 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: BlockEyeDan
Date: 2005-06-10 14:50
Hello all,
Being that it's been a work-filled summer that leaves me pondering all clarinet-related questions under the sun, I come to all of you wondering about this:
Given that in Stadler's day there was no mechanized/standardized manufacture of clarinets, I began to wonder about the phenomenon that was Anton Stadler. Was he an average clarinetist who had the benefit of a clarinet that happened to be superior to those around during that day, or was he an extraordinary musician who was able to overcome the technical limitations of the instruments of that day?
Any speculation and comment about this would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks all,
Dan
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Author: msloss
Date: 2005-06-10 15:38
It would of course be complete speculation, but I think it is reasonable to assume that an extraordinary musician like Mozart would tend to keep the company of like-minded and similarly talented individuals. Well, and those who had a full liquor cabinet and deep pockets.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2005-06-10 16:47
Dan -
Stadler was a famous touring virtuoso. There's no doubt that he was an extraordinary musician, and, of course, it didn't hurt to have the exclusive right to perform the Mozart Concerto.
I don't agree that Stadler had to "overcome the technical limitations of the instruments of that day." I play the recorder seriously, and the lack of keys is a help, not a hindrance. Without keys, my fingerwork is faster and lighter than on clarinet. Extreme key signatures are quite difficult, but Mozart didn't use them. Last summer, I heard Eric Hoeprich do a flawless performance of the Mozart Quintet on his reproduction of the Riga program instrument. See http://www.sfoxclarinets.com/Stadler.html
Ken Shaw
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Author: larryb
Date: 2005-06-10 17:13
Stadler - he was a bum. Borrowed money from poor Mozart and didn't return manuscripts of the concerto and quintet, not to mention other lost or absconded clarinet and basset horn music. A bum he was.
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Author: msloss
Date: 2005-06-10 17:55
PotatO, PotAto
TomatO, TomAto
Bum, Clarinetist
I fail to see the distinction...
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2005-06-10 18:24
I have sworn testimony that, in fact, Stadler played contra-alto ophicleide, not clarinet as most people believe. He was reputed to be an extraordinary ophicleidist, though he drank a bit (Heineken, I believe it was). I got this from Dr. Hank Lehrer, who went to school with Stadler.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-06-10 18:24
Anton Stadler and his younger brother Johann (who was also a clarinetist), both performed numerous times together as soloists and in court orchestras and wind bands.
Anton Stadler, frequently played second clarinet to his younger brother playing first, because he had a particular fascination with the lower register of the clarinet.
- and we all know what eventually happened ...GBK
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2005-06-10 18:44
GBK and Dave S - Please dont leave us asking more questions !! There are many books on Mozart and his music, which will give various pieces of info re: the ?turbulent? relationship, musical and personal with the Stadlers. I suggest reading what Al Rice has unearthed in his "Cl in the Classical Period", prob. the most recent work. I'll do so, when my no-pay playing slows down, in a week or so. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: ClarinetVirtuoso
Date: 2025-05-29 23:02
I have just come across the existence of a set of variations for basset horn and piano. It’s theme is Freut Euch des Lebens which is attributed to Mozart on an anonymous theme. This is listed in Koechel 3 as 289a in K 4 as Anhang C. Stadler apparently adapted it for basset horn and piano. The ms is in the private library of a famous basset horn player.
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Author: ClarinetVirtuoso
Date: 2025-05-31 02:16
Well we know that Stadler was terrible at keeping hold of money. The thing that we tend to forget that news travelled extremely slowly back then. Stadler was on his five year tour and probably didn’t even know that Mozart had died maybe until he returned to Vienna.
I am not too sure about Constanta Mozart’s story about Stadler pawning all the music and his instruments. I can’t believe that any musician would pawn his instruments let alone all of Mozart’s music as well as the concerto by Sussmayr and his own concerto for a pawltry sum of 73 ducats. Stadler could have given a concert and raised more money than that!! Stadler was a man with his eye to the main chance. He could have sold his instruments for a very large amount of money. There is something that doesn’t ring true about the story. Then there is the fact that the composer Schwenke made an arrangement for piano quintet of the concerto and upon his death Schwenke was found to have a full score of the clarinet concerto in his possession. It is also thought that Schwenke could have been the anonymous reviewer of the concerto for AMZ.
It is a problem area for me.
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Author: donald
Date: 2025-05-31 16:03
Given that Stadler had worked with Theodore Lotz on instrument design (and the invention/creation of extended range instruments) he probably had more than one clarinet (in each key) in his possession.
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Author: super20dan
Date: 2025-05-31 18:09
just look at charlie parker and lots of other junkie musicians -they routinely pawned their horns
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Author: ClarinetVirtuoso
Date: 2025-05-31 22:01
I would have thought that if he had pawned his music etc. that just by the dint of numbers that something of Stadler’s possessions would have turned up by now.
Where has Schwenke’s copy of the Clarinet Concerto full score gone? Is this the score that Stadler had in his possession? If Schwenke was the reviewer for the AMZ article that means that it was his score he was using. When Schwenke died his estate sale, the catalogue listed the score, but not who bought it. That is the trail that I am following in my research. If I could find one of the missing scores I would feel happy that I had achieved something apart from a long International solo career of course.
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Author: donald
Date: 2025-06-02 04:12
"If I could find one of the missing scores I would feel happy that I had achieved something apart from a long International solo career of course."
Just the fact that you felt you needed to write that last sentence is cringeworthy.
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