 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Dan
Date: 2002-12-17 02:55
I received my Yamaha YCL-250 today and began in earnest to look it over and check it out.
First of all, my disclaimer: I’m no expert at analyzing clarinets nor do I pretend to be. I play principally for my own pleasure and do some repadding from time to time. I’m sure that more experienced players and/or repairpersons could give a much more thorough analysis of this new student clarinet.
With that in mind, what follows are my observations in no particular order of importance:
1)Found the “D” key ring stuck down…had to loosen the lower screw to allow proper movement of the ring assembly.
2)Found no compression ring on the pad above lower Bb.
3)Found very slight compression rings on left hand A key pad and pad just above E4.
4)Found incomplete compression rings on trill “B” and pad above D4.
5)Did upper section compression test: it took approx. 4 seconds for pressure needle to drop from 3 to 1 oz per sq in. Pressing on the pads made no noticeable improvement.
6)Did lower section compression test: it took 1 second for the 3 to 1 oz pressure drop. Began lightly pressing key cups and found lower 16mm pad not seated properly. A slight amount of extra pressure made the needle drop very slowly. (I measured 5oz of pressure on this pad.) Upon closer inspection, found incomplete compression ring.
7)Found upper open 16mm pad to have only 2mm clearance.
8)Found lower open 16mm pad to have only 3mm clearance.
9)Keywork: excellent…nice feel to it…very sturdy. Noticed 3 extra body screws next to posts holding the right hand, little finger key posts. The screws were inserted into small plates attached to the metal bases holding the 3 posts. They appear to have been placed there to add extra strength to the 3 posts.
10)Noticed plastic insert between left hand G# and A keys.
11)Noticed several of my fairly new mouthpieces would “wobble” in the top of the barrel but the 5RV seemed to fit OK.
12)With the 5RV, I found it very easy to play all of the altissimo notes and clarion notes up to F6 using my #2 Legere reed. The F6 note sang through clear and solid.
13)Found upper and lower sections extremely difficult to put together. The tenon cork appears to be too thick. Upon disassembly, again, it took a LOT of strength to twist and pull the pieces apart.
14)Found the trill “B” note to sound very empty and was quite sharp.
15)All in all, the intonation from bottom to top was very good with the exception of the above noted trill “B” note.
16)Found tone quality to be very good, but sounded thinner than my larger bore V40. With that exception, the instrument had a very pleasant sound.
17)Final conclusion: Had several of the Valentino pads been installed correctly, the clarinet would have played easier, with a lighter touch.
18)Recommendation: Buy only from stores that play test instruments before shipping…such as Weiner Music, Int. Musical Suppliers, etc.
I apologize for the long post, but hope the above was of interest and informative to those contemplating the purchase of the YCL-250.
Best regards,
Dan Shusta
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Author: GBK
Date: 2002-12-17 03:16
Dan wrote:
<< 18)Recommendation: Buy only from stores that play test instruments before shipping…such as Weiner Music, Int. Musical Suppliers, etc.
Dan, thanks for the post. Where was your clarinet purchased from?...GBK
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-12-17 03:17
Dan wrote:
> 18)Recommendation: Buy only from stores that play test
> instruments before shipping…such as Weiner Music, Int. Musical
> Suppliers, etc.
I have found that though some places claim to "play test" all their instruments, they must have been play tested by a tone-deaf gorilla. Claims of play-testing need to be taken with a large dose of NaCl.
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Author: Dan
Date: 2002-12-17 03:22
To GBK: I purchased mine on a trial basis from WW & BW. They matched Weiner's price and had a lower shipping cost.
Dan
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Author: RS
Date: 2002-12-17 03:45
Very interesting and detailed analysis. It's probably rare to get an instrument--no matter who the dealer is--that doesn't need (or at the least could benefit from) some adjustments. Even an instrument that seems to play pretty well is likely to have a couple or more pads that aren't perfectly seated. Probably a good idea to have any prospective purchase gone over by a repairman so an accurate evaluation can be made. I would guess that alot of perfectly good instruments have been rejected for not playing right when all they needed was a little tweaking.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2002-12-17 06:01
Mark wrote "....they must have been play tested by a tone-deaf gorilla. Claims of play-testing need to be taken with a large dose of NaCl."
My experience is similar. I would extend that to include most work done under guarantee. If the customer is not paying, the work will most likely be compromised in some way.
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Author: Bob
Date: 2002-12-17 12:31
It's amazing what shoddy practices instrument mfgrs. get away with.
My own experience was similar to the poster's...but it was with a major midwest "house" that not only claims to play test but then argued with me about my complaints. So forget "high expectations" and build into the price you will pay a "lookover" by a competent repair shop.
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Author: Bob
Date: 2002-12-17 12:33
Yeh, NaCl is a good purgative too but might not be required with such experiences.
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Author: Dan
Date: 2002-12-17 13:03
My thanks to all of you for your responses.
To Mark C: I did try out 2 "hand selected" clarinets from Intl. Musical Suppliers, a YCL-72 and a Leblanc Sonata, and I must say that they played flawlessly. Then you might ask: well, why didn't you order from them? I tried out the above clarinets because I wanted to ask them some questions about mouthpieces. Huhhh? If I may give an opinion (without getting sued), their sales techniques are, again IMO, very, very agressive. There is a 2nd reason why I didn't order from them: their refunds are averaging 3 MONTHS for me. Yes, I have the paperwork to prove it!! I wrote the owner a rather bitter email complaining about how long it was taking to receive a refund. I received no response. Matter a fact, just yesterday, I received a CC credit dated 12/13 for mouthpieces that, according to THEIR paperwork, were returned on 09/13. Enough said. I simply won't deal with them anymore. I sincerely hope that my case is unique and that others are very happy with their service.
This could easily lead to another thread called "Where should I send my new clarinet now that it has a problem?" I believe Gordon's response was right on. Especially if the instrument was bought from a large distributor and THEN taken to a local dealer for repairs.
I found the above responses to be very informative. In fact, I hope a lot of prospective buyers read the responses from Marc C, RS, and Gordon (NZ). IMO, clarinets are mass produced with limited time spent "tweaking". After all, time is money and taking too long means a loss of revenue. I believe RS hit the nail right on the proverbial head. IMO, one shoud EXPECT to have their recently purchased instrument "tweaked" by a trusted repairperson.
My thanks to Mark C for providing this BB. IMO, sneezy.org is the most informative website for anyone in need of clarinet "enlightenment". Speaking for myself, I have received far more than I have been able to give intellectually to this BB.
There are so many experts who freely give of their experience and wisdom.
My thanks to all.
Dan
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Author: Matt
Date: 2002-12-17 13:12
And that's why it's frequently good to buy local. Before I purchased my Yamaha SE-V I play tested the following from WW/BW - R13, Yamaha CS-V, & Yamaha YCL-52, along with the SE-V from Ellis. The R13 was a sweet clarinet but suffered from a leaky thumb pipe & a chipped/cracked bell - something I discovered late in the trial period. If I had purchased this instrument mail order before discovering it's problems I would have been stuck dealing long distance on something that needed close range communications. My SE-V has been back to the shop on occasion, and it's nice to know that they care about keeping my instrument & me happy.
I will say though, that I felt that the 3 instruments I play tested from WW/BW played very well & were well set up. The leaky thumb pipe did not show up until after I started playing the R13 for more than 30 minutes during the test, and the crack was almost unseeable. I thought it was a chip at first but upon closer inspection found it was a chip with a very small crack leading out under the bell ring. I could easily see both these getting through a "play test". The 2 Yamaha's were great - just not as nice as the R13 or my SE-V.
My SE-V corks have been very tight since day 1. I just accepted the fact that I needed to grease it everytime I put it together. It's now 2 years later and I still need to grease it every 3 or 4 times I put it together but it sure is a nice tight fit.
MOO,
Matt
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Author: Rick
Date: 2002-12-17 15:17
Regarding the play testing. I recently purchased a "professional grade" clarinet from one of the majors that supposedly play tests their instruments and although I can't say that there were 18 specific items wrong with the clarinet, there were a couple of glaring things like double pads on a key. Missing cork buffer pads on two keys and a huge amount of slop in the LH F key. Fifty buck with a local repair tech took care of it. So I second the idea of just figuring in the look over money.
Personally I'd love to have the ability to go to a local store but unfortunately none offer any selection at all and I understand why they do not.
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Author: Dan
Date: 2002-12-17 15:45
I just called the WW & BW to receive a Return Authorization number and after the salesperson found out about all of the problems with the clarinet, he pronounced it defective and told me that they would send me a FedEx label to return it! I really wasn't expecting that at all. I don't know whether it's a new policy for them to pay for defective instrument return shipments, but it certainly impressed me greatly.
Just thought you'd like to know.
Dan
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