 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Lisa
Date: 2002-10-18 04:12
I am trying to learn something about a clarinet I got in a oawn shop. It is a Buescher 400 special (I think that is because it is made out of wood). Does anyone know anything about this? I have a serial number also. I am trying to find out when it was made, what quality horn it is, etc. It cannot be too old because the keys are not too worn. Anyway, any info would be helpful. Thanks!
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2002-10-18 06:31
While you're answering Lisa's question, I have a beuscher aristocrat alto sax. How is the quality of that (both beuscher)? And would a better than stock mouthpiece be worth the investment (aka, would it improve it enough not to spend more money on a new sax considering I only use it in small community/church bands)
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2002-10-18 14:30
You can look up serial #'s vs year of manufacture right here, just go to the Home page, scroll down to Equipment, go there and to "How Old is My" and to Buescher, OR just post your # [put x's for the last several #'s if you wish] and someone will help you [like me] with a slightly diff. listing. Sfalexi [??], my first alto sax was a B Aristocrat [about 1935], I dont know how long the name was used. B was bought by Selmer {USA?] in 1963 per my list and ?added-to? the Bundy line. Search our Phorum for better info. Don
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2002-10-18 14:50
The older Buescher saxes are in great demand for classical work. Sigurd Rascher played one.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: tim k
Date: 2002-10-18 15:20
Pre-Selmer Buescher saxes are wonderful horns. The quality declined when Selmer took over. If your serial number is below about 330,000 or so it's a true Buescher. An early Buescher Aristocrat is good for almost any kind of music, with the possible exception of raucus rock. The sound tends to the refined end of the spectrum. A better mouthpiece can help a lot. But vintage saxes often get better intonation with fairly large round chamber pieces. Play the piece with a tuner before buying.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2002-10-18 16:24
While the purchase of a better mouthpiece may or may not allow you to put off the purchase of a better horn, it is almost always worthwhile to get the best mouthpiece that you can afford. This way you will not only benefit immediately but will have a good mouthpiece to try out those new horns with. The mouthpieces that come with clarinets really should NOT be used to make comparisons as they are generally not good and you may pass on a wonderful horn that merely has a crappy mouthpiece.
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-10-18 16:40
I've heard no complaints about Buescher clarinets so I suppose they're okay.
As stated above, earlier saxes are much in demand. The metal used for Buescher and many other older saxes had more 'meat' to them (heavier gauge) and is harder than what's used today. The metals used today are softer, not as well tempered, less capable of the brilliant sound so many sax players favor. I suppose it's easier for the manufacturing process, I don't know... but detrimental to anything better than an 'average' sound. Because of the (inferior) metal, saxes of recent manufacture are also more prone to get out of adjustment. Some sax keys will bend if you give 'em a hard look; they're just not as rugged as the older ones.
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Author: Fred
Date: 2002-10-18 17:38
Buescher made some high end saxes with the 400 designation. I "assume" that giving that designation to a clarinet meant that it was fairly high up in their line.
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Author: super20dan
Date: 2002-10-18 23:26
finally i see you guys are stumped.the buescher 400 clarinet is the same as the selmer signet . i dont think buescher ever made thereown clarinets, just re named selmer student models.
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Author: Terry Horlick
Date: 2002-10-19 01:39
The aristocrat is a good sax. OTOH you can make any sax into a stinker with a crummy (read that "stock") mouthpiece. Do not pass go, and go directly to your music store or mail order and immerse yourself in mouthpiece trials.
I used to stick to the Wolf Taynes, Otto Links, Claude Lakeys etc. but recently heard a new sax player on the radio and did some research on him. After locating him in a university in Iowa(!!!) I had a nice e-mail exchange with him. I ended up buying the same piece he is using... turns out that Vandoren makes some nice cool jazz mouthpieces.
My recommendation on clarinet is about the same, try several pieces. I ended up getting a Greg Smith and he even sent several variations out to try. Best thing is he is a Sneezy sponsor. The mouthpiece and barrel makes a huge difference in your sound.
IMHO, TH
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2002-10-19 04:56
Don,
SFAlexi is an abbreviation of my nickname. Name is really "Alexi". Sorry to confuse you. But funny though. Way to note the confusion like you did!
-->Alexi
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2002-10-19 05:03
My sax is serial number 554,??? (bad shortterm memory between look at it and typing) so it's definitely not the older, pre-selmer Beuscher saxes. Not one of the good aristocrats. But now at least I know that it's a Bundy sax with a bought out label on it. Oh well. I guess for 100 bucks I shouldn't have expected a horn that would be in great demand for much. I'll get a better sax down the road if I decide I truly wanna double. As a matter of fact, I think I'll post a new post on the subject of doubling. . .
Alexi
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Author: Paul
Date: 2002-11-01 20:38
I believe you were asking about a Buescher Aristocrat alto sax.
They are highly thought of. A new sax is unlikely to be of similar quality unless you spend $1500 or more. See www.saxgourmet.com and www.saxontheweb.net also www.saxpics.com. Older saxes do not always intonate well with modern mouthpieces, but if you try enough of them, you will find one which will not only intonate well , but will also brighten your sound, IF that is what you desire. I would not buy a mouthpiece without trying it with a well warmed up sax and a tuner to check it out. Korg makes a popular tuner , but I like the Target tuner, read the directions on the target tuner, tho, it is very precise, but that is a setting, the initial setting is for beginning players and just tells you you are "getting warm" and is not adequate for testing a mouthpiece. Mouthpiece / reed selection is a lifetime quest, don't give up right away. If your sax is in good working order and seals well, why get another newer expensive instrument, and sertainly why get a cheaply made Chinese instrument for several hundred dollars. If not, have a good tech bring your instrument into proper order. Bueschers in general ,probably play more precisely in tune than most saxes, are durable, and with a selection of mouthpieces are capable of a wider than usual varity of tones. If you play in church bands , look into purchase of an old "C Melody: sax. Many Church players "MICE ELF" included like the C saxes as you can play directly from the hymnal without transposing, especicially handy , when the Pastor , in a moment of inspiration, changes the hymn number to an unfamiliar tune !!!
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Author: Mice Elf
Date: 2002-11-01 21:21
OOPS, now I see you do not have an older 30s-50s Aristocrat. Oh well, so it is not Great after all. But do not be ashamed of a Bundy in the least.
Consider that Bundys were intended for school bands. The requirements in a school band are : 1 Rugged enough for a 12 year old to drop off the bus step and still play. 2. to play in tune well enough not to cause the band director to commit suicide when 6 of them start blowing at the same time. 3. Being easy blowers , as little kids do not have full sized lungs yet #4 being light enough (fast) in the action for those little paws.
Now what does a pro player NEED : #1 Rugged, you cannot make a buck with a broken horn #2 in tune, your job is on the line # 3 easy blowing as 4 hours of rock can be taxing #4 light fast action.
It amazes me how many Pros insist on playing delicate, temperamental Selmer Mk VIs and such, and then worrying all night whether the Drummer will knock it off the stand, or someone will steal your $6000 horn will you are in the restroom.
Mice Elf loves his Bundy Bari, which is really a buescher 400 , but it could be replaced for under $1000 easily, and a bundy alto can be found in good order for a couple hundred. Some of those Bundys were really Keilwerths ,too !!!
I also have a Elkhart (by Buescher) so-called "student" tenor from the 40s which is incredible, cost me about $300. If it were lost/damaged, I would find another at a similar price, It is LOUD, with a 6 1/2 inch bell, and I like it everybit as much as my the Martin, My Kohlert, and my Dolnet. in fact it is More versatile.
So the deal is , I just take the $400 mouthpiece off and put it in my pocket, and if I return to the bandstand and the horn is gone, or broken, the world has not come to an end , as it would for the Selmer player, just out to the car and get another great old $300 horn from the trunk, pop on that killer mouthpiece and put the Stratocaster guitar player back in his place again !!!
BTW Mice Elf makes no pretense to be an actual saxophone player, he is a bass player with 40 years nerve damage from it, so he pretends to be a sax player and is so LOUD, no one can get near enough to throw him off stage
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