 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: snoikey
Date: 2016-04-11 00:11
Hi all, I am trying to find some information about the history of my oboe. It's stamped Buffet Crampon Paris.
It all seems a bit odd as there's no serial number anywhere that I can see, but also it doesn't look like there's ever been one removed; there are no scuff marks or anything like that on the wood. There are two initials at the front at the top of the middle section, under a key, which are difficult to make out but could be BC or BF or BB. The stamps look like they used to have gold inlay but this has mostly worn away. It has had several holes sealed up with brown and black stuff on the upper and middle sections.
I've owned it for about 12 years, since I was 14, and the shop owner at the time said he thought it was about 80 years old, which would date it to the early/mid 1920s - I don't know why he thought that as I can't see any identification!
Has anyone come across an oboe with no serial number before, and why might this be? Any ideas how I can find out its age? Also, any ideas about why some of the holes might have been sealed up, e.g. maybe it could have been a Conservatoire model in the past?
Photos (you can go through these to the left/right if you just open one):
In its case (came with the oboe, not sure if original, no makers stamp or markings inside or outside):
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/ruinbow/Oboe/IMAG0476_zpsghzogqvn.jpg
No serial number or scuff marks where one's been removed:
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/ruinbow/Oboe/IMAG0492_zpsmzul1pnw.jpg
Bell with Buffet Crampon stamp and 'R' initial:
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/ruinbow/Oboe/IMAG0479_zpsc4x5oays.jpg
Top section with stamp and a sealed up hole:
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/ruinbow/Oboe/IMAG0480_zpsvj4qyfbl.jpg
Modified left hand fourth finger
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0481_zpsiwfd31af.jpg.html?sort=3&o=5
Sealed up holes in upper section:
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/ruinbow/Oboe/IMAG0484_zpsr2tywmmm.jpg
Initials at top of middle section:
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c104/ruinbow/Oboe/IMAG0485_zps8ftrs3se.jpg
More sealed up holes in middle section:
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0487_zpswub4mrxc.jpg.html?sort=3&o=2
Sealed up holes towards bottom of middle section:
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0488_zpsbnwpb7qg.jpg.html?sort=3&o=1
I hope someone can help as I would really like to know what's going on with my oboe!
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-04-11 01:50
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0484_zpsr2tywmmm.jpg.html
It's been converted from conservatoire system to pure thumbplate which explains all the filled in holes on the top joint - two sets of pillar holes for the con bar and side Ab-Bb trill key as well as the filled in tonehole for the side Ab-Bb trill key that was once there.
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0481_zpsiwfd31af.jpg.html
The LH3 ring key has been turned into a decorative ring fitted onto the LH3 tonehole chimney where before when it was conservatoire system it would've had a ring key mounted directly to the key barrel the top joint Bb key is mounted on (the small pad cup in between LH 2 and 3 which is now the Barret side key (duplicating the thumplate action for trills). The side key would've originally been a G-Ab trill key with the touchpiece soldered directly to the G# pad cup key barrel (with the Ab-Bb trill key touchpiece overlapping it as you have on modern conservatoire and dual system oboes, but it's a G#-A trill on Gillet conservatoire systems).
It would've been far simpler to have simply added a thumbplate to make it dual system instead of doing all that conversion work, but pure thumplate system was the most widely used system and the one made by makers in the UK right up until the late 1980s.
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0488_zpsbnwpb7qg.jpg.html
The lower joint has had the forked F vent removed (linked to the RH2 fingerplate) and an F resonance key fitted in place that opens with the F key. The filled in holes are for the pillars and the flat spring screw recess.
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0487_zpswub4mrxc.jpg.html
The banana key (for the C-Db trill) and pillars have been removed leaving the holes in the lower joint, but the linkage piece (overlever) on the low C key is still in place. You hold the banana key down with RH finger 3 to close the low C key and trill the C# key - a bit awkward to use at the best of times.
http://s26.photobucket.com/user/ruinbow/media/Oboe/IMAG0485_zps8ftrs3se.jpg.html
The RH C-D trill key has been mangled presumably so the player could trill with RH1 instead of RH2 - it should sit in between the F# pad cup and RH2 fingerplate. No idea what the stamping is on the lower joint above the RH1 fingerplate.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-04-11 02:11
Just had a close look at the initials above the RH1 ring key and they're the interlocking BC from the Buffet logo.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: snoikey
Date: 2016-04-11 02:13
Hi Chris, thank you very much for the comprehensive reply! It's been a mystery to me since I was 14. It does seem a shame that it wasn't converted to a dual system, I guess as you said they were trying to make it simpler, or easier to sell in the UK. To be honest it would probably have been out of my price range in 2004 if it had been left as a dual system, so then I suppose I wouldn't be here asking anyway.
I still have the question about the lack of serial number. A bit more research has told me about 'stencil' instruments which were made by different companies then advertised as being made by e.g. Buffet Crampon. I'm now wondering if it's one of those; still researching, trying to find a similar looking oboe. I now know to search for conservatoire models, which makes it awkward as they won't look the same! I think it should still have had a serial number though even if it was a stencil. Any ideas?
Having stared at them a bit more, the 'initials' at the top of the middle section look a lot like those at the bottom of the Buffet Crampton stamp (logo), which is an intertwined B and C. The 'initials' I now think are two of those, stamped next to each other. Not sure if this is odd or not!
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-04-11 16:32
Attachment: buffet-auto-oboe.jpg (173k)
I found a photo of a similar age Buffet oboe, only it's a fully automatic version. But the keywork for most part looks the same. See attachment - it's a bit blurry as it has been zoomed in from a small photo.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: snoikey
Date: 2016-04-11 21:40
Oh good find, that looks identical to my case! Is there any info about this oboe? I'm particularly interested in the age of mine. I've also emailed Peter Hurd and he says it's likely to be a stencil oboe due to the lack of serial number and has suggested 1905-1910, but so far hasn't told me what makes him think that!
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