 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Kathleen
Date: 2002-02-15 20:55
I am starting the search for a teacher for my 11-year-old son, who would like to learn to play the clarinet. He has been playing the piano for a few years, so he knows how to read music, etc. He seems to have some natural musical ability and is a really nice boy so I want to find the right person for him! I have been in touch with all of the local college music departments but have not come up with any good leads yet.
We live in Orange County, California. Thanks!
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Author: Kim L.
Date: 2002-02-15 21:23
I would not have a beginner study with a college teacher. College music teachers are very demanding and would be very harsh on your son. However, I would recommend you find a local music studio teacher for your son. These teachers are very personable and are a good starting point.
Kim L.
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Author: charles
Date: 2002-02-15 21:27
Kathleen, I know one superb person who is my son's teacher. But he lives in Long Beach. You might need to call Sam Ash in celitos.
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Author: Pam
Date: 2002-02-15 21:51
You might also try checking with local music stores to see if they might give you a lead on private teachers in your area or another thought - check with school music teachers to see if they can recommend anyone.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-02-15 22:26
Kim L. wrote:
"College music teachers are very demanding and would be very harsh on your son."
And just exactly how many of these nasty harsh people have you encountered to form the basis for this picture you paint of all college music teachers? It is true that many college teachers don't take on beginners because they prefer to work with more advanced students. To infer, however, that undergoing the extra education and training that one needs to be qualified to teach college somehow makes a person unqualified to teach young children is ludicrous.
In any case, contacting the music departments at local colleges and universities for leads is a good idea because the faculty often are well in touch with the local music community and may know who, among local teachers, have sent them the best students. Also, if the university has a graduate program, they may have a good graduate student who hasn't been through the school's final "harshification treatment" yet. There might be hope for them.
In addition to the sources others have mentioned, Kathleen, you might check to see if there is a local music conservatory. (There probably is.) They may have some excellent teachers or may know of some in the community.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: allencole
Date: 2002-02-16 11:59
While Kim's advice might seem like a blanket condemnation of college instructors, there is some basis in truth. Rarely do we look to colleges for a child's beginning instruction in ANY subject. It is also telling that Kathleen has already contacted college music departments but has come up with no solid leads.
While 'harsh' might be a poor choice of words, Kim correctly points out that music stores and private studios are often more beginner-friendly and, I might add, beginner-experienced. Patience and persistence are the two greatest factors in beginning instruction, and economic necessity has a way of developing these.
An interesting anecdote on Sam Ash, who was a working violinist in New York City prior to founding his music store empire. Clarinetist David Tarras related advice that he received from Sam Ash to take up teaching. It went something like this. "I take a kid and give him a lesson every week. After a year, his parents say 'Maybe you're not such a good teacher' and I say 'maybe your boy isn't so talented.' They go to another teacher and I get another student to replace him."
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Author: Brandon
Date: 2002-02-16 17:18
I hate to be ignorant, but if Orange Co. is LA, I would highly reccomend Yehuda Gilad at USC. I know that he has taught HS students in the past and many of them get into the prestigious Curtis Institute. If Orange Co. is not LA, sorry. I live on the other side of the country!
Brandon
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Author: Kim L.
Date: 2002-02-17 04:18
What I meant to say was, college music professors are not beginner oriented. However, I still say that they can be a bit hard on us students! (It's college)
Kim L.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-02-17 20:40
Kim, you are still making a very broad generalization based, if history is any indication, on very limited observation/evidence. You give no reasons for me to agree with you. All I see is an unsubstantiated opinion "I believe it, therefore it must be so." (actually, it seems more like prejudice to me). You haven't developed the credentials yet for me to accept you on face value as an expert. As a result, you do not convince me. The issue of whether college music professors, as a group are good/poor teachers for beginners is an empirically testable fact, not a question of opinion. Because Kim says/believes it, doesn't make it so. Because I say/believe otherwise doesn't make it otherwise, either. Still, it's fun to argue the point and maybe we can both learn something.
I would hope that college music professors are not beginner oriented when they are teaching advanced students. Note, however, that many college professors (particularly guitar and piano but also most other instruments when they are teaching in a music education program) teach beginners, even when they are teaching at the college level. We have a faculty member at Saint Louis University (SLU) who teaches guitar. Our music program is extremely small, almost an afterthought. (The athletic department runs the largest musical organization on campus, the pep band, and gives more in music scholarships than the music department.) As a result, this faculty member, who happens to be a phenomenal musician, rarely has an advanced student. Still, he is highly revered among students who decide to take up guitar as a pastime. They literally flock to his studio. Can I conclude from his example that all college music professors are superb teachers for beginners? Of course not. He is only one example. But he refutes your statement that (all -- remember, you didn't say some or even most) college music professors are not (cannot be) beginner oriented.
I don't know the basis for your opinion. That's why I asked before. I have a gnawing suspicion that it reflects your attitude toward teachers you have encountered during your college career. Perhaps your assessment of their abilities is accurate but perhaps it is not. You haven't provided me with enough information to decide. (Do any of them have (young) beginning students? If so, have you actually observed them teaching beginners? Do they teach beginners the same way they teach you? From other posts you have made, I think you are a music ed major, or a non-music major rather than a clarinet performance major. Please correct me if I am wrong. In any case, have any of your professors tried to teach you how to work with children? If you have developed a good skill set for teaching children, where did it come from?)
Certainly, teaching (coaching?) advanced students who have already developed sound fundamentals requires a different approach than teaching absolute beginners. It seems to me, however, that anyone who has the technical skills to teach advanced students will also have the technical skills to teach young beginners. Both require a thorough understanding of basics such as proper hand position, embouchure, breath support, fingering, etc. You don't really appear to argue with this point. Rather, you suggest that the issue is "orientation" rather than technical (playing) ability. As I read your premise, it is that "college faculty are not beginner oriented therefore they are too demanding to teach beginners." But if someone is smart enough to achieve an advanced degree, doesn't it make sense that, in at least some, if not most, cases, that person will also be smart enough to recognize that a beginning child has different needs and abilities than an advanced student? In other words, even if college faculty are not beginner oriented when dealing with advanced students, does it follow that they cannot change their orientation when dealing with beginners? And, if not, why not?
If a teacher is demanding when dealing with college students, who are, after all earning college credit for their work, is this because the teacher has high expectations for everyone or because s/he tailors expectations to the student's level. Do you know of any professors who would assign a child Sutermeister for his/her third lesson? I have taken lessons from the clarinet faculty member at SLU and I have observed her giving lessons to a child just starting to play. Her approach is quite different in the two situations. Will you have the same expectations for a high school senior who's been studying with you for seven years that you do for a 5th grader taking his/her first lesson? Shouldn't you give college professors at least some credit for the intelligence and ability to adapt to circumstances? (I know, I know, sometimes it's difficult. ;^) especially when they disagree with you. )
Based on my observations of college teachers in general (for too many years), I conclude that, in any field, faculty range from outstanding to incompetent. If that's true of music as well, some college music professors, even those who are good at the college level, undoubtedly make lousy teachers for beginners. So will some of the folks who teach in music stores. But isn't it an individual issue based on personal abilities rather than primary occupation? Some college faculty may not enjoy teaching beginners or have the time to take on beginners, or may not believe that they have enough to offer beginners to justify hourly fees that are much higher than those charged by teachers at a local music store. Conclusion: Not all college professors are likely to be suitable teachers for young beginners. Even if some college professors are unsuitable teachers for small beginners, however, it does not follow that all (or even most) college professors are (or have to be) unsuitable teachers for young beginners. I have seen too many counterexamples. Based on those counterexamples, I simply can't buy, without more persuasive argument or evidence than you've provided so far, that college professors are not (or, at least cannot be) beginner oriented when the situation calls for it.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Kim L.
Date: 2002-02-18 03:33
My opinion is 100% biased and I did not think it through. My professors have taught beginners in the music departments summer music camp. The camp is extremely successful. I think I will be more careful in what I say next time.
Kim L.
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Author: Julia
Date: 2002-04-07 16:21
Wow--you go Kim--right on with the attitude.
Anyway---I was just going to say that I've always taken lessons from college professors since I was 6 yrs old (that was piano)!
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