 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: missclarinetist
Date: 2005-08-02 11:47
hey guys, just wondering if you guys know what kind of reeds/mp/clarinet the berlin philharmonic principle uses. i heard a 1992 recording of one of their concerts and was impressed by his solos.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-08-02 12:54
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> Shows the date when Sabine Meyer replaced Leister - around
> 1992. Was for only about 2 years (if memory serves right).
Sabine Meyer was appointed principal clarinetist of Berlin in 1983.
She served for only 9 months - Approx. Oct 1983 to June 1984 ...GBK
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2005-08-02 13:18
But the answer to the question is.....
Nearly all German orchestra insist on the use of German-style clarinets. Buffets are not welcome. This implies also German mouthpieces and German reeds. Many players make their own reeds.
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2005-08-02 17:14
Seems I read somewhere that Berlin furnishes all the instruments.....or at least did at one time. Why did Sabine leave?
Bob Draznik
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Author: donald
Date: 2005-08-02 19:31
she left because of "the clarinet war".... i read that in Time magazine (admitedly, hardly what you'd call "reliable" reading). There was an article around 1984/85 where they described the debacle and refered to it as "the clarinet war". i doubt that if the same thing happened again it would score a blip in the international media.
donald
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Author: Ben
Date: 2005-08-03 01:34
Herbert Wurlitzer German System Clarinets. Likely either Wurlizter or Heinz Viotto Mouthpieces. Reeds? Perhaps Vandoren White Master or Steuer reeds.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-08-03 03:03
Sabine Meyer stated in a 1993 interview that her husband made all her reeds...GBK
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Author: missclarinetist
Date: 2005-08-03 03:59
Sorry I got the year wrong. I was wondering who the principle clarinet was back in 1997 and what equipment he used.
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Author: Firebird
Date: 2005-08-03 10:23
Herbert Wurlitzer Oehler Clarinets 22key 5 ring, German mouthpiece, German reeds usually AW reeds with shoe string ligature, although some professionals have decided to forgo shoe string ligatures.
Chan
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2005-08-03 10:48
Firebird wrote:
> Herbert Wurlitzer Oehler Clarinets
While Herbert Wurlitzer makes fine clarinets, there are a plethora of other fine German makers whose clarinets are used in German orchestras.
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Author: k_leister
Date: 2005-08-04 03:18
no matter who s/he was, the clarient must be:
Herbert Wurlitzer model 100c
Karl Leister retired in the 92-3 season, so it is difficult to guess who that was.
Meyer did not return to the Berlin Philharmonic afterwards, I don't think, but she did play concertos with the orchestra.
When I saw Karl Leister last time, which was last year, he used a " smoky"Wurlitzer M3 mouthpiece with special facing that allowed him to use Vandoren 56 Rue Lepec.
Meyer, I heard, used, or rather, developed the Steuer S800 reeds. She, of course, uses Wurlitzer model 100c.
All of their mouthpieces are refaced but copies of their mouthpieces are made by Viotto.
Would it be Wenzel Fuchs, perhaps?Mark Charette wrote:
> Firebird wrote:
>
> > Herbert Wurlitzer Oehler Clarinets
>
> While Herbert Wurlitzer makes fine clarinets, there are a
> plethora of other fine German makers whose clarinets are used
> in German orchestras.
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2005-08-04 19:35
W.Hooks, present principal of Berlin Philhamonic, told in an interview by a Japanese magazine, that he uses the Wuritzer(s), which had been lent to Karl Leister by Berlin Philharmonic.
All equipment may be lent to players, since the organization is affordable except reeds.
Clarinet players seem to use strings, not ligatures. However, Mr.Hooks bought Japanese hand made cupper ligatures at this shop.
http://www.ishimori-co.com/acce/ws_ligature.html
By the way, Mr.Fujii,an ex-Japanese clarinet association chairman, once interviewed Karl Leister what strength of reeds he uses. He uses strength 3. Mr.Fujii was very surprized. I read this in the same Japanese magazine.
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2005-08-04 19:46
Another info from the same magazine.
A Japanese clarinet player, already a professional, went to Germany to learn from Dieter Klocker. First thing he was told is not to use too thick reeds(the Japanese used 4、which Klocker said is just a piece of timber)that the player himself cannot control. He was considering to use 3 or even 2.5 when he came back to Japan.
Klocker put new reeds after soaked on glass plates, then afer one year(!), he throw away warped reeds and starts to use only unwarped ones. This was also told by the Japanes player in the same article.
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Author: k_leister
Date: 2005-08-05 05:24
Something more about Kloecker. He does not use Wurlitzer clarinets (most of the time). He plays a set of Warschewski clarinets and sometimes his Oehler, too. I heard he has never bought instruments for himself but simply inherited them from his teacher, Oskar Kroll and Jost Micheals. And he only uses one mouthpiece, a wooden one.
Warschewski was the prinicpal clarinettist in Stockholm Philharmonic and he bought semi-finished Uebel clarinets, modified the keys and the bore and sold them under his own name. His clarinets were not marked with serial number, so it is dificult to judge how old Kloecker's instruments are!
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Author: ned
Date: 2005-08-05 06:04
''Nearly all German orchestra insist on the use of German-style clarinets. Buffets are not welcome.''
I have a Buffet albert system - what would they make of that I wonder?
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-08-05 06:17
"By the way, Mr.Fujii,an ex-Japanese clarinet association chairman, once interviewed Karl Leister what strength of reeds he uses. He uses strength 3. Mr.Fujii was very surprized. I read this in the same Japanese magazine."
Maybe I'm missing something but what is so surprising about this?
Post Edited (2005-08-05 06:19)
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2005-08-05 08:07
John Kelly asks - "I have a Buffet albert system - what would they make of that I wonder?"
As I understand it - but I'm no expert - a Buffet albert system will have a French bore, and will sound much like a Boehm. So they would not like it at all.
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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Author: Malcolm Martland
Date: 2005-08-05 14:14
David, thanks for the info - I thought they did. In the 1980's I lived in Basel and the clarinets at Musik Hug were Boehm.
I saw Sabine Meyer playing Mozart clarinet concerto in Basel on an extended clarinet - which I also assumed was Boehm but I probably was not close enough to say. Does anyone know anything about the extended clarinet she plays? Apparently its to do with the fiddly passage in the Rondo from the Mozart - possibly to make it sound more like the original - it was hardly a period instrument though!
Edit: I found my EMI 1990 recording of Sabine Meyer playing Mozart clarinet concerto - it calls it a basset clarinet.
Post Edited (2005-08-05 14:52)
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2005-08-07 23:06
clarinibass wrote:
>Maybe I'm missing something but what is so surprising about this?
There seems a thought(nearly a prejudice) about reed thickness in Japan that thicker reeds give deeper tones.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-08-08 00:11
More common sense than prejudice - but thickness being thickness, not strength of the reed.
However it would depend entirely on the facing of the mouthpiece whether a #3 reed would sound like a wet sponge or not.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-08-08 05:13
Quote:
However it would depend entirely on the facing of the mouthpiece whether a #3 reed would sound like a wet sponge or not. Also the strength of the embouchure. I play 4.5 V12s. I CAN get the same sound out of my clarinets with a 2.5, 3, 3.5, etc., however have to take PARTICULAR care not to 'bite down' and to keep my embouchure extremely loose. I find with the 4.5, I can play comfortably with my natural embouchure force on this mouthpiece. 5 is too strong and it's uncomfortable for me to play (on THIS mouthpiece. I do have mouthpieces where a 5 is perfect, and also have mouthpieces where it's more comfortable with a lighter reed)
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2005-08-08 06:45
Malcolm - the basset clarinet isn't just used to facilitate one passage. There are quite a few passages where the basset plays an octave lower than you are used to hearing. This is done because it is believed to be the form in which the music was written. No original basset clarinet has survived, but people have made "authentic" replicas, and modern bassets in both Boehm and German systems.
Take care when searching for more information on this. There is a lot of misinformation out there, especially confusion between the basset clarinet and the basset horn.
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2005-08-08 12:48
Both Alessandro Carbonare and Philipe Cuper have played Principal Clarinets <as geusts) in the Berlin Phil on Vandoren B40 mouthpieces. They used standard Boehm clarinets with little problem in terms of blend and intonation but I suspect the Berlin Phil would be more inclined to stick with
tradition rather than go outside the "box" with clarinet systems.
As to ligatures I have seen Herbert Stahr use metal ligs as well as fabric so I believe there is no longer quite the fetish over standard set ups as in the past.
Wenzell Fuchs is also a superb player who I have heard in recital and I saw him use a metal recently in a broadcast.
David Dow
Post Edited (2005-08-08 12:49)
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2005-08-08 13:12
I also wonder whether the Berlin Phil is as traditional as some of the other German orchestras. It is in a league of its own; it can do what it likes, including hiring foreign stars. Maybe the less famous orchestras feel under more pressure to preserve the German way of doing things, as part of their justification for existing.
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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