 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: missclarinetist
Date: 2005-08-30 12:33
Here's something new to discuss:
Nowadays, everybody is listening to something other than 'classical music'. As a music major, in order to annoy my roommates 24/7, I turn on my classical music in my dorm room and give the excuse that I'm trying to educate them in appreciating classical music. Anybody try doing this? If you were to teach a class of junior high students who are already listening to other kinds of music like rock, alternative etc. How would you get them to appreciate classical music in this world we live in?
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2005-08-30 12:43
If your true goal is to get people to appreciate Western art music, you might want to rethink the idea of annoying these people with the same music you wish to have them appreciate.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-08-30 12:48
Movie music - start out with that stuff as they can relate something to it.
Go from there. However, often it's like trying to teach a pig manners. You won't get anything accomplished and it angers the pig.
(it's too early to remember the exact analogy, but you get the point.... 
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Author: Sovek
Date: 2005-08-30 13:53
classical music is for those that are smarter IMHO, anyone can make a rock band a success it seems, just get 2-6 people, then get noticed. for classical music it all depends on the peice, you could have anywhere from 2-30 people. I dont think there is anyway to turn this trend around either. As a Christian I am disgusted that many faith professing churches are turning away from good melodius (spelling??) music to this repulsive, disgusting and chaotic genre.
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2005-08-30 14:34
Sovek, although I, like you, prefer church services with non-rock music (I couldn't say "traditional" music, because there are good modern hymns as well.), I got the impression that, by your use of the phrase "faith professing churches", you were indicating that the use and enjoyment of rock was less than Christian. I have to disagree, stating that I know of nothing in the Bible specifying the instrumentation, rhythm patterns, etc. that should be used in church music, so those using such music aren't necessarily less Christian. (In fact, some churches avoid instrumental music altogether because the Bible doesn't mention its use in worship.) Although the terms "jazz" and "rock-n-roll" both originally had quite vulgar meanings, as long as the intent and lyrics of the music is spiritual and not meant to evoke thoughts or feelings of a vulgar nature, I see nothing wrong with it being used. But, I too prefer more melodious music.
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Author: chipper
Date: 2005-08-30 15:03
Got my children, teen age boys, interested through Philip Glass, Powaquatsi, the sound track from Phantom of the Opera, Paul Winter Consort, among others. Listen to "angry teenage music" and you'll see that it's all about the energy at that stage of life, with teen boys, anyway. Introduce the energy and the style of music is less important to them. Besides, they get to feel more educated than their peers and this leads to me introducing their friends to music their parents wouldn't listen to. The other thing I do is discuss the roots of their pop music.
C
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2005-08-30 15:10
Another good idea would be to invite your roommates to your concerts. ("Please! It would really mean a lot to me if you were there.") They may not normally go for the music itself, but to hear you perform. Once there, they will enjoy the performance and perhaps decide explore other, similar concerts.
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2005-08-30 15:50
WATCH OUT: Just because its "Classical" doesn't mean that its worth lisetning to.
Give 'em the Good Stuff.
Bob Phillips
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Author: Markael
Date: 2005-08-30 16:08
Crank it!
Missclarinetist is right in wanting to give her roommates some samples of classical music. Taste in music is like taste in food and drink; it has to be cultivated.
Musical categories--I love them and hate them.
Let's think of categories as permeable boundaries, not stone walls.
The first thing to do in encouraging open-mindedness in others is to examine one's own attitudes. Musical snobs come in all shapes and sizes.
I find Sovek's blanket statements about classical and rock music to be offensive.
It's important to realize that, in large part, the creative cutting edge is and always has been at the intersection of different types and genres of music. The greatest of them all, J. S. Bach, used tunes he had heard on the pipes as inspiration for much of his keyboard music.
Both classical and jazz have adapted and expanded on folk tunes. (I'm afraid that copyright laws have slowed this down considerably.) It would be presumptuous indeed to look down on these sources of inspiration.
And the simpler forms of music offer a passion and immediacy that sometimes is forgotten in the finer points of musical interpretation.
In recent revivals of various types of "roots" music, people are realizing that these "simpler"type of music may have more to offer than was previously thought. You might expect a violinist trained in the finest schools of Europe to be a virtuoso, but what about a blind boy from the mountains of North Carolina who taught himself how to flat pick fiddle tunes on a guitar? (Doc Watson)
The best music is durable, and can not only stand the test of time, but can be reworked convincingly into different genres.
Back to Bach: Bach tunes have been reworked as rock, jazz, and who knows what else.
I teach alongside of a guitar teacher who likes classical and heavy metal. He has taught me an appreciation for heavy metal, showing how the lead guitarists of the '80's got their inspiration straight from Bach.
If you like jazz with horns, I recommend the CD, Bach 2000, by the David Matthews Manhattan Jazz Orchestra.
I could go on and on.
Give 'em a taste of the good stuff. Taste can be cultivated. Look at all the micro beers and international foods that were not available a couple decades ago. There is hope.
Post Edited (2005-08-30 16:21)
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Author: RodRubber
Date: 2005-08-30 16:20
WATCH OUT: Just because its "Classical" doesn't mean that its worth lisetning to.
Give 'em the Good Stuff.
I agree with the position from Bob! Some of my friends who didn't really dig classical music thought it was all like "just strings and very dull" I played them a couple of my favorite wks - Symphonies of Wind Instruments by Stravinsky, and other stuff like that. After that, they were slightly more siked up about going to here me play in "histoire du soldat" Also, kids are a lot more attracted to the rhythms and sounds of 20th century works like bartok string quartets, and are generally bored by things like Albinoni or other erstwhile composers of the day!
best wishes
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-08-30 16:36
" As a Christian I am disgusted that many faith professing churches are turning away from good melodius (spelling??) music to this repulsive, disgusting and chaotic genre."
------------------
I went to a nearby synagogue where they were playing all "new age crapola" instead of the traditional tunes.
I left never to return.
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Author: bflatclarinetist
Date: 2005-08-30 17:17
My age, people think classical music is "boring" and ignorant people ask "how can you listen to that?".
I was gonna play classical clarinet at a talent show but I refused because the audience probably won't appreciate it since the school's a "hip hop school".
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2005-08-30 17:20
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> I went to a nearby synagogue where they were playing all "new
> age crapola" instead of the traditional tunes.
The crapola of yesterday is the traditional of today ...
(Well, maybe not the real crapola, but I'm sure a lot of the tunes weren't appreciated far from their homes ...)
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Author: Markael
Date: 2005-08-30 17:30
My Dad used to say that the classics are classics because they have stood the test of time. He went on to say that that doesn't mean classics aren't being produced in the present. It just means that time weeds out crapola.
Contemporary worship music is very trendy. Much of it will go the way of the leisure suit.
Most of all, with religious music it is important to make a distinction between "I personally am not moved by this" and "This is a sacrilege."
Post Edited (2005-08-30 18:16)
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Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2005-08-30 17:35
Yes, there has been much great music that was not appreciated when it was originally composed. New age style in a synagogue is certainly an interesting choice, though, given that the New Age, among other attributes, seems to set itself up as an alternative or even in opposition to Judeo-Christian religious practice. However, instrumentalists often do take some of the harmonies and sounds they hear out of the popular culture and incorporate them into the "art music" they are making, either sacred or secular. I played in a religiously themed show once that was written in the 1940s, and the score reflected the conventions of film writing of that era. It wasn't bad, and that kind of writing can be a musical bridge for the audience that might not dive right into Beethoven.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2005-08-30 18:55
I'll never forget when I was in 7th grade and our band director (who also played trumpet in a rock band, back in the days when rock bands sometimes had horn sections), invited some of us to come over to his apartment to hear his new stereo system. He played for us Stravinsky's "Sacre du Printemps" and Janacek's "Sinfonietta" and we were all blown away. Every one of us kids in the room that day became confirmed fans of classical music --- whereas, had he played (sorry to say this, clarinetists!) Mozart or something like that, we would have been bored to tears for the most part -- with who knows what long-term results.
I agree with Bob -- give 'em the good stuff --- and I don't mean music from the 1700s or 1800s that will turn kids off --- give them some powerful 20th century orchestral music that will "rock their world".
Take those heavy-metal listeners and play some of the climactic orchestral music from Alban Berg's "Wozzeck" opera and see if they aren't moved just a little...............
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Author: Clarinetgirl06
Date: 2005-08-30 21:27
" As a Christian I am disgusted that many faith professing churches are turning away from good melodius (spelling??) music to this repulsive, disgusting and chaotic genre."
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Well speaking as a younger generation Christian, I think the only thing that truly matters is someone's heart condition while they're singing and if they are actually worshipping or not. As a musician and lover of classical music myself, sometimes it's hard not to get caught up in the style of music and whether you like it or not. BUT, I then step back and read/listen to the words and what truth or view of praise it is taking- then I can appreciate the song. Sometimes, being a younger person, it's hard for me to get into hymns and so I end up sight reading the alto line most of the time-but when I actually take time to read and let the words sink in, then I can see why the older generations love these hymns.
Another way to get a young person like me to like classical music is to introduce them musicals. Also, as mentioned above, soundtracks are a great way too. Maybe have them listen to a soundtrack like Charlie and the Chocolate Factory (Danny Elfman), Prince of Egypt, Nightmare Before Christmas, etc. I love soundtracks!
Also, if you want to get them into clarinet music you could try some Benny Goodman/Artie Shaw or..... go the more contemporary route like Robert Spring's CDs Black Dog and Dragon Tongue. Has Flight of the Bumblebee, Black dog based of Led Zeppelin, and a piece based off of Alice and Chains.
Good luck!
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-08-30 21:46
Personally, I just let them be. They can listen to their music, and I'll listen to mine. End of discussion. If they happen to overhear something they like, I'll let them know what it is, and offer to play something similar to it, but eventually my friends all end up asking me to turn on the radio anyway.
My rules are that if I'm in MY car, we listen to MY music. (Hence I never have to drive and I'm saving a TON of money on gas!!!!)
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2005-08-30 22:30
Alexi, the only problem with your approach is that, unfortunately, the audience for classical music is getting old and dying off and soon you may not be able to just turn on your car radio and listen to what YOU want to hear. It's already happened here in the DC area -- in many parts of the metro area we are limited to ONE classical station (all the others have changed formats, or gone 'part-time classical', or their signals simply can't be received in many parts of the region) and this one station is the classical equivalent of Top-40 or 'smooth jazz' -- their programming is total mainstream pablum, they only play one movement of any given symphony (which is almost always Beethoven, Mozart or Haydn, day or night) so that they can get their 32 commercials per hour in, and they rarely even mention the names of the performers because again that would cut into their jabber time. And it's partly because you and I have taken the "I don't care what anyone else listens to" attitude that a new, young audience for classical hasn't developed. The music is dying, folks, along with its main audience -- at least in the U.S. We'd better do some marketing of this stuff to our peers and younger people, or the music WILL disappear.
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Author: Brenda
Date: 2005-08-30 22:49
Just a thought about Biblical references to the use of music in worship - there are many of them. FYI - In the time of the Jews and their worship in Solomon's temple, mention is made of the hundreds of trained singers and horn players. There are composers and music directors mentioned, some by name. Historians recognize that "the choruses and orchestras show a high standard of music education and skill" (source available on request). The harp was extensively used, indicating that they had knowledge of harmonization. In the early Christian times, Jesus and his apostles sang songs after the last supper, and the early Christians likely composed songs other than the Psalms, as they sang "spiritual songs and accompanied themselves with songs to God". Again, historians note that singing was a matter of course for these early Christians, references are available to anyone interested.
We can be sure that these were respectful but joyous songs.
Thought some of you would like to know.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-08-31 00:25
Very true Dave. However after trying and trying and trying again, it ends up being pretty fruitless. All my friends (most of them in their early twenties, a few older) are so biased AGAINST classical that they won't even TRY to listen to it. And so it's one of those situations where my efforts fall upon deaf ears. Oh believe me, I invite them to EVERY concert and EVERY get-together that I either am a part of or attend (invited them all to the upcoming Clarinet Day on the 18th, and they will ALL be invited to my christmas concerts). However they never show up.
But like I said before, whenever I'm the one driving, or whenever they're visiting me in my house, it's MY music. But there comes a time when I have to face the fact that they're never going to come around.
Alexi
PS - Dave, if you're reading this, did you get my email? I responded to the one you sent me and seeing as my other two didn't go through I'm wondering if this one didn't either . . . please let me know via MY email (since I can seem to get yours . . .)
US Army Japan Band
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Author: BlockEyeDan
Date: 2005-08-31 00:53
Regarding the demographics of classical music listeners:
The only disheartening aspect of attending symphonies in Hartford, Providence, or NYC is the abundance of canes, hearing aids, and other accoutrements of the elderly. I lament the fact that I am usually one of maybe 5 20-somethings in a concert hall of several hundred. This music is TOO GOOD to let its pleasures die off with our elderly. Part of my life's mission has been to propagate the love and appreciation of this music in others....if people like us don't do it, nobody else will.
Dan
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Author: Brenda
Date: 2005-08-31 02:37
Well there's a very young audience for some special classical music, but presentation is everything!! The old cartoons use a lot of the classics and the kids don't know what's being presented to them. Imagine years later they're listening to a concert or a CD and bingo, there's the same composition! It's now familiar to them. So if we take a clue from that... Presentation, and context.
When you start feeding babies their solid foods you don't force them to eat an entire bowl of broccoli or even cereal. It's presented little by little each day, and sometimes combined with other things to make it more palatable. So why should we expect our friends to like the classics if we insist on keeping it on for hours at a time? That's a sure way to close minds. We could choose to be selective and play specific pieces for short periods of time so it's more like an appetizer.
Here in Toronto there was a CBC radio program about kids wandering the streets with nothing to do during their summer vacations. Some stores will play classical music to discourage the young people from loitering, but this report said that the technique doesn't work for 10-12 yr. olds. So what's that say about the ages we should be reaching? The reaching out needs to start young.
Many of you would know examples of this. Here's mine: my kids have been exposed to all sorts of music and they also played in the school bands. They understand that some of the top-40 stuff isn't very intelligent when compared to the composition and performace skills that go into classical music. Their musical tastes are all over the map and include Central American and Carribean music, East Coast Celtic fiddle, Big Band Swing, plus some new and unusual rock compositions that are actually pretty neat! They also have their favourite classics. So music appreciation doesn't end with the classics, that would be too narrow a view, but can encompass a large range. What I don't like to see is when people are raised to think that only the radio's top 40 or top 100 is the only music around.
The other thing is that perhaps music appreciation is acheived more easily with maturity - once that foundation has been laid, that is. Many people talk about complaing about their parents' tastes in music, like opera or whatever, only to find that as they age they like it very much themselves.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-08-31 03:13
"but this report said that the technique doesn't work for 10-12 yr. olds."
That's because the other alternative is to be with their parents - listening to the same stuff.......
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Author: pzaur
Date: 2005-08-31 05:08
Why not start with the classics...you know...Looney Tunes, Fantasia, Peter and the Wolf. Host a Looney Tunes marathon or a Tiny Toons marathon. It's amazing how many of my students recognize pieces from cartoons.
Symphonie Fantastique is a great piece to introduce classical with. Start with the dream sequence and the head being cut off and bouncing twice. It's amazing how fast people's interest peaks. Also the dancing of the witches is fantastic. This might be a little dark for the younger children. A friend of mine went to hear the Chicago Symphony perform this with me. Not a classical fan. But knowing the story behind it, he loved the visualization of everything in his own mind.
A reason for not enjoying/listening to classical music is that it takes mental effort and concentration to do so. My view is that a lot of people who don't like listening to classical don't like it because they lack or aren't willing to use the concentration demanded by it to enjoy the end product. Pop music is extremely accessible from the get go. Just listen to most anything being put out today and you can figure out the "deeper" meaning of it in a matter of seconds. This is a "I want it now. Give it to me. I don't need to work for it" generation.
The only way people will start to "appreciate" classical is if they begin to understand classical. Classical is still thought of as very elitist by many people. Start with what they recognize and introduce the complete versions of the pieces.
United Airlines - Rhapsody in Blue
4th of July/Bugs Bunny - 1812 Overture (huh...a Russian piece for our day?)
Lone Ranger/Looney Tunes - William Tell Overture
Looney Tunes - Barber of Seville and other Wagner favorites
...and many others!
-pat
Who is still hoping for the other editions of Looney Toons on DVD.
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-08-31 06:11
Classical music has stagnated. If you look historically at what is being played... people didn't really start playing "old" music (i.e. not recently written) until late classical IIRC, when Bach was rediscovered. In the past eighty or so years, it seems that for every ten years that pass, we only play music two years newer than before as standard repertoire. (e.g. from 1990 to 2000 we may have bumped the line up from 1938 to 1940)
Somewhere along the line, the new stuff got stuck. There are a lot of reasons for it... audiences made up by greying money that want to hear what was popular when they were young, non-"classical" music that relates better to younger generations, hostile concert halls, modernist "screw you, uneducated listener!" attitudes, eternity complexes, elitist "don't compromise your vision" composers, academia, fear of trying something new, ensembles that are unwilling to trust audiences with new music, people getting their fill of orchestral from films, philosophies that music must be actively and intellectually listened to, universities that play standards so that their performers will be able to get a job playing those same standards rather than going out on a limb and trying new things, composers who write "things they like to write" and "things the audience will like to hear" and don't try to reconcile the two concepts, the thought that a piece must be hard to play and to listen to in order to be substantial, the fact that "classical" music has unilaterally declared itself "culture," etc.
Heck, classical music has a TON of baggage for everyone involved.
Performers that siphon off what might normally be classical concertgoers, e.g. Yanni, John Tesh, Kenny G, etc., are easy to blame and their listeners are easy to dismiss as "uncultured," but frankly, if we were playing things worth listening to I don't think our halls would be so empty.
Really, though, if you're setting up an ensemble that plays music primarily from a 100-year period that ended 60 years ago, I would expect your audiences to dwindle to the niche and nostalgia audiences. We don't complain about the lack of massive worldwide audiences for piano rags.
Given what it is, I don't see why we're all shocked and dismayed. AFAIK, there aren't ska message boards that hypothesize about how to get friends to listen to ska because if they don't then all the good ska bands will go under and nobody will play it any more. You listen to it yourself, and play it when other people are around. If they're into it, cool. If not, that's fine.
My mom doesn't chastise people for not listening to country, why do we chastise people for not listening to classical?
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: allencole
Date: 2005-08-31 06:55
What REALLY blows me away is the fact that many students spend 7-9 years in school band and orchestras but STILL don't develop an appreciation for classical music.
Allen Cole
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Author: claril
Date: 2005-08-31 08:21
Hi just my thoughts..
Church music should be classical music and hymns, that's how it is because many mnay years ago in the beginning that was the way it was, no rock when church concepts came about.
Plus, persoanally classical music is so much more "friendly" (and educated) to my ears and represents it properly.
I think I agree with the first blogger of this topic whereby get them listening to it a lot or along those lines because the more you hear it the more your ears will cutom to liking it.
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Author: Markael
Date: 2005-08-31 11:46
re: Looney Tunes.
Some of the kids today haven't had a chance to see Bugs Bunny.
A have a MIDI of Grieg's Morning Song that goes along with a piano method book. I play it for students and whisper, "Be vewwy, vewwy quiet."
About half of them think it's funny and the other half don't get it.
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Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2005-08-31 14:11
Alex, you have brought up a host of contributing phenonema. I am impressed with your thoughtfulness as a performer and composer.
FWIW, I have noticed that the audience for the community orch I am in is actually less grey-haired than the audience for the local professional orchestra. Sure the seniors in town go to the concerts, but the atmosphere is also more family friendly. It is heartening to see people bringing their children, and if somebody becomes fidgety and uncomfortable and needs to go for a walk out in the hallway, that's fine. Some of their favorites recently have been Barber of Seville Overture, the Polovetsian Dances, and Bugler's holiday with our trumpet section in front. Sure, I'd like to play more symphonies, but our audiences are warm, and the organization runs in the black.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2005-08-31 14:54
They have been playing Carmina Burana in my church lately and it seems to be going over OK.
Bob Draznik
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Author: Ron Jr.
Date: 2005-08-31 15:45
As a rule we prefer the familiar. Just by inviting people over and playing classical music will help them to be more accustomed to it. For instance I always play baroque music for brunch.
For a more active approach invite a friend to hear a big romantic symphony like Beethoven's ninth. Three weeks before the concert lend them the cd. Two weeks before sit down with an Eulenberg edition and use your finger, a Yad works well for this, and walk them throught the music as they hear it. You can point out crescendi, instrumental solos, and the passing of the theme from one section to another.
And for the lowest of budgets you can simply turn on a cd and walk them through the symphony or chamber piece.
By making them more familiar with the music in general, they will become more interested.
Ron Jr.
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Author: Markael
Date: 2005-08-31 16:38
Boy, Ron, you have a plan!
Perhaps you could have them listen to Peter Chickadee's [sic. I know his name] treatment of Beethoven's Fifth as a baseball announcer.
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Author: idahofats
Date: 2005-08-31 17:04
We, as classical/orchestral enthusiasts, are now in a vanishing minority. How do we change that? Subvert the dominant paradigm!!! Dribble our music back into the mainstream whenever we can, in little gobbets, as if by accident, with an air of apologetic embarrassment for offending the ears of the rock and country crowd. Co-opt their songwriters and performers, get them hooked on our stuff, so that they feel compelled to spread the addiction---it worked for jazz artists in the Thirties, Swing artists in the Forties, and Elvis and his contemporaries stole/borrowed from folk and classical in helping to launch rock. Do to them what they done to us! Heck, Beethoven and Tchaikovsky regularly borrowed from contemporary folk music...why can't we do the same, within the limits of copyright infringement? If you hear Eminem, Rob Zombie or Rammstein produce some lyrical licks, find a way to mirror their stylisms and leitmotivs in your own performances. Don't hide in dark corners, get out and kick some gluteus!
In all seriousness, folks, adapt to the times. If your friends enjoy Pink Floyd and Jethro Tull, introduce them to the fine British symphonic interpretations of those bands. Techno fans can be made aware of all the great operatic arias available to be looped at a disco beat (Lakme's already been stolen.) And it's not a huge stretch to go from Charlie Daniels' Devil Went Down to Georgia to the pyrotechnics of a more violent fiddler like Heifetz or Perlman (check out Gil Shahams's Devil's Dance CD, for instance.)
Myself, I kinda figger that Aerosmith is perfect pickin's for a clarinet concerto. Dream On, Love in an Elevator, Walk This Way---yeah, that'll wake em up!! Now, if I can just figure out how to do a backflip without splitting a Gonzalez...
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-08-31 17:19
music nowadays is all about the bling, bling, and pimpz.
That's the current and near future state of it - probably longer.
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Author: Markael
Date: 2005-08-31 17:55
"It worked for...swing artists in the forties..."
Sometime around 1939 the big band arrangers started having problems with copyright issues. Some of them took to arranging classical works, which were in public domain.
It offended some classical purists and some swing purists as well.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-08-31 17:58
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> music nowadays is all about the bling, bling, and pimpz.
Nothing has really changed. It's been that way for hundreds of years.
You don't think Mozart wrote pieces for himself and others because he had to sell his music to survive? ...GBK
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-09-01 03:57
you know... a lot of rock songs, even some rap songs use classical music...
This one rap song got on my nerves, they were using fur elise... Besides, since the whole choir class only knows like the first two measure of it they play it over and over again on the piano and it gets annoying...
Anyways, you could tell them that. It probably won't make a difference to them. My brother hates classical music, which created a huge problem with my practicing my piano... By the time I started clarinet he had moved to a different section of the house, which was good. I like Billy Joel's music, it has a lot of piano stuff in it most times, however if they're anything like my brother they won't even like that. You can't really make someone appreciate classical music. Just like if they dislike some kind of food, they most likely won't like it the second time they try it...
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-09-01 04:06
"and the pimpz??"
I hate today's music... It's demoralizing and ugh... yucky. lol.
I'd much prefer hearing something from schubert than Kelly Clarkson's "Since You've Been Gone". It was funny too, because my brother and I were looking it up on Rhapsody just to make fun of it, and I couldn't find it... It turns out it's spelled "Since U been gone". YAY FOR NOT BEING ABLE TO SPELL! ^_^
I never really turn on the radio, or listen to it. Well, I made the mistake of turning it on the other day. It was horendous. This one group, The Black Eyed Peas, they use like similar words and similar melodies in like each of their songs... Well... actually almost the exact same ones... "No, no, no, no..." repeated over and over again, as if they can't come up with any decent lyrics. In fact, alot of these songs don't even make sense. They use like 5 measures of melody, change the harmony up a bit somewhere, and then repeat themselves over and over. I could go on and on.
As for the pimpz... My God, the music really distorts the listener's view on life. "Oh yeah, mom... I forgot to tell you, I want to be a pimp when I grow up so I can get a lot of bling bling". yeah. I doubt anyone does that, but they are potraying it as a good thing...
ok... I'm just rambling. I'm done.
Post Edited (2005-09-01 04:07)
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Author: allencole
Date: 2005-09-01 15:15
Alex brings up some important points, and they apply to a lot more than classical music. Latin is a dead language because it's no longer anyone's vernacular. Jazz is in similar trouble in many ways.
Once a style of music departs from its popular roots and becomes 'art' music, we see this same phenomenon about the 'need to keep it alive.' Composers and performers become increasingly esoteric and less concerned about whether or not they reach the audience. As support wanes, composers and performers blame it on inadequecies in the audience and place themselves on an even higher pedestal.
The composers of the past honed their craft in a very commercial way, providing inspirational music for church services, soothing music for royal dining or relaxing, or exciting scores for theatrical productions. These tasks evolved as did musical styles and tastes, and those who did not adapt did not survive and are largely not remembered.
Much of the 20th century's musical genius has gone into enhancing plays, movies & TV shows, selling products, and fueling activities for the public like dancing and recreation. Opera stagnated as Broadway flourished, concerts lost a lot of popularity to the movies, and jazz moved more and more towards resembling mathematics as it abdicated its role as dance music. As art music loses its real-life purpose it becomes more esoteric and academic until it becomes an endangered species that we are concerned about preserving.
One thing that we may need to do is embrace some of these other areas that have flourished both in popularity and vitality.
Allen Cole
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Author: Markael
Date: 2005-09-01 15:23
Some things never change and some things really do change.
As always, this is the best of times and the worst of times. The music scene (in all genres) is definitely not the same as it always has been due to 1) the cyber age and 2) the ways that the business and legal aspects of the industry have evolved.
Commercial radio is worse than it ever has been. It is controlled more by advertising to the point that the quality of the music is almost irrelevant. Popular taste has some influence on what becomes successful, but popular taste itself is manipulated by the industry. People never learn to like what they never hear.
Playlists have become smaller and less imaginative. As Dave Spiegelthal has said, even classical stations more and more tend to focus on limited repertoire. Wolfman Jack has made a similar observation about oldies stations.
On the other hand, the internet, independent record labels, and a handful of independent radio stations provide alternative ways of finding different types of music and ways for struggling artists to be heard. Just think of all the cool stuff you can learn about just on this clarinet bulletin board, things that most of could never have learned about even ten years ago.
The downside to all this information is that we are dividing into cultural ghettoes. It is hard for this cool stuff to make it into the mainstream, if there even is such a thing any more.
Glenn, it’s true that Mozart had to appeal to the tastes of his time and to write music that would sell. But things really have changed because it is harder to be heard. People have more choices and easy access to remotes. You really have to grab people to get a hearing. In today’s market Tolstoy’s War and Peace would never even be published because the first chapter is boring!
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