 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: anon
Date: 2002-11-23 20:05
I was really into music in high school and decided that I want to be an instrumental music teacher so I am currently a music education major in college. There is no profession that I wish to persue more. In fact I already think about things I want to do when I'm a band director. Clarinet playing always came somewhat naturally to me and I was always considered to be pretty good in high school. I even got a music scholarship for college.
However, in college I have a teacher who I'm not really clicking with. He's very talented but he makes me feel awful. He scoffs and laughs at me when I make mistakes and makes somewhat harsh comments. The head of the music department at my school told me that if he says or does anything that is out of line, I should bring it to the department's attention because they seem to have had problems with him in the past. Aside from this, I just don't enjoy playing my clarinet very much anymore. However, I do enjoy playing my saxophone. When I try to practice my clarinet, I always end up getting frustrated by my inabilities and poor habits, and I always dread going to my lesson because I know I will be ripped apart for what I can't and even what I think I can do. I can sit and play my saxophone for hours though.
I have two questions. 1) Has anyone had to deal with a teacher who they just didn't like dealing with? I have no choice but to take lessons from him. There is no other clarinet teacher at my college. How did you keep your self-esteem up?
2) Has anyone ever been in my position with finding that their "main instrument" was not much fun to play anymore? Do you encourage me to switch my applied major to an instrument that is fun (sax) or are there reasons to stick with it? Remember, I want to be a teacher, not a professional performer. I'm just wondering if it's common to feel this frustrated.
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Author: Burt
Date: 2002-11-23 20:17
Yes, when I was in high school, I had a clarinet teacher I could not deal with. He was sponsored by the school and was on his way to becoming one of the top performers in the country. Soon I was on my way to finding another clarinet teacher.
This certainly hurt my chances in high school music, but I had to take the better of two bad alternatives.
Since you have to take lessons from this teacher (or else what?), remember that it's not forever. Find the alternatives and, if there's no good one, wait it out.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2002-11-23 21:19
Even though you must take from him for college purposes, perhaps you could take private lessons on the side from someone that you are more compatible with. You deserve a teacher who will help you build your ability and your self esteem. This may give you the strength to get through the lessons with this teacher who seems to be more interested in his ego trip than teaching.
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Author: Laura
Date: 2002-11-23 21:32
I went to a college where I didn't agree with my clarinet instructors's teaching style. It got so bad that I changed my degree from Bachelor of Music to Bachelor of Arts so that I didn't have to take any more lessons (BA lesson unit requirements were less than that for a BM) from that teacher. But at the same time, I took lessons from someone outside of the college. That helped me.
Even though I had resentment towards my former college teacher, now looking back, I sometimes refer to what was said during those lessons while I practice now (grudgingly). It didn't make me want to quit, but it did lesson my want to play the clarinet.
I say don't quit the clarinet because of one person. Try sticking through it. If your teacher continually says something rude, mean or hurtful about your playing, point it out to him and say that those type of comments make you want to quit. Ask if he could rephrase it in a way that makes it positive. Try working on it together?
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Author: Jean
Date: 2002-11-23 22:08
The fact the department chair wants you to tell him(her) about it says to me you are not alone. It is a shame instructors who treat students poorly are allowed to do so. Sounds like your teacher hates his job and should be doing something else. Whenever I hear a teacher complain about their job I tell thim they should quit as they aren't doing anyone any favors by sticking around...
I am a former teacher who could no longer go into the teacher's lounge because I got so tired of hearing how much people hated their jobs. If they hate it that much do they have any clue how much their students' hate having them as teachers? I suspect not.
I would tell you to stick it out, but I won't lie to you, it probably won't get any better. If the clarinet is your primary instrument and you are going to be spending the next few years of your life taking lessons is there another school you can transfer to? Not everyone is going to get along, but why feel so lousy all the time? There are plenty of good schools with excellent clarinet instructors....if you have a scholarship at this school I am sure you can find a similar situation somewhere else. But check out your lesson instructor before making such a huge decision.
Good luck,
Jean
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Author: Irwin
Date: 2002-11-23 22:50
Anon,
If you're into show tunes, there's a great song from Chorus Line that you should listen to. The song is "Nothing" and it applies directly to your situation. Listen to it and it will help put things in perspective!
Bottom line: this teacher can't hurt your self esteem if you don't let him. Keep your chin up, stay focused on your goal, and, above all, get a better teacher as soon as you can.
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2002-11-23 22:59
Regarding self-esteem:
You've posted at a great time for me to tell you this, because it's only just come up in my lessons. I get very harsh criticism and feel that I'm no good, from myself. My teacher says it's possible I have a self-esteem problem, and I guess this is similar to what you're going through.
What I did was write down these negative points. No matter what they are, no matter how silly, no-one's going to see this list. If you think the world could end because of your bad playing, write that! Be extreme, write everything that comes to mind.
Now, underneath that, for each thing you wrote, find rational explanations why these things are *not* true. You may find, like I have, that it works very well, and there are many many more reasons why there aren't true than why they are.
And as for your teacher; you don't necessarily have to think that him laughing at your mistakes and giving you these criticisms, that he is right. You don't have to think he knows what's best for you because he's not you; he doesn't know what's going on inside. The best teacher you will have is yourself, he is only guiding you (although, as it sounds, not very well).
Talk to your faculty about him more - don't procrastinate, make a decision as decisively and as quickly as possible, and let him know you're not fooling around and you're serious about changing over to sax. He may change his attitude quicker than you think.
You've got to think about why you're having clarinet lessons and not sax lessons to start with. Is it because you enjoyed it more? If that's your main reason, and you're no longer enjoying it, make the switch, for your own piece of mind. You may find that your sax teacher is great, and, you'll pick up the clarinet and play that for hours too, since you don't have this teacher anymore.
Whatever you decide to do, keep in mind your happiness is important, and don't let this teacher get away with what he's been doing, and that you desserve better.
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-11-24 02:25
Your teacher is obviously insecure and frustrated in his current role. It also appears, from what you say, that your department head is afraid of this guy. You already know you'll get no help there. What a mess!!!:) Next time your 'teacher' ridicules you, tell him to stuff it. A competent teacher would not be offended by that. However... If he blows up, the bigger it is the better, the higher ups may not be able to ignor him anymore. It's not up to you to tell them about him (again) - let him tell on himself.
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Author: Jim E.
Date: 2002-11-24 04:31
Yes, it happened to me 32 years ago. I changed from music ed to elementary ed. and graduated from that department. It was well known that this teacher (again the only clarinet prof, long tenured, and very non-responsive) was responsible for the large number of sax majors at that school. However, I didn't (and don't) play sax and didn't want to learn. It was rumored that this was a deliberate ploy on his part to keep his student load down, deliberate or not, it worked! He taught at that college for more that 30 years before retiring.
Being a lot smarter now than I was 32 years ago... I suggest you try to set up a conference with the music Dept Chair and the dean responsible for the music dept/ school and see if an arrangement can be made for an outside clarinet teacher to serve as your major prof on adjunct instructor basis. I suspect that if this is workable, it would be at your expense, though if your school charges a separate fee for music instruction (some do) perhaps they would waive it. I would make it clear to them that your alternative plan if they can't accomodate you is to transfer to another college (and you really would need to be willing to follow through on that if it came to it. Students transfer regularly for much less valid reasons than you have.)
No teacher has the right to laugh at a student's mistakes EVER! In my opinion that is definitely "out of line" behavior. My son's second grade teacher used ridicule on him and called him "stupid." It took almost ten years to restore his self confidence.
Good luck and let us know how you make out.
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-11-24 07:17
The above suggestiopns are not at all bad, but I fail to find them quite strong enough.
Examine the possibility of changing Colleges. Do not wait. Do it now. Anyone who laughs at student errors is not a genuine instructor, but rather a sadistic swine.
Get away from this sub-human glob of dross as quickly as possible. And when you are asked why you have chosen to leave, explain the entire situation in thorough detail *in writing*. As you hand this paper to the Music Department Head, shake his other hand and leave with a smile, because you will be headed for greener pastures.
Some people simply should *not* teach. I fear you have found one of them. If this is currently your only choice, then I suggest you should quit being current.
Feel absolutely free to correspond with me by direct email. I will not laugh at you, expose you, or do anything else with the intention of being negative toward you. I even may be able to make further suggestions that I hope can help.
Please, do not allow a situation that presents itself cause doubts to grow within you. Don't change yourself; improve your situation, instead. And do it however you can. The politics in *any* educational institution are not infrequently virtually unbelievable. Been there, done that, got several sweatshirts. If you don't like it where you are, seek alternative educational opportunities. There are hundreds of institutions in this country alone which could likely do you much better. Take advantage of at least one of them. And believe me, if this school where you are going absolutely will not offer you an alternative to their one-and-only Clarinet teacher, and the Music Department head seems to have more than one complaint already about this jerk, what are you doing there but wasting your time?
If you were treated this way by an employer, you should quit the job, don't you think? Just as soon as you could line up another one? Well, my suggestion is simple: Line up another school. And don't waste any more time doing it.
Plan your life toward your own personal success, not trying to satisfy someone you can't stand.
Regards,
John
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Author: Allen Cole
Date: 2002-11-24 07:55
I agree that you need to look at making a change. I didn't click with my college instructor either, although unlike your's mine was a terrific guy. No personality conflict--we just didn't click as teacher and student. In those days, I often had much more fun playing saxophone, too.
Just be careful of temptation. Sax is tempting to run to because it works so much better in difficult keys than the clarinet. But if you're looking towards a professional career, many of your greatest challenges as a woodwind player are going to come on the clarinet.
I agree with the poster who said you should consider changing colleges. It's one thing not to click. It's another thing if the guy is mean and sarcastic. Your instrument lessons are where your true apprenticeship lies. You don't need to have a teacher who seems to be working against you.
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Author: Jim Mougey
Date: 2002-11-24 11:02
There are two sides to every story. I would like to read teachers side. A respected orchestra director at a certain college said to me"Whine, whine, whine that's all I hear all day long. Each year it gets worse. I will not stand for this. Do what you're supposed to do and maybe things will get better. The thing that really ticks me off is the lack of practice room time. How can those practice halls be so quite when my students say they play so well? The real world will soon be here for some, and the bumps are so hard."
I'm retired! Jim (M)
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Author: Rick
Date: 2002-11-24 14:18
A couple of points to consider.
First, if the department head is asking you to come to them with any problems, then most likely they are on a head hunting mission themselves. You might want to do what they ask and the problem may go away.
I did have exactly the same experience, but in HS and in that case, the teacher in question would grab whatever instrument from the player and scream, "if you can't play any better than that, then don't play at all." Something like 50% of the students dropped out over my time in HS. I was one of them. It was so bad that for 10 years if I heard a clarinet on the radio, I switched channels. I couldn't stand the sound of a clarinet. Dropping the instrument was one of the biggest mistakes of my life though.
Quitting is easy and it is habit forming. As a college student, your in the semi-adult stage of life and what do you think someone say who is forty and shelling out serious money would do with this guy? You are the customer of this school, plain and simple and this person is not providing the quality of education that you are paying for.
If what you say is truely happening, then your in the right and this teacher and school are in the wrong. Your paying them to provide you an education and they are failing to do that. Either have them fix the situation or get your money back!
Another boring True Life Example:
When I was an undergraduate, I had to take a english comp pass fail class, that was taught by a grad student. At the end of the first semester, every guy in the class failed, every gal passed. Some of us did some research and found out that this wasn't unusual for this guy and that because of it he had been on academic suspension 5 times. According to university rules, any instructor who was placed on academic suspension 3 times was to be fired. Several of us went to the Dean of the English School and complained. He said we could repeat the course and the failing grade would be removed. Yeah, we just pay for it again. To shorten the story, we threatened to take it to the papers and sue, so they had a full professor grade our papers and 98% of us passed and the guy finally was removed from teaching and hence his grad program went bye bye.
If you want to play the clarinet then play it, but you have to fight or you'll end up like me as a 40 year old rethread going, "why did I let that SO-whatever ruin this for me!"
Best
RW
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Author: Suzanne
Date: 2002-11-24 22:36
Unfortunately the "real world" of music is often just as harsh, so, while you should definitely get out of the situation you are in if you have any control over it, at the same time, be prepared to deal with criticism. Most likely, it won't end after college, though it probably will come in different forms (no matter how well you play).
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2002-11-25 14:05
In order to achieve a measure of greatness in any area, most people must pass through a "season of fire." These are times when we are misunderstood, mocked and otherwise discouraged from our goal. If we stay the course because we know we are doing what we should be doing, we will come out a better person and a much better musician. If you read biographies of famous people, you will find their lives were filled with more than one season of these trying situations. I believe the most difficult are the ones that involve personal relationships with people like your teacher.
Don't give up your goal too easily. Every season changes for the better eventually.
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2002-11-25 18:38
anon -
I agree with John McAuley. If this instructor is putting you down (particularly where other people have complained), it's no disgrace to transfer to another school. People do it all the time.
As Suzanne says, the other side is that you will run into abusive people many times in your life. One of the best books on overcoming negative feelings is A Soprano on Her Head by Eloise Ristad. It's one of the few books that really can make a difference.
Talk to other clarinet students to find out how they deal with this guy. Some of them must have found a way. Also, if a bunch of students got together to complain, it will have more credibility.
Finally, ask yourself whether he know something you don't. Take it. You've earned it. Get as much as you can while you wait out the year.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-11-25 19:12
I usually refrain from responding more than once but I feel compelled to restate my opinion, in agreement with a couple of other's, that you should stand your ground, Anon. As long as you're doing your part (studying, completing assignments), you don't have to let this guy's personal problems turn you away from your goal. That'll happen only if you choose to allow him to beat you up. If he can't teach properly, he should take his leave - not you. Politely, and without raising your voice, tell the man to take his browbeating teaching methods and stuff them. What can he do about it... tell you to find another teacher? Flunk you, so you can appeal and haul out the dirty laundry? Who knows?... you might even become friends. It's happened before, believe it or not.
Standing your ground now will prepare you for the 'real world', no matter what occupation you pursue in the future.
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Author: David
Date: 2002-11-25 22:13
This guy should not be teaching. Learning any instrument should be a pleasure. What's the Principal doing? If he's had trouble with this prat before, he should have done something about it. There's no reason that you should suffer, just because it's your turn.
After school. Balaclava. Baseball bat. No one here will blame you, or grass you up. And remember it's all in the wrist action. [Not that I am in any way condoning violence, of course. ]
Alternatively, you could bring along your Dad / Big Brother to a PTA Meeting to sort him out. A good character to get into would be Dennis Hopper.
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Author: anon
Date: 2002-11-26 03:09
I have decided to talk to my academic advisor about my situation. A few years ago, a group of girls brought some things he said to the department's attention. Apparently he was almost fired for being sexist, so he is on somewhat of a probation right now. I'm sure my advisor can give me good advice. She is both a professional musician and an excellent teacher, not to mention a really caring person. Thank you all for your advice. This is a very frustrating and discouraging situation for me. By the way, I felt particularly empowered by your suggestion, Irwin. I dug out that CD and listened to it, just to boost my confidence! Thanks again everyone.
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2002-11-27 02:03
Do be careful, you could end up being used (or abused).
It's YOUR money, you should get the most from your tuition.
A harsh taskmaster is not unheard of amongst serious institutions.
If derision is commonplace from the instructor, no reason not to shop for another. Be serious in your self-examination, you really must hold up your end for the education to be valid.
I heard the same complaint at my last college from two different students; one tremendously talented but supremely lazy, the other an average player but driven - they found my teacher to be harsh.
I'm an adult amateur, so I saw eye-to-eye with the instructor and my goals were entirely personal.
You, as the product of a program, are a walking advertisement.
Everyone wants to have the best publicize the program.
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