 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: Morrigan
Date: 2002-10-28 05:32
In the past, I have had many many problems with my wrist due to my thumb position; last year I almost got to the point of having an operation.
My point is that I do not feel that thumbrests, in their current state, are adequate to support the instrument. I had Greg Smith teach me a new method, and things have been fine since. However, I still feel like I'm going to drop the instrument when I play, for example, F/C (LH thumb). This tiny piece of metal sticking out from the back is small, unsupportive, and very painful, and I feel it also puts off beginners.
Someone needs to do something; make some alternatives. I think something similar to the bassoon's RH rest would be great, as it could also promote correct finger position. Whatever the case, it needs more support. This way, companies do not need to be so weight-conscious of their instruments as it is no longer a high-priority factor, and we can start to see more developments in the quality of the clarinet.
Any thoughts? Anyone know more about this than I would? I'm just speaking from a player's point of view, there are many factors I don't know about.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: bob49t
Date: 2002-10-28 06:58
Morrigan,
The first suggestion would be to try a thumbrest condom (one of these thick rubber add ons) which take away the initial harshness of the cork below the thumbrest.
Then I suggest you venture into :-
www.tonkooiman.com
or just type <kooiman> in your search engine.
They have two products which might help you. I have a "Maestro" for each of my heavy Eaton clarinets. I suffered from RSI of my right arm. What a difference ! The basic concept is to reduce the leverage applied to the thumb via the last joint, and to move it to the next joint up. The Maestro is infinitely adjustable in all directions and is beautifully engineered. It is removable to pack away and I find it helps with hand position and does not affect my ability to get to the side trill keys as others have found.
I'm sure there will be a thread about Kooiman and other suggestions.
There are other solutions - involving neckstraps, harnesses, floor stands and of course- sky hooks !
More power to your elbow !
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ron b
Date: 2002-10-28 07:27
Morrigan -
Something similar to, perhaps a bit smaller than, a bassoon crutch for a clarinet is feasible. It might even be designed to fit to the same screw holes as the present thumb rest so little, if any, modification to the instrument would be necessary (so's not to spoil its trade in value). I've given it some thought but never done anything because I haven't found a need to (yet). The standard bassoon crutch shape would have to be modified somewhat to suit the hand position of the clarinet player. But, sure, it's not at all out of the question.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Wes
Date: 2002-10-28 07:27
If possible, try daily calisthenics for a few minutes with some of the time devoted to weight lifting. Good luck!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Melanie
Date: 2002-10-28 07:45
I have had problems with my thumbrest also. I got and adjustable one, and it has helped quite a bit. I also practice with a wrist brace quite often. My students have also had problems. I have found that the best thing I can do for that is to teach them to play with no tension in their forearms. This also helps finger position. I have one student that I am convinced need s a neckstrap though. If you do this, how do the clarinet neckstraps work? Where do they attach? Do you need a special thumbrest?
Melanie
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Morrigan
Date: 2002-10-28 08:22
bob49t
Thank you! I think I might get one of those, they look good, but I also may look into the bassoon crutch, because I think support should also be on the palm of the hand (for me, personally).
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2002-10-28 11:53
How can the instrument be supported by the palm when the palm is not facing upwards?
Or do you mean the fleshy (muscle) area between the thumb and first finger?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-10-28 11:55
Lessee,
There's a number of options already available:
Different types of thumbrests (Kooiman, etc.)
Straps
Support devices such as Phred
You might want to checkout all of these.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Miles
Date: 2002-10-28 12:05
Hello Morrigan,
Something you might want to consider is to purchase a new type of thumbrest. There is a new one out but will cost you some $$$ and you will need a repairman to install but it really works great after you get it adjusted to your needs. It is called the Kooiman thumb rest made by Ton Kooiman. Hope this will help.
Miles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: bob49t
Date: 2002-10-28 12:31
Morrigan,
Can't get my head round the palm rest support. Your palm is facing <180 degrees out. Anything which is attached even to the web between thumb and forefinger will definitely restrict you from fully getting to the side trill keys or am I missing something big ?
The principle of the bassoon crutch is to keep the hand position above the bassoon body to control hand positon and to allow the right thumb to easy reach the myriad of thumb keys. Any palm pressure is applied downwards and slightly inwards, unless a seat strap is used (then I think the pressure would be nil). Looks like we're working in opposites here, but I do miss the obvious at times!
Keep going though, something might be sparked off ! I'd be tempted to get a Kooiman on approval and see how it goes (might save you a few brain cells in the long run)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Brent
Date: 2002-10-28 12:33
I've always found that the standard non-adjustable thumbrest is too low on the instrument for comfortable playing. Merely turning it upside-down helps quite a bit. I always have to put on a piece of rubber tubing as a cushion, but this seems to often help a younger student who is having difficulty with right hand position. I don't say that it fixes everything, but it often makes things better. I still end up with a few students who need a neck strap, and that's OK.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Hank
Date: 2002-10-28 12:50
Hi Morrigan and all,
There was a device called the Schmidt Clarinet Positioner (SCP)and as I recall, it was developed by a clarinet teacher at Florida or Florida State University in the mid-1960s.
The SCP had a neck strap and a little post/stand arrangment that conected to the middle section of the clarinet like a lyre but the shaft was toward the body. Where the shaft met the body, there was a small flat plate that was against the players' abdomen and also an eye for the neck strap to hook into.
I thought this was a great idea at the time and am sorry I did not get a SCP. However, knowing that we have many skilled "craftsmen and craftswomen" on the BB, I'd think an old lyre could be made to work in some similar fashion, at least enough so that you could find out if the concept worked for you.
Hank
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: msroboto
Date: 2002-10-28 12:51
Melanie -
The neckstrap has a slit im it and the thumbrest is placed through the slit.
I use the cheaper Ton Kooiman thumbrest. If anybody wants to try this try to get the black one. It is plastic and comes in a variety of colors but the black one blends in better than say bright yellow. It does a lot to take the pressure off the thumb. I was having a lot of pain and numbness with the original adjustable thumbrest on the R-13.
Recently I tried my old Bundy out with the regular thumbrest just to see if after all this time I thought I could use a regular thumbrest and no such luck still was painful.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Susan
Date: 2002-10-28 13:31
Neck straps/replacements thumb rests/stands, etc. are all good things to try (I use a neck strap myself), but it's also important to look at underlying problems. Hand position needs to be evaluated, of course, but you should also look at your overall posture. If the core muscles of the torso are not strong enough and are not being utilized properly to support the arms, undue pressure will be transferred to the wrists and hands. I recommend a program of Pilates, ballet, or yoga to improve core strength and correct body alignment. Posture and hand position are also very important at the computer keyboard - chronic strain acquired here can negatively affect one's clarinet playing, too.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Morrigan
Date: 2002-10-28 23:59
Thanks for all the suggestions guys.
One underlying factor is that everyone is saying that some of my ideas may restrict hand movement. However, restricting HAND movement could just be the best thing to do, because I move my fingers from the knuckle, not the whole hand. I do not need to move my whole hand to reach the trill keys. This is something I have worked on for a while. I think if you move your whole hand while playing, then your technique may be restricting you, not your thumbrest!
The Kooniman thumbrest looks great - something I will definitely look into.
Please know I am not seeking alternate means to aleviate any pain or discomfort; I am purely investigating this because of the 'normal' thumbrest's lack of support for the instrument, which occasionally impairs my finger technique.
I'll keep trying!!!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2002-10-30 00:31
Stephen Fox of Toronto, OT makes a 'belly pad' prop as described above for use with his Basset clarinet.
It takes getting used to, but really does the job.
I think the PHRED is a better solution, and rides either on a belt catch or against the player's chair. (Less fuss)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Hank
Date: 2002-10-30 01:56
Several have mentioned PHRED. Anyone have a link as I tried a web search and got ???????????
Hank
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Hank
Date: 2002-10-30 02:02
Several have mentioned PHRED. Anyone have a link as I tried a web search and got ???????????
Hank
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Josh Schultze
Date: 2002-10-30 14:53
I must agree with Brent's statement that the non adjustable thumbrest is way too low. For me the issue is not the weight of clarinet on the thumb, rather I find a higher thumbrest position allows more leverage for my thumb to help push the clarinet mouthpiece against the top of my teeth. I find this to be helpful in the sounding of the throat tones and the altissimo register: in general most notes with many open tone holes.
Take care,
Josh
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
