this he wants me to try using softer reeds on a different mouthpiece and loosening up my facial muscles which tend to tense up when I play. Vandoren mouthpieces which take softer reeds ie. B40 is just somewhere to start. I am hoping to find others that play similarly to these, but for the moment we have settled on a B40Lyre which plays quite nicely and allows me to get closer to the sound we are working towards. I think my teacher is soon expecting some Bradford Behns to arrive so that will be interesting.
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Author: Tom Puwalski
Date: 2006-04-12 12:29
In the USA we have this show on National public radio, called Car Talk. Two brothers with advanced degrees in some rocket science or another answer questions regarding car problems for listeners. They do this over the radio with just the symptoms described to them
You have given me enough information for me to make the following diagnosis.
You are looking for a mouthpiece that's more open than your Greg Smith. Because you feel you can't use a softer reed on it because it will close up on you. Ok here's the diagnosis. Too much embouchure pressure to close to the tip of the reed. Next time you have a lesson with this teacher ask him or her if that is indeed not the case. There is an underlying problem that is going to take some time and very attentive practice to fix. A switch to a more open mouthpiece will solve the problem for about 2 weeks and I guarantee you will have to problem again. I feel you really have to let the reed fully vibrate if you want to get that "resonance" in the sound. The mouthpieces I play have the facing equivalent of an M13, close and long. I play with either V12 3.5s of evolution 3.5s. Believe or not those aren't too soft on this style mouthpiece. But believe me in the last few years I've really worked at not inhibiting the reeds vibration at all. Something a lot of us who've played in large bands seem to do for some reason.
Every mouthpiece and reed combination has a "zone" where your bottom lip needs to be get this maximum reed vibration. Find this on your Greg Smith, try a softer reed. And really try to get the sound that you're striving for.If you get closer you will have a skill that will allow you to be able to try other mouthpieces more effectively, if you start sounding exactly how you want to, you will have won an elusive skill and eliminated a trip down "holy grail lane"
Tom Puwalski, former soloist with the US Army Field Band, Clarinetist with Lox&Vodka, and Author of "The Clarinetist's Guide to Klezmer"and most recently by the order of the wizard of Oz, for supreme intelligence, a Masters in Clarinet performance
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2006-04-12 22:40
I have a French style mouthpiece made by Alexander Wilscher of Germany.It works well with a Vandoren 2.5 reed.The blank seems very nice. It's heavy.
Since I have a Greg Smith Kasper style mouthpiece I know that the tone becomes rather metalic when played with a 2.5 reed on it. With this mouthpiece, a Rigotti 3.5 works better in my case.
Wilscher's URL is found in the link page of this German reed maker. It also has tips such as a method to let thick reed work well or that a reed used on a different mouthpiece should not be used for a new mouthpiece.
http://www.foglietta.de/UK/index.htm
BTW:European players seem to play softer and more controllable reeds (2.5-3). Kroeker, Leister, Deplus, Lancelot.
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2006-04-13 14:13
I, too, have a bit of a problem of going from a Greg Smith to a Vandoren. The best thing you could do is to contact Greg directly (he hangs around the bboard some and has a website for his mouthpieces) and ask him what he would recommend. He might suggest a reface on your mouthpiece (you've been playing it a while anyway) that would fix the problem. If you want one more like the Vandoren V40 tell him what you like about it. He would make one for you that would be superior! And, you can quote me.
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Author: Scotti
Date: 2006-04-13 14:24
Aussie Nick said:
"...I've been playing ona Greg Smith 1++ Chedville mouthpiece for a few years now..."
While Greg Smith may suggest a reface to accomodate what Nick is asking for, I don't think this time of use would constitute a refacing for the sake of refacing. Speaking relatively, he has not "been playing it for a while anyway."
Based on the previous posts, it's likely Nick should go in the way of a different mouthpiece brand. There's nothing wrong with that. I'm sure Greg Smith would understand the need to follow a teacher's advice and try new things.
The best way to try a new mouthpiece is to give it time. That means shelving everything else for a week to give yourself time to properly adjust.
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Author: Aussie Nick
Date: 2006-04-13 16:06
Greg has already contacted me and was very helpful as usual. All I can do at this point is work with my new teacher who's playing I idolise. If I don't want to follow his advice and adapt my playing style to his taste, then I shouldn't be with him. I am willing to give it a try and I can always come back to my Greg Smith, or ask Greg to reface it or make me something more characteristic of what I'm after. I have been very happy with my Greg Smith mouthpiece for 2nd a half years, and still think very highly of them and Greg.
Thanks to those of you who understood my 'original' question and offered good advice.
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