 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Melissa
Date: 2002-02-12 20:57
I recently bought a Buffet R-13 and am unsure what mouthpiece would be best for me. Any suggestions would be helpful. Thanks
-Melissa
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-02-12 23:53
Melissa, the mouthpiece which is best for you is the one you play best. Sounds stupid, maybe, but that is the definitive answer. Having your instrument in hand and warmed up, get yourself as many mouthpieces as you can, preferably twenty or more, and try them one by one. Once you have settled on the one you prefer, try a few of that specific type. That way, you'll get the very one that works best for you. In doing this, some players may even select more than one, especially for the playing of different music genres. It is common, for example, for players to use different MPs for Classical and Jazz. And do have a knowledgeable listener with you when this happens, if it is at all possible. A trusted teacher or a respected, cooperative professional player, for example. And remember that even though you may have played always the same strength reed, different MPs may work best with reeds of different strengths. This exercise is a time-consuming drag, but it is one of the most important things you can do to play your best.
This is not advice, only a suggestion. Others may recommend that you just buy a Whizzbang Model ZX12 or some such and be done with it. Good luck.
Regards,
John
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Author: GBK
Date: 2002-02-13 00:02
"...This is not advice, only a suggestion. Others may recommend that you just buy a Whizzbang Model ZX12 or some such and be done with it...."
John McAulay - I am so becoming a big fan of your logic and wit. You have so ably filled the void left by Peter's brief absence. Keep up the great postings! ...GBK
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Author: Brian
Date: 2002-02-13 01:20
OK people help me out here. I always read replies about mouthpieces which suggest trying several before deciding on which to use. Do any of you have local music companies that allow you to do this? I checked all the music co's in my area and they all but laughed at me. Surely you don't buy them then try them then return them! Man I feel so stoopid!!!
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-02-13 02:05
Brian,
Many music stores have never heard of this practice (many music stores don't have musicians involved in running them, either!).
<b>Good</b> music stores will let you try them out first; if you can't find a music store nearby to let you try them out then I suggest you either get together with one of the Sneezy sponsors or use a mail order outlet if possible.
BTW - not so long ago I would never have even dreamed about asking - I thought all mouthpieces of the same brand and model were generally the same. I think that a lot of us are starting to educate the music stores! Ain't communication on a grand scale wonderful!
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Author: donald nicholls
Date: 2002-02-13 03:26
um, i'm probably going to get in trouble for saying this but........
most of my "non-advanced" students wouldn't have a clue which mouthpiece to use if you gave them a choice. Often they can't actually tell which one they sound better on- i imagine this is for one of two reasons 1) their concept of tone is different from mine (for example they often like a very fuzzy sound and don't seem to value "ring" in their sound) 2) they don't have a very developed "ear", they're not very good at judging their sound as far as i can tell.
To be quite honest, i find that if i pick a mouthpiece for them and MAKE them use it, they invariably sound better after a week. If i re-face a Zinner to my personal facing- something along the lines of 36ish, 22ish, 12, 6 and a tip opening in the 1.10 range, they will invariably sound pretty darn good, often almost straight away.
Fundamentally i agree in the "democratic philosophy of mouthpiece selection" (see above), but in practicality me providing guidance in this department seems to work pretty well. "Guidance" often seems to mean.... um, well, telling them what to do, frankly!
Am i evil? is this really really bad? am i poisoning the minds of the clarinet players of tomorrow? oh man, i hope not- i want all my students to grow up and SOUND GREAT and i'll do whatever i can to help them. Sometimes this mean saying "kid, the Rico graftonite has gotta go!, trust me- this will sound better". After all they are paying me because i know more than them about the clarinet.
please remember i'm talking about younger or less advanced students here..... however for my masters degree my teacher kindly and tactfully encouraged me to change mouthpiece, and while he didn't push one brand over another, he did encourage me to use a certain range of facing other than what i had used previously. This was FAR more useful than my previous teacher, who didn't care 2 hoots and offered no advice. I wasn't initially to thrilled, but made the change, and after an adjustment period found definate improvement that i could attribute to the mouthpiece. hmmmmmm.
nzdonald
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Author: GBK
Date: 2002-02-13 03:34
"...however for my masters degree my teacher kindly and tactfully encouraged me to change mouthpiece..."
Donald...Was that Dr. E? ...GBK
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Author: donald nicholls
Date: 2002-02-13 08:27
well, yes actually- i have to say that i arrived in the US with two mouthpieces that were well known and popular US brands, both of which i was discouraged from using. But really, this was done over a long period of time in the most tactful way- and the end result was very rewarding. Years later i still have those two mouthpieces, and when my colleagues try them out i like what i hear- but for one reason or another, despite refacing etc, neither of them suits me particuarly to this day, so i assume his judgement was pretty good!
I guess the "real offenders" in this department are teachers who MAKE all their students go out on day one and buy a certain product/brand. Dr Etheridge certainly didn't do that at all, and to my knowledge his students play a wide variety of mouthpieces.
hey, it's late at night here and i need sleep
keep playing the good tunes y'all
donald
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Author: Ed
Date: 2002-02-13 16:28
One thing that I find to work well for me when trying a number of mouthpieces is to find ways to narrow them down. Someone above mentioned trying 20. If you were to do this, you could go nuts trying to figure out "Let's see, how did #12 play?" once you reach the end.
Play them, immediately getting rid of any that immediately don't fit your needs. Then try to work in small groups or pairs, narrowing them as a sports tournament might work. For example, play #1 and #2. #1 is better. Play #1 against #3. etc. Put those aside that you might be unsure of and come back to them. (those are the wild card pics!) I also find that it helps to do it over a few sessions, as you can often develop ear fatigue.
This has often helped me keep from getting locked in a rubber room with a bunch of mouthpieces. Besides, it is hard to play while in a straight jacket!
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Author: James
Date: 2002-02-13 17:49
gees...... all this this over extra stuff you didn't even ask for. If you have a private teacher, i would be best to ask that person. If you don't here is what I recommend. I play on Richard Hawkins II, its a great mouthpiece and it does what i wwant it to do. It is a $150 though. He also makes a good mouthpiece too that is $100. There are quite expensive mouthpieces. You should also try the New Vandoren M15 mouthpiece. They are sopposed to be amazing. I know people that have switched from their own custom mouthpieces to play on these. Most people at eastman school of music use them and the greatest thing is cost between 60-70 dollars. Don't let all this other stuff confuse you. Try them, especially the Vandoren.
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-02-13 19:14
Let me try again. It is impractical to write both well and briefly of a complex subject, so here's a lot more verbage. Perhaps it will help. As you read this, remember that I am not an authority, just someone who has gone through the process and expects to do it again after buying my next new instrument.
Melissa, I have never heard you play. I do not know your tonal abilities, I don't know what kind(s) of music you like to play, I don't know what shortcomings (if any) you might be trying to overcome. What I do know is that without a whole lot more knowledge, I could not realistically make any suggestion of a specific mouthpiece for you. Just maybe, the Whizzbang ZX12 could be the greatest thing you could possibly play on. On the other hand, perhaps your technique, embouchure, and style of play are such that a Vito V2 would be better -- a lot cheaper, too. Stein devotes more than an entire quarto page to the importance of mouthpiece selection and how to do it, but not once does he mention any make or model. His suggestions on how to check out a mouthpiece are, perhaps, the most compact and useful ever set on paper. It's probably a very good idea to read his words before embarking on the selection process. If you do not have a copy, maybe you could consider its $12.95 cost as a sort of "tax" on the mouthpiece.
If you have a teacher you can trust, by all means ask for a recommendation. If you have a teacher you can't trust, why? First get a different teacher, *then* ask for a recommendation. Recommendation from someone who knows how you play can be very important, because you might improve considerably by being "led" in the right direction. If you don't have a teacher, you're stuck with the drag of sorting out wheat from chaff with a table full of mouthpieces in front of you. And this is not an exercise that should be tried by any inexperienced player. Such a person wouldn't be able to tell the differences well enough and sort them out properly to make a useful intelligent selection.
If you ask to try a mouthpiece before buying it and the store people laugh at you, just shake your head disgustedly, wave a wad of money in their faces, and walk out. Such a place is rather like an automobile dealer that will not allow you to test drive a car. I would not wish to buy anything from such a store. As Mark says, some really will let you test mouthpieces, and if you can't find a store that will do it in your area, some mail-order places will oblige, under special conditions. Such as if you don't return something within a certain time, or if you damage anything, you bought 'em. Sanitizing the mouthpieces is not a significant problem, and the use of a thin cushion on the top of the beak will prevent marring the item while testing it.
Obviously, it's best to start out with *some* ideas of the type of mouthpiece you might like. For example, if you enjoy playing on a Vandoren B45, there is little need to try mouthpieces that are vastly different in configuration. Try those with similar general design parameters. You can get some ideas from The Woodwind and Brasswind catalog's reasonably good comparison chart of mouthpieces. There's no need for you to try every known mouthpiece.
Regards,
John
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Author: Fred
Date: 2002-02-13 21:29
Just one thought about "expensive" mouthpieces: In the search for a great mouthpiece, buying three $70 mouthpieces a year apart is more expensive than buying one $200 mouthpiece and sticking with it. Many people still pay $100 for a stock Vandoren at the local store; makes a Greg Smith for $175-200 seem quite reasonable, doesn't it?
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-02-13 23:36
Fred, you are right. As with many other things in life, the cost of a mouthpiece is not nearly as important as its value.
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Author: Todd W.
Date: 2002-02-14 01:09
Melissa --
Lots of good advice here on what is (as JMcA points out) a very complex subject.
A couple of small additions:
When you try out mouthpieces, if you are using a metal ligature you may want to put tape or a thin mouthpiece patch on the mouthpiece where the ligature touches it (the "audience" side of the mouthpiece) so that you don't mar the mouthpiece.
I believe the book Mr. McAulay is refering to is "The Art of Clarinet Playing" by Keith Stein. Before you buy it, you could check with your local library. If it's not in your branch, they may be able to get it for you from another one in their system.
Todd W
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2002-02-14 01:24
1)Stay away from the Buffet mouthpiece with which your R13 came. It is a junk.
2)Stay away from Selmer mouthpieces. They are good but for smaller bore clarinets than R13(0.574" bore). But if your R13 is R-13 Vintage, its bore is smaller than ordinary R-13s. Then Selmer mouthpieces may work. I personally think its quality is better than Vandorens.
3)I always find nowadays ordinary Vandoren mouthpiece tables are not flat as far as at least one dozen mouthpieces I bought. I personally think trying them without flattening them is meaningless.
4)I guess you use Vandoren 2-1/2 or 3 equivalents. If my guess is right, I recommend Vandoren B40. It is for softer reeds players. But you need someone to micro-finish its table. I do it myself using a Hard Arkansus oil stone.
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-02-14 02:22
Todd: Good words. And yes, that is the book I had in mind. This book plus David Pino's *The Clarinet and Clarinet Playing* will cost around $20 combined, and I would suggest they should be in the library of any school with a band or orchestra. So Clarinet-playing students, make a good suggestion to your Band Directors and Librarians.
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