 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Jessica
Date: 2002-06-02 20:25
I have an old(?) Evette & Schaeffer wooden clarinet that I am interested in getting some more info on. It was a gift to me a few years ago by a fellow musician who didn't know much about it except that he had it.
The bell and upper section are marked with the circular logo of Everette&Schaeffer, Paris, France. Model Buffet-Cranpor.
Any ideas??
Thanks!
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2002-06-02 20:30
Probably "Model Buffet Crampon" or "Modele Buffet Crampon". More help could be given if you would list the serial number. Also, a <b>search</b> on Evette and Schaeffer or <b> Master Model</b> would yeild quite a bit of information.
jbutler
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Author: nzdonald
Date: 2002-06-02 22:24
do you still have the original mouthpiece? can i have it!!!!!!!!!
(you may be able to finance a nice holiday somewhere if it's an old chedeville blank)
donald
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Author: Jessica
Date: 2002-06-03 02:13
Thanks for the help! From what I can find, it is indeed a Modele Buffet Crampon. Interestingly enough, the logo is a simple oval, nothing ornate like all the web sites show. The oval is a dotted line, but no crown or anything lying outside the oval. And at a second glance, the neck is labeled in the same oval "Evette sponsored by Buffet, Paris France".
Serial #B2542.
As for the mouthpiece, I will have to see if I have it. It's in another case with the Bundy (whoopie do!).
It needs major work, new keys, pads and corks. I'm trying to decide if it's worth the investment to have it overhauled.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-06-03 04:22
Hi Jessica,
The barrel you have is a replacement and doesn't actually (or, at least, "officially") match your clarinet, though it may work fine. The barrel comes from an old (probably pre-1964) Evette model. The Evette & Schaeffer was a high-end intermediate model, the forerunner to the E13. It was made in Paris in the same factory as the professional models. The Evette was a wooden student model, the forerunner to the E11. According to an old Buffet brochure, at the time your barrel was made, it was also made in Paris by Buffet but in a different factory than the professional models and the E&S.
You have a "B-series" E&S. The last series for the E&S was the K-series. According to the Boosey & Hawkes serial number list, K4000 was made in 1952. I have seen one on eBay with a K4xx serial number. The seller had an apparent sales receipt for the instrument dated 1942. The B series preceded the K-series (and there may have been a C series in between but, if so, I think it was short-lived). I think your instrument probably dates from the 1940's if the K-series started in the early 50's or in the late 30's - early 40's if the K series truly started around 1942. My basis for this estimate is tenuous. Buffet does not appear to have serial numbers from this time period. Perhaps they were lost during WWII. However, I have an A-series with keywork almost identical to a 1934 professional model that a friend of mine has and I would place it somewhere between the late 20's and mid-30's. Yours should fall between that instrument and the K-series.
In its day, your clarinet was a decent instrument, just below Buffet's professional model. However, now it represents very old technology. On eBay, it would likely sell below $200, even with an overhaul. IMO, whether it's worth an overhaul is a tossup. If you have some free time this summer and are reasonably handy, maybe you could try doing it yourself. There are instructions for most of the steps salted around this site (sort of like Easter eggs ;^) ).
BTW, if you do have the original mouthpiece, don't plan to travel much farther than your local cinema. "Chedeville" Buffet mouthpieces are pretty common and, even in pristine condition, usually don't bring much on eBay. I picked up new-old-stock alto and bass mouthpieces for $35 each. I think that, if one was patient, one could pick up a Bb on eBay for $20 - $80, though I seem to remember someone paying over $500 for one awhile back -- likely someone who didn't really know what he was doing.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Sandra F. H.
Date: 2002-06-03 16:10
Hi! I did alot of research on the E&S clarinets. You can do this by searching here on the bulletin board. Sandra
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Author: Mike_M
Date: 2002-06-03 19:36
nzdonald: how would you know if the original mp was an old chedeville blank? What marks should we look for?
Also, I've seen these E&S clarinets going for $350 to $495 (in very good condition) in music stores.
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Author: nzdonald
Date: 2002-06-03 21:43
Mike M- re chedeville blank question
i'm the wrong person to ask.... i don't really know that much about it- but there are plenty of other experts here on sneezy, and it's probably a good idea to search old postings.
i have seen E&S mouthpieces going for hundreds of US$, and having played one or two of them understand why.... but i don't really know which ones are the best etc... (this will ofer course depend on a number of factors, including the facing) it won't be hard for you to find out though
donald
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Author: Mike_M
Date: 2002-06-03 23:32
I’m kind of surprised that the Evette-Sponsored by… barrel will fit the E&S clarinet. I have a newer Evette & Schaeffer (SN K337xx) and an older “Evette-Sponsored by Buffet” (SN B85xx) they are both nice intermediate level instruments, but the joints on the Evette-Sponsored by… are larger than any other clarinet I’ve ever seen (I haven’t really seen that many though).
I happen to have the original E&S mouthpiece. From looking at other post on the bboard, it looks like it is a hard rubber Chedeville blank. It is a surprisingly good mouthpiece to be a stock mp that came with an instrument. I’m getting ready to put the instrument up for sale; maybe I’ll sell the mp separately.
Anyway Jessica, you say it needs new keys… are some keys missing or broken? You may luck out and find an instrument restorer who has some keys that will fit, otherwise the restoration could get pricey. If you knew that the clarinet plays well; that the wood was dimensionally in good shape, it plays in tune, with good resonance, than it may be worth $350 to $550. However, if keys are missing then it may be difficult to make this determination beforehand.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-06-04 14:23
I just measured the outside diameter of two Evette "Sponsored by ..." clarinets, and E&S and an R13. Taking into account the fact that I was using a cheap set of plastic calipers, the measurements were all within (probably less than) .5mm. (The R13 was the one that was smaller than the others.) The Evettes are, in my estimate, from the 30's or 40's (no alphabetic prefix to the serial number, G# and A throat keys share a post). The E&S and the R13 are both from the 60's. The Evette barrel fit the E&S upper joint very nicely. In any case, as long as a barrel is socket is somewhat larger than the tenon, one could make the barrel fit by using a thick enough cork on the tenon. I'm not suggesting that is an optimal solution but it could be made to work.
As far as the mouthpiece is concerned, there are three marks that distinguish the "Chedeville - Buffet" mouthpieces: (1) the ligature line pattern is one line at the top and 3 closely-spaced lines at the bottom, (2) the word "France" without the quotes is engraved to the left of the table, (3) a facing identification, e.g., A, B, C, C- crown (symbol), etc., is engraved to the right of the table.
For the time being, there is a decent picture of the back of one of these at:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=873366855
Apparently, the Buffet logo can also be found beneath the lower ligature lines on some models and the spacing between the lower lines may vary. I think it possible, though I have no proof one way or the other, that the mouthpieces with wider spacing may be more recent and, may not even be Chedeville. I have one with the wider spacing and no "France" imprint that came with an instrument made in 1976.
A quick search of eBay turned up two Bb mouthpieces currently for sale. One has a current (below-reserve) bid of $10. No one has yet exercised the "buy-it-now" option at $50. The other has no bids with a minimum opening bid of $60. Three recently completed sales brought high bids ranging from around $25 to $38. So I will say again, IMO, these mouthpieces (at least the B, C and C-crown models) don't have alot of market value right now. If I could get "hundreds of dollars apiece" for all the ones I have picked up with old clarinets, I could fuel my "CAS" for some time to come. ;^)
One final note, according to Dave Tuttle, a Chicago dealer who frequently sells mouthpieces on eBay, Buffet bought these mouthpieces from Chedeville then refaced the Bb mouthpieces with the Buffet logo. According to him, Buffet did not reface the harmony mouthpieces marked Buffet or any of the mouthpieces marked "Evette & Schaeffer." That would make them true Chedevilles. Dave Tuttle was the first to identify these mouthpieces as Chedevilles in his auctions. While, Greg Smith has subsequently confirmed on this board that Chedeville made mouthpieces for Buffet, not all of Dave Tuttle's information has proven to be correct. For example, he claimed for quite awhile that the letter markings to the right of the table were not facing identifications but rather lot identifications. However, Buffet indicates otherwise in an older brochure that has since turned up.
Best regards,
jnk
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