 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: jez
Date: 2002-02-25 18:58
What's going on? Only one new posting in the last couple of days! Where is everybody? Are you all on holiday over there? Let's get some discussion going.
Does anyone agree that, since the clarinet is such a popular instrument, lots of us start off on it as kids. The ones who are really good obviously go on to become great clarinettists. The ones who are kind of OK get persuaded to have a go on some other instrument (Bassoon, oboe, saxophone) after playing for a year or so.
Therefore the only truly great musicians are the ones who are still playing the clarinet. Also the ones who no-one bothered to try to change are still playing clar. badly.
We are a mixture of really good and really bad players, with nothing in-between.
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Author: David Spiegelthal
Date: 2002-02-25 19:18
Jez,
Your theory has more holes in it than the Albert Hall. I'm an example of a contradiction to your presumption --- I am mediocre, a very in-between player I'm sure.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2002-02-25 20:00
jez...First off, I'd like to think of myself in the first group you cited, rather than the second.
Regardless of that, when one plays clarinet, no matter what the ability, or proficiency level, we are still doing something that 99% of the world cannot do (and wishes they could!)
The rumor of the death of the clarinet is greatly exaggerated...GBK
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Author: Brian
Date: 2002-02-25 20:37
Well I fall in the "in-between" category. I began playing the clarinet in the 5th grade at the tender age of 11 and now I am 34 and still playing.
I would not consider myself a professional by any means nor do I consider myself a "bad" player either. During my school playing ,especially high school, I was always first chair in concert band,district honor band and even first chair my junior and senior years in the state honor band. I have numerous medals and trophies from various solo and ensemble festivals.
I attended four years of college and played in band all four years,becoming first chair my sophomore year and continued as such until I graduated. I continued to play after college with local community bands and orchestras and still play in my local community band.
I know this may sound like a brag-fest but it is to prove a point. Not all clarinet players who do not turn professional are bad players. There are some of us who are "in-between" and enjoy the heck out of it. Sometimes I wish I had chosen music and performing as my vocation. I love music and the clarinet and I will never stop playing until I just can't anymore. I have become a quite good player over the years and the best part is I have enjoyed it more than anything else I have done in my life.
Thank you all for bearing with me while I pour out my soul on-line!
I can feel the love...!!!
Brian
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-02-25 22:23
I'm the jack-of-all-tradesman myself. That doesn't mean I''m awful at the clarinet. I fall in the middle at perhaps every instrument I play besides low brass. The clarinet just happens to be next on my food chain!! Hee hee. It's SO close to winning!
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Author: RonD
Date: 2002-02-25 22:24
If we would stop asking new posters to search previous post perhaps new posters would feel more welcome and ask for help instead of looking endlessly thru the previous postings. As good as the search engine is, you cant find a topic unless the previous poster has properly identified it.
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Author: DennisP
Date: 2002-02-25 23:27
99% can't play the clarinet. I'll keep that in mind when I'm fingering throught Baermann #10. "99% can't do this, 99% can't do this" Thanks!
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-02-26 00:19
RonD wrote:
If we would stop asking new posters to search previous post perhaps new posters would feel more welcome and ask for help
Wow! I've given this some thought - and yes, the only reason I've ever told anyone to go and do a search is because I wanted to be seen as having "been, there - and done' that". I agree RonD - just remember - every new person to this BB is an aspiring clarinetist and needs as much nurturing as possible. Shame on the "old BBers" for being so quick to be dismissive with their help!
*gets off soap box*
p.s. - I promise to be more helpful in future
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-02-26 01:06
If we didn't ask people to look at the old postings when relevant information is there ...
If people didn't ever have to look for any thing ...
If everything was always just handed to everyone ...
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-02-26 01:22
Mark, diz:
Call me young and indecisive, but I sort of see both sides of the issue. I straddle this fence as much as I straddle the fence between being a good and bad player.
If we gave told everyone to "look it up" constantly, then this bulletin board's traffic would sufficiently dwindle. Everyone would nickname this forum the "Clarinet Dictionary"
(Okay, maybe not that bad, but...)
Then again, Like Mark implies with his posting, we can't just give everyone all the information all the time. It's not teaching them anything! "Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day; Teach a man to fish, he'll eat for a lifetime."
My personal adaptation from that philosophy is to give the inquirers a taste of the fish they're trying to catch. I try and give the gist and then show them what to do and where to go to see more.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-02-26 02:20
David,
an awful lot of people haven't even explored the obvious parts of this site yet ...
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Author: Marge
Date: 2002-02-26 02:53
Although it would mean (more) work for Mark, a site index/map page for sneezy.org would be a wonderful addition for this already excellent site. (Re the bulletin board part of it, I do not mean including anything besides the starting page for it. Once one gets there, it's very apparent how to try to find something in old postings.) But all sorts of goodies are sort of buried here and there in non-BB places, and I'm not even sure I've found them all yet. If at least their titles were more readily visible in a comprehensive page, under the category in which they reside, newcomers (especially) could scan and then educate themselves more easily, without asking questions on the BB that are already answered elsewhere (on non-BB pages).
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-02-26 02:58
I had a site map at one time - it was receiving about 200-300 hit/year so it was dropped.
There's a Search Sneezy selection that does a much better job than a site map.
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2002-02-26 04:41
'Modesty is the worst form of conceit."(Who said this?)
I am a good(I do not say fabulous) clarinetist as far as my tone is concerned. (It is boring to be able to play anything easily in a short time. He-he-he.)
Violinist Kleisler was 'fabulous' violinist but he was a doctor and an amateur before he became a professional at his 40's or 50's of age. Take Schweizer, he was a fabulous organist but was an amateur all his life. Mathematics logic says if there are any exceptions, a lemma should be dismissed. QED
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-02-26 04:48
Hiroshi, you erudite postings certainly make up for any conceit!
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Author: RonD
Date: 2002-02-26 05:14
Mark, I have a Dictionary on my desk next to the computer " the american heritage dictionary second college edition published by Dell publishing co. of new york". lemma is not in my dictionary.
I did not think I had to search dictionary publishers to get a definition. I thought that some one ( Herioshi) would be kind enough to explain it to me. I am over 60 years old but I have never heard that word before.
Ps they do list lemmings.
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Author: RonD
Date: 2002-02-26 05:25
I just looked up the WORD and i still dont have any idea of what it means, however I am not a mathematician. And now I dont even care.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-02-26 05:56
RonD wrote:
> I did not think I had to search dictionary publishers to get a
> definition. I thought that some one ( Herioshi) would be kind
> enough to explain it to me. I am over 60 years old but I have
> never heard that word before.
I'm pushing 50 and I'm still looking up words daily ... my suggestion was meant to help, not to insult. I use the m-w site all the time to look up words.
Meaning #1 is the proper one in this case - using an auxiliary proposition to demonstrate another proposition.
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2002-02-26 07:16
Mark - When a person enter this site for the first time I don't think the only reason is to get an answer to a question, whatever the question is. First, I think it's a wish to participate, to find a door into the discussions. To do that they ask a simple question that has been discussed many times already and are asked to go to the "search sneezy" to get the answer. Like this they might feel excluded from the page feeling that they don't have anything important to contribute with so they just stay as observers or never come back again.
I understand it's boring for you having to read all the postings and all that, but try to understand them too. Why not agree to that the next time we see a FAQ we give a short answer and inform the person in a friendly manner that there is a "search sneezy" for more information on the topic and wish her/him welcome back.
(Personnaly I'm sick of "Rovner vs. Optimum").
Alphie
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Author: donald nicholls
Date: 2002-02-26 09:17
sometimes i admit that late at night i'll check out the sneezy board and get a bit annoyed at some of the stupid questions that are written- and sometimes people ask stuff that they surely could work out for themselves (advice i have given once with good humour, but mostly kept to myself).... i have spent all my life since i was 10 years old trying to find out as much as i can about the Clarinet, and i'm still at it (yep, i don't know EVERYTHING yet!) but lots of the things i know were the product of my own initative, discovery or logic. (i've also been very lucky to have access to a zillion books, every single back issue of "the Clarinet" and a couple of GREAT teachers!).
... but then, sometimes we have to remember that people may be in places where they have no resources (ie- no library with "The Clarinet" going back forever, no people to ask advice from etc)..... and more importantly- no ROLE MODELS (music wise) or at least not very good ones...
so i try to be patient and not let my late night grumps come out....
AND i use the BACK button quite a lot
(ROVNER BETTER THAN OPTIMUM? = "run away, run away!")
at the start i seemed to want to show everyone how much i knew
now i just want to help people, and learn stuff,
much healthier methinks!
nzdonald
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-02-26 14:36
donald nicholls wrote:
>
>
> AND i use the BACK button quite a lot
> (ROVNER BETTER THAN OPTIMUM? = "run away, run away!")
Yeah - you just <b>know</b> that there's a killer rabbit in there and the holy hand grenade's not in sight ...
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Author: David Spiegelthal
Date: 2002-02-26 14:42
Mark and Donald,
You're showing OUR age! I'll bet there's a whole generation of clarinet players reading this BB that haven't even seen (or maybe even heard of??) Monty Python and the Holy Grail........ Pretty sad, the lack of cultural education afforded today's youth, isn't it? I mean, who can imagine growing up without the sophistication obtained from watching Monty Python, Animal House, Stripes, etc....
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Author: Bob Arney
Date: 2002-02-26 15:25
OK, Dave. I'll bite. Just who (or what) is Monty Python and the Holy Grail? Admittedly I have never seen Animal House (except as a direction at Whipsnade Zoo) and I have heard of "Stripes". Guess I just "aint growed up yet."
Bob A
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-02-26 15:56
What's that? Graily Mont and the Holy Python? Huh?
And now, for something completely different...
Perhaps hard to believe -- or even imagine -- WE, collectively, are the ones who have triumphed over mediocrity. We strive, we learn, we play, and mostly we improve. We may not all be Principal Clarinetists for some symphony orchestra, or opera company, or big-time show band, but so what. Not all of us need to be. Maybe we're the ones sitting next to those Principals, giving them the support without which they'd be really lacking. Maybe we're playing for dances, with ordinary people out there on the floor applauding when they like something we did. Maybe we're players in a school band or orchestra that gives well-attended concerts. Maybe we simply sit around the house, playing and enjoying ourselves. But we aren't angry with the Clarinet, we didn't give it up forever, and we wouldn't want to be without it. Great clarinetists? Sure we are. We just aren't all great at the same level. We ourselves enjoy our playing, and sometimes others do, too. That's great.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-02-26 18:08
David - my kids have watched the Holy Grail, The Life of Brian, and more with me ... they know exactly what I mean when I shout "Ni! Ni!" or ask them to bring me a shrubbery ... or looking at the fish tank with a long face and saying "it's an ex-parrot ..."
Mark C., singing the Spam song and wearing a drool bucket ...
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Author: donald nicholls
Date: 2002-02-26 18:28
Mark, you actually ask your kids to bring you a shrubbery? wow, that's what i call a "cool dad" (even if Monty Python is apparently old fasioned nowadays)
JMcAulay, what a great posting, nice to have met you!
nzdonald
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Author: Sandra F. H.
Date: 2002-02-27 00:33
So, you have created a "di-lemma" with the "lemma" thing..it's in my dictionary, the old, good ones, the real Webster's. Sadly, it's all copyrighted or I'd post it. Oh, well, sour grapes...or lemons. FYI, the real definition of "professional" is one who makes 50% or more of one's income from the instrument. So, sometimes I'm professional, and sometimes I'm not! :-) It's all perspective, isn't it?!
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-02-27 03:22
Monty Python, old fashioned? Huh? I'm in high school still, and I think that's one of the funniest comedy "groups" out there. Several of my friends agree with me.
Some things never die.
Some redundant posts are an example.
I will admit that I wish some people weren't so stupid as to bring up the "Rovner" issue. I just can't do much about it but say "look it up" and give them the slightest incentive to do so.
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Author: jez
Date: 2002-02-27 12:37
Wow!
I love the way we veer off the original topic of discussion sometimes. This one has covered Monty Python, Dictionaries, Sneezy, old postings, ligatures........
At least we haven't got any astrology yet.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2002-02-27 12:44
"...At least we haven't got any astrology yet..."
Read the thread 2 topics higher, if you really want it...GBK
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