 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Aussie Nick
Date: 2002-04-01 08:06
Why is it that of all the players I know, I have the hardest time with reeds. Sure I am fussy, but so's everyone. I used to play Vandoren (blue box) 4's, Daniels 4's and maybe the odd Grand Concert or something, and then one of the teachers at uni told my teacher that my reeds are too hard and its making the articulation not as crisp as it could be...so over the past few weeks I've been gradually adjusting down to 3.5's . Now when I go back and try to play my old reeds, its close to impossible, but its just so hard to find the right reed because I think I am in the stage where the 4's are too hard, and most of the 3.5's are too soft.
It's really hard to find really nice ones. I've been trying to focus primarily on my technical work but unfortunately I'm the type of person that gets distracted easily, therefore if I'm trying to practice scales or studies, and I'm not happy with the tone the reed is giving me, I'll fuss around for half an hour until I find something nice. I'm also spending a fortune on new reeds all the time. By the way, I play on a Viotto B3 mouthpiece if that helps. My teacher tells me all the time to stop being concerned about my sound because he is mroe than happy with it but thats because when he hears me perform, I always have a really nice performance reed and I also try and play a good reed in the lessons, but he doesn't hear how bad it can sound (to me anyway) the rest of the time.
I hope I am making sense here and I'd appreciate any advice offered.
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Author: Aussie Nick
Date: 2002-04-01 12:48
Sorry, I just read the above again and I can't quite work out what my question is. Umm..when I think of what the question actually is, I'll let you know..
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Author: Jerry McD
Date: 2002-04-01 12:53
Nick,
I am exactly the same way. I am very fussy about my reeds and I always play my best ones for my lessons (and concerts of course). What I struggle with constantly is that during my practice sessions I always seem to gravitate back to my good reeds and I feel I play them too much. I am really trying to play the 'b-team' reeds more as I practice. Also, I work extensively on my reeds and eventually some of the 'b-team' reeds become quite playable. I know this can be REALLY hard because nobody likes to sound bad even when practicing. I had an oboe playing friend years ago who told me the story of complaining about reeds to her teacher and that teacher passed on a piece of eternal wisdom "you have to learn to play the bad ones." Whenever I get completely out of whack about reeds I try and remember this truth, and then give praises that I'm not an oboe player!
Happy reeding,
Jerry McD.
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Author: Bob
Date: 2002-04-01 13:26
I'm gonna try the Doc's reed stuff because I've come to the concludion that there just must be some way to treat all reeds so they are similarly playable....within a given strength grade,that is. I go along with the theory that you have to get the "starch" or whatever it is in the "tubes" out and then replace it with something more stable.
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Author: Mitch A
Date: 2002-04-01 13:47
Fibracell or Legere. There are alternatives to cane reeds.
On tenor and bari sax, I play either synth to practice and perform on. Very often, I play these at concerts depending on the type of music being performed.
I select certain mpcs. to use when I play synths or naturals. I play naturals if the concert is heavy on 'legit' music, as the bari usually plays the bassoon part (I haven't found a synth to mimic the sound of a bassoon - yet). On tenor, it's Fibracell all the way, I haven't spend a nickle on a bad tenor reed in two years. For clar., find a synth you like, then find a mpc to match it (instead of the other way around) for shedding, etc. Save your favored reeds/mpc for performance.
I used to spend $50.00 + per month on reeds. Now that I've gotten synths to work for me, I spend $50.00 per year. Synths last a long, long time and don't change.
I'm still looking for a dark(er) clarinet mpc. to soften the 'brighter' tone of Fibracells. They are a bit bright on my clarinet. Once I dial this in, a box of naturals will last a year saving me frustration and money.
Mitch
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Author: Bob Arney
Date: 2002-04-01 14:24
Mitch, here is a suggestion--WFM (Works for Me). I use (depending on the type music I want to play )Bass Clarinet) either a Peter Spriggs ligature or an Eddie Daniels Rovner. With those six on seven adjustment capabilities I can go "darker" with the Tenor Fibracells or "brighter" with the Spriggs. It's worth a shot!
Bob A
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Author: John
Date: 2002-04-01 14:24
I used to have a reed fussiness problem. Could rarely find a reed that would work well for me. Then I changed mouthpieces. Suddenly most reeds played OK and there were more in a box that were concert-playable.
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Author: graham
Date: 2002-04-01 15:35
It depends how choosy you are between "A team reeds" and "B team reeds", but in my view you should never practice on B reeds. Practice on the ones you would also use for a concert, otherwise the practice is not realistic. But, if you are only finding one A reed in 10 reeds (on average) then you have a more fundamental problem that should be addressed by looking at mouthpiece and/or reed brand/strength.
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Author: William
Date: 2002-04-01 16:19
William Stubbins--legendary clarinet teacher (University of Michigan, I believe)--used to say, "Play the reed!!! Don't let the reed play you." The point is, you should not rely soley on your reed for tone production and control, but more on your embouchure and breath support. It should be possible to achieve an acceptable tone quality and play musically on reeds of varying consistancies if you are truely "in shape" regarding the stamina it takes to control your mpc/reed setup. Also, a good mouthjpiece helps. for this, I recommend Gregory Smiths "Cicero" model. When it comes to reeds, we clarinetists need all the playing experiance and equipement help we can get. We certainly do not get much help from that guy at VanDoren who puts only one good reed in every box. (Peronally, I think he moonlights with the other reed companies as well) Good luck and Good Clarineting!!!!!
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Author: Jeff
Date: 2002-04-01 16:36
I too have frequent reed troubles. Whenever I need a good reed for a rehearsal or lesson, I can't find one, but when I'm just playing at leisure, the really good reeds seem to magically appear or the seemingly bad ones work great. I recently switched back to blue box Vandoren 3 1/2's from the V12 4's. The V12's would always play perfectly, but then after one or two times, they would become thin and sound horrible. I had had enough with that. However, these clarinet reed troubles are nothing in comparison to my oboe and english horn reed problems. I don't make my own reeds yet, and thus finding a good english horn reed is like finding a diamond in the rough.
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Author: Jeff
Date: 2002-04-01 17:42
Actually, I take that back about the V12's. I just spoke with Greg Smith and apparently I need to seal these reeds before playing, or else, because of the low density the fibers are waterlogged and get screwed up. So I guess it was my fault, not the reeds'.
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Author: Aussie Nick
Date: 2002-04-01 21:55
When the right reed is found, my mouthpiece is a gem. The nicest I've ever used, and trust me I'm fussy about mouthpieces too I used to use a Pomarico wooden mouthpiece up until august last year where I changed because I found the weather was affecting both my reeds and mouthpiece. I chose my Viotto out of about 10 of them, it was the sweetest, smoothest and darkest of the lot of them. My teacher also changed to one from his old Bay.
Jeff, I'd also like to know about sealing the reeds.
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Author: lala
Date: 2002-04-02 00:14
I don't know if what I do is "sealing" but whenever I open a new box of reeds, I rub the back of each one - along the grain towards the tip - on typing paper. The paper must be placed on smooth, flat surface. Firmly and evenly press the reed with 3 fingers but leave the tip alone. Rub it till the back is shinning. I find that I can increase the number of playable reeds from 1 to 5 out of 10 by doing so. Of course they still need to be soaked, dried, aged, adjusted, run-in, etc, but it's a good beginning.
Just my 2 cents. Good luck.
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Author: Jeff
Date: 2002-04-02 01:54
Gregory Smith said to use natural body oil, ie. from the bridge of your nose and under your eyelids. Just wipe a finger there, and then rub it into your reed. Sounds kinda gross, but hey, look where he has gotten himself sealing reeds that way, the Chicago Symphony. It's supposed to prolong the life of the reed significantly. I had told him I stopped using V12s because of their short life, and he asked if I was 'sealing' them. I said no, being that I didn't know what sealing was. And the above is what he told me. Hopefully, it'll work. Mr. Smith, if you read this, please add anything or correct me if I've got it wrong.
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Author: Carmen izzo
Date: 2002-04-02 03:13
All i can say about reed usage is that play them. No matter what their condition, we must learn to accept the fact that they suck. As you play more and more often you develop your embouchure and endurance and your playing becomes less dependent on reed suckiness. Withing the last six days i have been getting in about over three and a half hours each day and i have been playing on such bad reeds. But Learning to play theses reeds makes my tolerance for them grow. And by that i mean the increasing ability to control and manipulate one's sound. I hate reeds as much as you guys do, but i try to not let it get to me
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Author: Robin
Date: 2002-04-02 03:14
I don't exactly know what your mouthpiece does, but going by reed strength, it sounds similar in facing to my M13 Lyre- quite a close facing. I had a lot of difficulty changing from the more open set up, but it's all settled down now and I feel I can get a pretty consistent flow of reeds.
The two things that did it for me were: making sure the reeds were wet enough. Sounds obvious, but I think I under-estimated the Australian sun. The other was really flattening the back of the reed. I thought I was doing it properly, but after David Thomas flattened one of my reeds (that I thought had died), I realised that I hardly used to take any wood off. Now I try to use really fresh sand paper and glass underneath. As I don't sand the tip, the reeds don't often go too soft.
I think flattening the reed is even more important for close, long mouthpiece facings where more of the reed is vibrating. It's certainly made my life easier. If I find any problem in a reed's response, it can usually be solved in this way. In the past, however, I might have mis-diagnosed it as a problem of reed strength.
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Author: lala
Date: 2002-04-04 00:40
As a side issue, my personal opinion is that one should not tolerate bad reeds. Why distract oneself unnecessarily if the problem can be overcome with a bit of work? At first I found the process of breaking-in a real chore, but now I almost enjoy doing it. Sometimes when I am not in the mood to play anything, I simply do a few minutes of breaking-in or adjusting. Kind of relaxing.
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Author: David Dow symphony NB
Date: 2002-04-24 14:52
I find that sometimes embouchure probems are my students indirect cause of reed frustration. Long tones at low volume are wonderful way of deciding if the reed is good or bad. A hard reed I lighten up with an Exacto knife(see Opperman book on Reeds) and then a softer one I tend to dlip with a cordier trimmer(most valuable for anyone). I also don't overplay new reeds and only use 31/2 Vandoren V12, and play in long concerts and have no trouble. Practicing in an overtly reverberant room can cause problems, so listen closely and support the tone alot. Keep the reeds wet with normal water and do not rub the surfaces of the reed....dirt from the fingers deadens a reed. Also rotate 5 reeds at a time and i find that they play better and last longer. so a reed for brahms one for Berio and another for Star wars...etc.
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