 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-05-29 15:56
Ok, so it's not ENTIRELY a clarinet question...
With clarinets you have the Boehm fingeirng system, Oehler, Albert, and countless other one which are less common. Are there multiple fingering systems for oboe, other than the highly frustrating fingering system that seems to be out of date for me?
(No offense, oboe players, but your fingering system has so many weird tweaks that it's hard for me to even play a simple scale! Mind you, I've only played the thing twice...)
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Author: javier garcia
Date: 2002-05-29 16:23
David, there are two main system:
french system (or conservatory)
Wienner oboe (only in Austria)
the Wienner oboe is the natural development of baroque oboe. You can see some information (mainly in german) in the Wienner Oboe site:
http://wroboe.pcnews.at/
http://wroboe.iam.at/
AFAIK, there are three wienner oboe makers:
Rauch: http://woodwind.at/index.htm; http://members.aon.at/rauch.woodwinds
Guntram Wolf: http://www.guntramwolf.de/
Yamaha: http://www.yamaha.de
As I have read, the most famous maker (Zuleger) has closed his factory.
In the french system, there are the full automatic system (automatic 2 vent hole for high A and above), the conservatory system (2 vent with LH index) and Pestini (low B with LH thumb) (and others)
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2002-05-29 17:19
The English oboe key system is close to the French, but not identical. In particular, there's a lever for the left thumb. See the oboe section in Baines, Woodwind Instruments and Their History.
The Vienna oboe has the nearly the same fingerings as the French, but the bore is quite different, and third-register cross-fingerings start lower -- on A above the staff.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Eddie Ashton
Date: 2002-05-29 17:22
At least one manufacturer, (Boosey) in the U.K., produced oboes which had a saxohpone-fingering system. This, I think, probably in the 1930-40s. It wouldn't surprise me if C.G. Conn and others in the States didn't do likewise.
Anyway, c'mon Mr. Pegel, how can you call the Oboe fingering system peculiar? The Clarinet's got two different names for each fingering for crying out loud - how weird is that? ---------------- only joking ladies and gents! I don't play either so I'm in a neutral corner on this one.
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Author: Wes
Date: 2002-05-29 20:30
While the oboe fingering system is difficult, dated, illogical, and expensive, it is not likely to be changed in the future. This is because the existing players and teachers have all learned it, the manufacturers have little or no interest in changing it, and once you've learned it, you realize that fingering is the easiest thing about the oboe.
Boehm system oboes were made but did not catch on because of the reasons stated above. Most of the Boehm and "sax-fingered oboes would not have the bore wall thickness design of modern oboes so they would not fit, sound-wise, into today's orchestras. If one could buy a Boehm oboe with a modern Loree bore, the instrument might be easier to play on some notes. One would still have to make good reeds, learn how to play musically, and minimize the leaks in the instrument. Good luck!
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2002-05-30 12:03
I have a Heckel cor anglais the fingering is straight simple system and is just about the same as an Albert system clarinet without the break of course and with a saxophone style rocker octave vent operated by the G finger. Made of Rosewood. Bloody magic!!!
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Author: javier garcia
Date: 2002-05-30 13:18
Mark, are you sure it is an English Horn, or a Heckelphone?
Actually Heckel makes Bassoons, Contra and Heckelphones, but not oboes or EH (may be some years ago).
Heckel are the most famous bassoons, they are still hand made one by one.
see: www.heckel.de
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2002-05-30 14:17
Very good comments above, re: oboe history and resistance to [much]change by generations of players, likely based on the tonal character desires of oboists, conductors and composers. On trying to learn the French [Triebert +] oboe and Eng Horn, [after playing clars/saxes], my first question was "why not Boehm System"? I proceeded to look in the "Good Books", museums and patents, finding that a number of attempts were made, none apparently at all successful. See Bate [book and museum], a more recent Joppig book and a group of patents, inventor Dick Paladino {Las Vegas, ?do you know [of] him, Gary Van Cott??, I havent had any luck, and [on back] talked with Jack Linton about possibly building a Boehm !!!}. If anyone has knowledge in this area, please let US all know. Don
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