 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Kim L.
Date: 2002-04-22 18:25
Hey everybody!
I just went for my professional(teaching) interview and was told that because I lack the social skills and teaching ability will not be able to teach. Instead of getting a BS degree in music, I have been told that a BA in music would be better for me. What can you tell me about a BA in music? Will I be able to get jobs, whether they be music or something else just as easily as if I had a BS and were looking for a teaching job? What about playing in ensembles, will an organization such as Dallas Wind Symphony or New York Philharmonic(I don't know about the Philharmonic, but hey) accept somebody with a BA in music?
Thanks for your help in advance,
Kim L.
concerned music major
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Author: William
Date: 2002-04-22 21:18
When you are auditioning for a professional playing position, the only thing that really matters is what your previous playing experiance is and how well you currently play. Your academic credentials are not that important, so it wouldn't matter much between a BA or an BS. My advice, however, is to ignor that "professional interview" and go for the teaching degree if that is your dream. Incentive and desire are much more important than what some interviewer may say. Children need teachers who are dedicated to education and not just teaching because they can't get a professional performing gig. Have the best of both worlds--teach during the day and play professionally on weekends. Go for it--and Good Clarineting!!!!!!!
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Author: julia
Date: 2002-04-23 02:05
I didn;t know they had B.S. in music. But, anyway---you need a music ed. degree if you want to teach. so you can do that undergrad, or you can do a BA and then do masters in education.
Right now I have two separate degree programs...and its just because that;s what I love. It's SOOO many credits because its like four majors, but its great anyway. I'm doing:
B.A. Music
B.S. Inclusive elementary and special education (dual certification, plus a concentration which consists of 30 credits--where 36 is the major)
Whatever, do what you love and don't worry so much about the degree.
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Author: Jim E.
Date: 2002-04-23 04:16
I guess my question is where are you in your studies? Have you had student teaching (or practicum) yet? In my experience (I hold a BA in Elem. Ed, and NJ teaching cert.) such advice as was given to you is usually not given until after student teaching and is usually accompanied by a grade of "C" or less in student teaching. (Though that is quite late to learn that you will not be able to teach.)
If teaching is your interest, you may well want to speak with someone else in the music department or elsewhere in your school.
If you are uncertain about your ability to teach, you might want to try some subbing on breaks, In most of NJ you need only 60 credits (in anything) to sub, I'm sure it varies in other areas. (The good news is that they will PAY you! ...about $90/ day around here.) You also might try working in a summer camp (again paid) or teaching Sunday school or leading a church youth choir if you are a church oriented person (no pay likely from a church.)
College degrees are not standardized as to BS BA BMus etc. I mentioned that I hold a BA in teaching (from Glassboro State, now Rowan U.) My son will be going for a BMus in Music Ed at Westchester U. (PA) Rowan now offers a BMus, but Music Ed majors earned a BA when I was there.
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2002-04-23 15:29
Kim -
It was highly unprofessional for the interviewer to speak to you that way. Teaching is a skill that is learned over a long period, and no one should tell you that you can't do it. Saying you lacked social skills was simply a put-down. Put them behind you and go on with your life.
You learn teaching methods by studying in college courses, but you learn to teach by doing it. Nobody is perfect, or even competent, at the outset.
A big part of teaching is empathy. As my wife says, her job as a private music music teacher was keeping her young students "well hugged and well yelled at," remembering that "I don't yell at people I don't care about."
Showing that you know how to play the clarinet well and muscially is only half the job. The other half is finding the same feelings and skills within the student and helping them grow.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Larry Liberson
Date: 2002-04-23 15:42
Substitute teaching is not always (rarely, perhaps) an example of a good opportunity to get experience teaching or seeing what kind of ability you may (or may not) have in that discipline.
Just remember how your classes treated substitute teachers and just remember what (if anything!) was accomplished. Much too often, an absent teacher is an opportunity for the class to...well...you know. It may not be right but, unfortunately, it is often the status quo -- and it's the sub who is on the receiving end.
I often thought that first-time non-violent criminal offenders should not be given jail time; rather, they should be forced to substitute teach junior high school for 2 to 4 weeks.
That would keep them on the straight-and-narrow...for sure!
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-04-23 22:48
Dear Kim.
I'm finding it a little hard to "read between the lines" on your posting. I'm assuming that the (very rude) interviewer meant that you are perhaps a little to kind or caring and not tough enough to be a teacher. If that's the case then his/her advice is very poor indeed. Never let one wet blanket ruin your day.
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Author: Kim L.
Date: 2002-04-24 00:05
Thanks for all your advice. There are other things other than not possessing social and teaching skills. Other than that, my conducting is shaky, my rhythms need work, and my musicianship is not 100 percent. I think too that they may think that I am too nice and will become friends with the students rather than discipline them. I just do not want to be hard on people. I'd rather be a friend than an enemy.
It was very rude of them because I did not know it was coming. My professors told me that they wished they could have told me this last year. Now, that I have been in school four years it is kind of too late. Where were they when I may have been struggling? I did not volunteer to teach in some of my methods classes and even struggled in the percussion workshop. Conducting was impossibly difficult for me--I still can't conduct through pieces. I am not hearing the ensemble when I am conducting, making arranging even difficult unless I do it on the computer. So I guess in some ways, I think they are right. But, I do not know where to go from here. I want to work with the schools in some way because I want to be there for the children. How can I do that without a BS degree though?
After September 11, I began to lose confidence in my playing when I had a lot of confidence the year before. I left last year being very confident and being one of the top players in the university. Now, I am not even in the wind ensemble and am 4th chair out of six in the symphonic band. We are playing good music, but I am just not very confident. I am also quite jealous of everybody else--it's driving me crazy. This is another thing that could have them looking at me as not being a good teacher. I closed myself off from people after September 11th too. I really want to teach. But if I am this interested what can I tell them to convince them? I can't really because the head of the department said that I am stubborn and almost want to prove them wrong. I don't know what to do with that. I am a good person and all, but still.
Thanks for your help,
Kim L.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-04-25 18:51
Kim,
Your message brought to mind a book I saw over in our placement office several years ago. That got me browsing around Amazon.com. where I found several books you might find of interest. Perhaps you've already explored these but, if not, you might try to find them at your library or through interlibrary loan. If your music department is worth its salt, it should either own one or more of these or should have requested the library to order them:
"Career Opportunities in the Music Industry," 4th Ed by Shelly Field (this seems to be the most popular one and is probably the one I saw at the placement center in an earlier edition.)
"100 Careers in the Music Business" by Tanja L. Crouch
"Creative Careers in Music" by Josquin Des Pres, et al
There are probably others and there may be some useful ideas online. At Amazon, I searched on "Music Business" and "Music Career" without the quotes.
Best regards,
Jack Kissinger
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Author: gemmaelizabeth
Date: 2002-04-30 17:02
I am studying the Clarinet in Scotland, and I am doing a BA. The advantages of THIS course is that you get alot of academic teaching AND alot of performance teaching, so in the end you can do either or, or both!!!!
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