 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Hank
Date: 2002-12-18 12:59
Hi,
I know there are a lot of fine technicians on the BB as well as some skilled amatures as well. I have a small problem with a new Series 9 I just purchased (a full Boehm except no low Eb key which is what I wanted). Beautiful clarinet and it came with the Buffet C Crown as a bonus (alas, a junky ligature).
The clarinet has been in in air conditioned storage for many years and my quick inspection shows that no pads need replacing (compression rings good, no insect holes, good seals, plays great, ect). However, there is a small adjustment needed on the B C key (RH little fingers with the 4 keys). As might be expected, and I think this is a common problem, sometimes to get the B to speak clearly, the C key must also be pressed. As a former band used to making many small repairs, the obvious problem is in the little C crows foot (I believe this is what it is called) that extends below the RH C# B keys and which facilitates depression for the offending C key does is not moving closed enough.
I inserted several layers of Postit paper on the right side of the crows foot under the B key which now keeps the C down sufficiently. That works fine and the horn plays great but I need something a tad more permanent and my favorite tech is 90 miles away.
I have some wide key bending pliers as well as some very thin cork available. Is it best to actually bend the RH B key a little lower so it depresses the C key a tad more? Or, should I build up the right side of the crow's foot just a tad by gluing a very thin piece of cork, compressed with pliers before attachment, on the key?
My street sense tells me that the gluing approach, followed by a bit of emery board to adjust the exact height is the safer approach. The tech might bend the key. Any assistance is appreciated as I do not relish an all day trip to the shop for such a small repair that I may be able to accomplish myself.
Hank
PS I am a careful and precise worker.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2002-12-18 14:03
Very good PS!, necessary. Yes, I would assume its just wearing-out of the crow's foot cork from the mfgr. years ago, and reserve any key-padcup bending for a "second-stage" of adjustment. Pros, chime in. Don
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-12-18 14:18
Hank wrote: "I am a careful and precise worker." That seems obvious from your asking for suggestions before jumping right into things.
It appears that your "street sense" serves you well. Adjustments in the area of the "crow's foot" are perhaps the trickiest on the entire instrument. This is where a slight bend of a key can straighten out one problem and create one or more others. If you have already tested the success of a thicker cork under the B key, by all means do this in a permanent fashion.
If you have never replaced cork, I suggest using Super Glue corporation's contact cement. It is well-suited for this task, unlike ordinary "Rubber Cement," which is similar in operation but not nearly so strong. (This stuff is *not* the commonly-seen Super Glue cyanoacrylate, which is another of their products.) Cut the cork to approximate size, then apply a thin coat of the contact cement to both pieces being joined. After the adhesive is quite dry, press them together. The pieces will be rather inseparable. Although my work of this type is finished with fine sandpaper, using a fine emery board should do the trick. By the way, this adhesive is also good for replacing tenon corks.
Years ago, I developed some useful Clarinet maintenance skills out of necessity, because my closest really good tech was 75 miles away. It seems that you are doing the same.
Regards,
John
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Author: Forest Aten
Date: 2002-12-18 14:28
Hank,
Before bending anything!!!...or even changing pads...go to the LEFT hand reciprocal levers and check to see if the cork strips under the levers still remain. Elevation at the crows foot is often incorrect due to the wear or even demise of these corks. They are instrumental in having good elevation and adjustment at the crows foot. So often people don't even think about these corks and start bending away. They only look at the cork on the crows foot. A huge mistake.
Good luck.
Forest Aten
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Author: Hank
Date: 2002-12-18 14:50
Hi All,
This is truly amazing; I got exactly the advice I needed within an hour and a half. Many thanks to all the great advisors that have already weighed in (and I'm sure when the sun rises on the westerly parts where some regulars live, there will be even more).
As far as being a careful and precise worker, I am reminded of advice my father, a physician, gave me. "Knowing what not to do is as important as knowing what to do." Sounds like an Oath to me :-) i.e. Do No Harm!
HRL
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-12-18 16:16
The sun rose out here in the 'West' quite some time ago, long before I did I always enjoy posts by do-it-yourselfers like you, Hank, as I firmly believe we should all know how to maintain our instruments and know when technical help should (or shouldn't:) be sought. As usual, the above posters came through splendidly. I have nothing to add except that I too have found the 'Super Glue' contact cement superior to other brands. If necessary, I thin it a little with a bit of M.E.K. - just enough to keep it 'runny' - otherwise it tends to thicken too much, resulting in a 'spongy' bond.
I'm happy you found your answer so quickly.
Thank you, too, for sharing your father's advice. We could all do well to keep it in mind... wherever we go.
Happy Tootin' to ya :]
- ron b -
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Author: Hank
Date: 2002-12-18 16:39
Hi Ron,
Glad you are up and around this AM.
As far as doing things on my instruments that are easy, and don't require a significant number of expensive tools and exceptional craftsmanship, I'll give this one a go. It is the cork method with SuperGlue Contact Cement; what is the acronym MEK and can I buy it in smaller lots than a 55 gallon drum :-)
Thanks,
Hank
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Author: John O'Janpa
Date: 2002-12-18 18:12
Hi Hank,
MEK stands for methyl,ethyl,ketone. Ace hardware should have it in pints etc. in their painting supplies dept. Be sure to read and follow the warnings and cautions. It can be pretty nasty stuff if warnings are ignored.(So can gasoline, so don't let this keep you from using it.)
John
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-12-18 18:45
Exactly on, John. I purchase MEK in quart cans at Ace hardware store's paint department, although any hardware or paint store will probably have it on hand. John is absolutely correct also, Hank, that MEK is highly volatile so don't get it anywhere near an open flame. A well ventilated area is strongly advised too so you don't inhale significant amounts of fumes.
I find that ordinary tools are sufficient for most maintenance. You can make a pretty good spring hook from a medium size crochet hook or, in a pinch, a paper clip. Common tweezers are handy. You might want to invest in a couple of good small screwdrivers. Otherwise, there's nothing much you can't improvise or adapt to your needs.
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Author: John Elison
Date: 2002-12-18 19:17
I had a similar problem on the bridge between the upper and lower joints. Instead of using Post-It paper I used clear Scotch Tape and built up several layers sticking it to the metal part rather than the cork part. I trimmed it nicely before applying it to the bridge and it works just fine and will probably last a long time. I think you could probably take the same approach by applying several layers of Scotch Tape to the under side of the B key lever and trimming it flush with a razor blade.
Best regards,
John Elison
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2002-12-18 19:25
Hi Ron and John,
The MEK definition takes me back to my unsucessful pre-med days and Organic Chemistry (do I sense a shudder from several others of you out there?). Perhaps being able to recognize MEK at sight is but one of the reason that I am not now or never will be a physician. I do remember getting the one organic exam extra credit question right year ago about trinitrotoluene - my spelling may have slipped since but you can get the gist.
Yes, I have the requiste spring hooks, stick shellac, good precision screwdrivers, assorted pliers etc. but you forgot a terrific piece of repair equipment which is a doctor's hemostat (all sizes, hold like crazy, thin, etc). A great tool.
Regards,
Hank
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2002-12-18 22:24
What does everyone think of the alternatives to the crows foot mechanism, i.e. The Peter Eaton version, or the adjustable screws on the Opus II? Do these really work? My theory is that if they did, they'd be on ALL clarinets by now.
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2002-12-18 23:27
Cork (pound it with a hammer, first to flatten)
Rubber cement as described (it should feel dry) to metal and cork
THIN stip of 220 grit sandpaper to draw through to sand things down
(the cork will likely be a little high, at the start)
I use cigarette paper as a 'feeler' gauge to test the grip of the pads. Holding down the RH E will trap the cork on the crow's foot and drawing the sandpaper strip will take off a LITTLE each pass.
You may also want to put some shoelace or rubber band over these around these lowest two pads overnight, to encourage the pads to 'seat' on the tonehole.
********
Adjustment screws add expense. The Opus II and Eaton horns are no-holds barred premium instruments. It's a nice design, but every step costs bench time during assembly.
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Author: Bob
Date: 2002-12-19 13:34
One of the great things about this BB is that sometimes one gets answers to problems he didn't bother to post for.....thanks much to all for the great tips. My indispensible "tools" also include toothpicks both whole and broken.
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2002-12-20 22:11
The Series 9 does not require cork strips under the left hand reciprocal levers. Adjusted properly the levers do not contact the body of the clarinet. Entry level and intermediate clarinets are usually the only variety that needs cork on these levers.
jbutler
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2002-12-20 22:38
Hi John,
You are correct, each of the left side levers enters a companion hole of the mechanism that operates the right side keys. However, I have an alternate left Eb/Ab and I did have to put a small cork on top of the the front end of the left side mechanism to eliminate the KLANK from metal to metal contact.
While I have your attention though and we are talking about left side lever mechanisms, my Buffet is a little clicky sometimes. Should there be some fishskin or Goldbeaters skin around the small projection of the left levers where they fit into the mechanism? If so, how does one get this, just make it up? Or are their tiny little sleeves (pretty tight quarters).
Thanks in advance!
Hank
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2002-12-21 12:17
Hank,
Yes, you can use goldbeaters skin to silence these keys. You can buy it in sheets or if you have an old pad you can simply cut it out from it. Put a light film of grease on the goldbeaters skin. This will help hold it on the key with the hole while you install the levers and help with the quietness.
Secondly, I use teflon tubing. Sometimes the hole will need to be enlarged slightly with a No. 42 drill for it to fit properly. The tubing can be purchased from Small Parts Inc. (Part STT-14-"XX", where "XX" is the number of feet.) I purchased a 10 foot roll about four or five years ago and still have plenty left. It doesn't cost very much either....less than $5 US or so. They can be reached at 305-557-8222.
All the best,
jbutler
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Author: John Elison
Date: 2002-12-21 14:28
I cut little pieces of a thin plastic bag for the interface bearings of the left levers. It seems to work nicely, so far. Very quiet.
When you mentioned Teflon tubing, I wondered if Teflon plummers tape might also work and eliminate the necessity of drilling out the holes.
Best regards,
John Elison
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2002-12-21 17:31
John,
Yes, the teflon tape will work. I've used it before, but gave up on it after I discovered that it can wear down to the metal and the key becomes noisy again. I inspected a clarinet done this way a few years back and thought I would try it out. I was not happy with the "failure rate" of the teflon tape. There are techs that still use it.
Most of the time it is <b>not necessary </b>to drill the hole. I've found the hole in the companion key to be between a No 43 drill and the No 42 so one is not taking that much metal out.
jbutler
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Author: bill28099
Date: 2004-01-23 15:06
If you are cutting up plastic bags for left lever interface bearings cut them with a paper punch, it makes a nice round little disc which seems to be a perfect size. I always put a touch of contact cement on the rod to hold the plastic in place during installation. And if you work on anitiques which tend to be pretty loose use the plastic from Ziploc freezer bags. I always make a pile of the discs by creating a multilayer piece and then punching. For modern instruments clear blue garbage bags work great.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-01-23 16:24
Synonymous Botch said:
> You may also want to put some shoelace or rubber band over
> these around these lowest two pads overnight,
> to encourage the pads to 'seat' on the tonehole.
I would not use rubber bands on any silver or plated keys.
A better alternative would be an elastic hair tie (fabric coated) or one of the Buffet key clamps for the LH E/B key...GBK
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