 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: MikeC855
Date: 2015-07-05 19:28
I'm a long-time serious brass player - mostly tuba - but have developed apparently considerable skill on oboe, at least according to the band and orchestra directors in our area. I suppose "skill" means playing in tune. Most of my recent oboe work has been with symphonic winds and pit orchestras.
Anyway, I've been playing a Yamaha student model for ten years and it's time to graduate to a pro oboe. I auditioned the Yamaha 841L, and aside from better timbre consistency around the low-mid transitions, it played and sounded pretty much the same as my bargain-basement plastic horn. I was disappointed, but also encouraged that the cheaper instrument may have been pretty good to begin with.
Now to my question - I have read so many comments on and off the web about upper joint cracking. That was the primary reason I tried the 841L, with its plastic insert. I'm not an every day player, and in the off season the instrument may sit in the (climate-controlled) closet for weeks at a time. With this on-again, off-again usage, if I buy an all-wood oboe, am I inviting cracks?
And to the urgency... we are traveling to the factory next week to audition a Fox Sayen. I have read the raves here and elsewhere, concluding this is the horn that will best fit my playing style and the literature I most frequently encounter. Not to mention that my current ensemble director is enamored with a "dark sound", it can't be dark enough. Well, OK. Anyway... the Fox rep indicated that they would be happy to custom build a Sayen with plastic insert, but her reaction amounted to "Huh?? Why?" I responded that we would talk more about it when we were there.
So... before making the trek... are my fears about cracking overblown?
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Confounding band directors since 1964.
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Author: mschmidt
Date: 2015-07-05 23:27
I think there are lots of horns out there that have suffered the usual crack between the trill vents, have been expertly repaired, and have no discernible difference in how they play before the crack and after the repair. I'm certainly there will be some who chime in to say my ear (or the ear of anyone who makes the same claim) just isn't sensitive enough to hear the difference, and I acknowledge that that might be true.
But if you are really worried about the effects of cracks on sound, go to one of the many dealers in quality used instruments (Hurd, Coelho, Selznick, McFarland, Chudnow) and get some used, cracked and well-repaired instruments to try. Find one you like the sound of and presto, you have an instrument you like that's less likely than any new instrument to get any new cracks.
Mike
Still an Amateur, but not really middle-aged anymore
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Author: MikeC855
Date: 2015-07-06 21:59
Thanks... that, actually, is somewhat reassuring - the "usual crack" is to be expected, fixes are routine, it takes a super-skilled ear to discern a repair, and even then there might be debate.
We'll see what happens next week. If the Fox isn't to my liking, I will have to ask here for advice on instruments to look for that fit my playing style.
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Confounding band directors since 1964.
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Author: PlatinumPisces
Date: 2015-07-06 22:35
I think it depends on your attention to your instrument.
I have a DM Loree that I broke in in San Diego, CA but traveled/lived in Boston, Chicago, and Las Vegas with it and never had a problem. Played with it outdoors and indoors, heat and AC. I bought a Howarth XM last year and broke it in here in Vegas, no problem. You have to really be diligent about swabbing. You're sitting for a minute while another section is working, swab. You finished warming up, swab. You just swabbed 5 minutes ago and rehearsal ended, swab. In my experience, I feel it mops up the extra moisture but distributes it more evenly throughout the bore rather than having it seep into weak spots. When breaking it in, I always prop open the trill keys either with the cardboard inserts from a razor blade or a cut up Q-Tip.
I also feel if an instrument cracks, it was destined to. I always try to look for "strong points" in the grain of the instrument. It is hard to describe. I look for these in the top joint only, especially around the trill keys. I sorted the instruments (about 20) just by grain when I was at RDG picking out my Howarth and sure enough (for me) the top three were the ones I felt had good grain. The one I eventually picked out, the owner tried it and said "I can see why you picked this one...".
Your fears of cracking aren't overblown. It is a scary thing to think of, I still do think of it. Just remember, if you completely dry out your oboe or as you said you don't play often, try to play it for five minutes and put it back in your case. I do this in my down time. It introduces moisture back into the bore and doesn't completely dry out the bore. I like to do this so next time I play for a while, the wood just doesn't soak up the moisture like a dried out sponge and expands unevenly. Too much or too little moisture, neither is a good thing IMHO.
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Author: Wes
Date: 2015-07-06 23:22
One can lessen the moisture into the instrument by blowing it out of the reed before inserting the reed into it's well. After dipping the reed in water, the reed retains water which, when blown into the instrument can cause tuning problems.
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Author: heckelmaniac
Date: 2015-07-07 02:19
Cracks that transit all the way through to the bore can effect the sound of an oboe. Often the sound will be "duller" post-crack than "pre-crack."
A well repaired crack that does not transit through to the bore should not be much a concern when purchasing an oboe, though cracks running through multiple tone holes could be cause for setting an instrument aside.
Warming up a wood oboe instrument under arm, under jacket, shirt, sweater, vertically in line with your body, EVERY time before playing for five minutes is a MUST !
And treating the bore with "Woodwind All" (available from Cascio Interstate Music or the maker, Chem-pak) truly helps prevent cracking and also nearly completely eliminates the possibility of "gurgling" in the octave vents, and the riser vents for C (B#) and Bb (A#) on the upper joint. Applying "Woodwind All" is truly a simple procedure.
With respect to "dark" sounding oboes, in my experience, the Kreul/Gordet "heavy" wall ("heavy pattern," "heavy weight") is still the "darkest" sounding oboe ever made. I usually have a bunch lying about, though far too "dark" a sound for my own preference. The Kreul/Gordet is an extremely "forgiving" instrument. It is difficult to play a "bad note" on Kreul oboes- they "lock in" on pitch centers without much effort at all. And it is much easier to make a reed for a Kreul oboe than almost any other I can think of...
With best wishes,
Peter
Oboes.us
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Author: Jeltsin
Date: 2015-07-07 16:39
I like you way to avoid cracking PlatinumPisces. You treat your oboes in nearly exact the way I do and I have only have had one crack in an oboe, but that was when I was a beginner and didn't know much about how to handle an oboe.
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