 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: Noverbuf
Date: 2012-02-15 17:55
Obviously it is telling from its name but please help me identify its applicability for my needs!
I didn't want to revive an old thread with a bunch of negative coments on this instrument but have decided to start a new thread to hear fresh opinions. Sometimes in a new thread you can get the opposite set of opinions of what you see in older threads.
First, my goal. I'm a woodwind enthusiast and I can play saxophones and clarinets at an amature level. I'd like to try my hand at oboe and be able to play some basic pop and jazz standards, maybe some Christmas songs, you get the idea.
For the mentioned scope of music can I consider Yamaha YOB-211 a suitable instrument? My general approach when I'm looking for an instrument is to get a simple but reliable horn that has solid basic characteristics. What I mean: I know YOB-211 lacks some key features of more expensive instruments, like right (or left?, don't remember what I read) F, maybe it has some other simplifications.
Since I'm not going to become a professional and will use it for 'songs' can I consider it a useable instrument with solid construction and more or less characteristic oboe tone (provided the concept of tone is established).
I know there is no such thing as 'cheap oboe' but since there are these student oboes like this YOB-211, various Selmers, Lintons, etc. is it correct to call them an oboe?
Otherwise, would you rather say that (again keeping in mind my goals) it's better to have no oboe and forget about this idea than to try to learn basic skills for my application on YOB-211?
Any other alternatives in the below $500 range or is it waste of time?
Edit: as an alternative how would YOB-211 compare to Selmer 1492B?
Post Edited (2012-02-15 18:02)
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Author: GoodWinds ★2017
Date: 2012-02-15 19:54
Well, here's an encouragement for you: when I'm traveling in varying weather conditions, I will take along my VERY student-level Yamaha (the bottom I believe!) and play concertos as evening entertainment at professional conferences. Nobody knows. I use a responsive reed and obviously pick music that doesn't require the extra keywork or low Bb.
I would not hesitate to use the same instrument in a very cold pit orchestra situation.
I've two other more professional instruments but if you can find a good quality serviceable instrument that you can afford and that will suit your needs,
GO for it.
ONE other caution: make sure you get a sturdy instrument; having to get even a 'cheap oboe' serviced or adjusted often (if it goes out of whack easily) gets expensive over time. I would suggest having a pro-oboist look it over and deem it worth of your investment.
GoodWinds
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Author: OboeDad
Date: 2012-02-16 17:24
Hello Noverbuf -
I am probably less experienced/knowledgeable/expert than anyone else on this forum, but here's my thought:
- Of course it's an oboe. My daughter just traded up from a Yamaha 211 to a Mark Chudnow MCW oboe. Her first comment: Wow - this sounds so much more "oboe-y." She did not say: Oh - finally, an oboe. In other words, the 211 didn't sound as resonant, or plaintive, or sonorous, or otherwise wonderful, but it was clearly an oboe. Walk blindfolded into a room of people playing various woodwinds, and you will immediately pick out the 211 as an oboe. Walk into a different room with people playing various oboes, and YOU will just as quickly pick out the 211 as a student instrument. But other people who are non-musicians will not hear the difference quite as readily.
Hopefully others will comment on how easy/hard it is to get a range of expression out of the 211, vs. a finer oboe, as I can't comment on that. I assume you don't have the opportunity to test-play a 211 and other oboes, since that would certainly be the best way for you to decide which way to go.
Best,
- Paul
- P
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Author: WoodwindOz
Date: 2012-02-16 18:17
I have a Yamaha 211 as my outdoor oboe (it's plastic, so doesn't crack in the cold). It is definitely an oboe, but if my Marigaux can get to fortissimo, the Yamaha has a max dynamic, at least to me, of mezzo-forte.
The comparison is like a base model 4-cylinder car (the Yamaha) to an up-spec 6 or 8-cylinder car. They both get you from place to place, but one can do things better or more efficiently than the other.
If your alternative is the Selmer 1492, stick with the Yamaha every day of the week!
However, used Selmer 101/102/104 can often be found in this price range on the auction site, they are good value for money as they often have the keywork that the Yamaha lacks, and they are not as bad as the beginner, base model Selmers (someone with more experience with Selmer than me may be able to elaborate). I plan to get one of these models in plastic as a better outdoor oboe if I can't find a cheap Fox (is that an oxymoron??)
Rachel
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-02-16 22:09
I can recommend the Selmer 104 which is based on a Loree design (don't know which model) which is a good instrument for outdoor use. They're pretty utilitarian but well built all the same.
I've got a modified one as my back-up oboe which I'm currently using while my main one is in bits awaiting several keys to be refitted.
It cost me £450 off eBay though you may find one for less, but I did give it a complete rebuild as well as rebored it and made several keywork modifications to make it as near the same spec as my dual system S5 as possible (although I won't be fitting a LH C# key to it).
The UK spec Yamaha 211 oboes are dual system, have a range to low Bb and some also have a forked F vent as standard (not sure about the most recent ones), so removing the thumbplate will revert them to basic conservatoire system.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Noverbuf
Date: 2012-02-18 11:37
Thank you for your replies and I of course posted this thread with a 'hook' of asking an obvious question but only for the reason to counteract the posts generalizing that "all this student-level" crap isn't worth a penny.
One thing that always amuses me in student level instruments is when you've done you home work you can get for the same price (for instance off the FreeBay) either a nice sturdy basic performer or a worthless piece of manmade materials put together.
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Author: Noverbuf
Date: 2012-02-19 13:05
Well, actually I'm still doing my home work
Any experience with Buffet student-level oboes such as BC4011, 4012, 4051, 4052? They are wooden with some kind of synthetic resin applied to the bore surface. Any advantage of these over basic Yamahas?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-02-19 13:33
I've found the tone on the student Buffets (made by Schreiber) to be thin and bland without much tonal weight, so maybe darker sounding reeds will be best suited to them to add some depth of tone. One area of weakness is the middle socket which only has a thin shell of wood supporting it at the socket ring (the entire inside of the socket is resin) - I've seen several that have broken at the socket ring due to carelessness.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: WoodwindOz
Date: 2012-02-20 04:17
Also on the Buffets...our department bought a whole stack of them. Most of them will not stay in adjustment for more than a week after a couple of years of use, but the horrible 40yo Noblets that we also have are still (unfortunately) going strong!
I know from teaching and discussing with other clarinet teachers that German-made Buffet clarinets are not worth the time of day. Intonation being the main reason, but keywork is also weak. It would not surprise me if the German-made Buffet oboes (anything with a 4 in front of the model number) were much the same.
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Author: Noverbuf
Date: 2012-02-20 09:27
Chris and WWOz, thank you for the warning! I was just thinking of considering the Buffet student level as an alternative. It's great you are around!
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