 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Gary Shiozaki
Date: 2002-01-23 16:03
Are there any updates on what is going on with Boosey Hawkes, and the future of Buffet? My son's friend is in the market for a set of clarinets, but the problems with Buffet recently has him concerned. Thanks.
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Author: HAT
Date: 2002-01-23 18:20
What 'problems' are you talking about?
David Hattner, NYC
www.northbranchrecords.com
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2002-01-23 18:26
If your friend's son is looking for a set of clarinets I wouldn't hesitate to purchase some that are out there in the marketplace right now through reputable dealers. The dealer will back up the instrument and can do any repair work you might need (if they have a repair facility and most do). I have used International Musical Suppliers for new Buffet clarinets and they have always backed up their stuff without a hitch.
What you need to watch for is clarinets produced after a sale or take over. The new owner/manager firm might change the way things operate. But no one knows that for certain right now and we can only assume they'll try to keep their high standards of production--especially in their Buffet clarinet line.
Whatever you purchase right now was produced a few months ago and has gone through the rigorous inspection processes at their factory. Their products have been outstandingly good these past couple of years--probably the best they've been in many years. I say this as a clarinetist who has play-tested and bought and sold dozens of Buffets this last year. I watch their quality very closely and shy away from any brands that slump in quality--such as Leblanc did right after Tom Ridenour left.
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Author: Gary Shiozaki
Date: 2002-01-23 19:03
David,
My son's friend was concerned about quality control on the new clarinets. He was especially concerned since my son's Festival Bb cracked last summer. Are there manufacturing short cuts being taken in light of the financial troubles? I was quite interested in a post that appeared last week regarding Buffet clarinets cracking. It got us wondering. I don't mean to bad mouth Buffet. My son's set of Festivals are absolutely wonderful. But what about clarinets on the current assembly line....?
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Author: HAT
Date: 2002-01-23 22:00
I have been saying for a couple of years now that this is a golden age of Buffet clarinets. The quality and consistency are as high as they have been in a long time (if they were ever as high as they are now).
It is true that there are some financial problems with the corporation at the moment. I have no idea if quality control will eventually be affected. I personally have not tried any new horns in over a year.
That said, I don't think there is any problem buying a new Buffet at the moment.
There was a stupid thread recently about cracking Buffet clarinets. It proved nothing. A certain percentage of clarinets (particularly new ones) will crack. That's life. Cracking only destroys a small percentage of instruments. Most are easily repaired. All that is affected is the resale value. But new Buffet R13 clarinets are very cheap (compared to oboes, flutes and bassoons, etc) so resale value should not be a concern. If it is, buy used.
David Hattner, NYC
www.northbranchrecords.com
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-01-23 23:35
Gary Shiozaki wrote:
> I was quite
> interested in a post that appeared last week regarding Buffet
> clarinets cracking. It got us wondering.
Which is why I absolutely <b>hated</b> that thread. It proved absolutely nothing in any statistically satisfying way. Considering the 100s of thousabds of Buffet clarinets made every year (Yamaha, Leblanc and Selmet don't come close to the quantity Buffet sells right now) you'd expect to hear more about Buffets cracking.
Statistics are misleading to most people (I always loved "the rate of inflation is coming down" - so what? You still had inflation! Rates are misleading at best!) the absoulte numbers are just as bad. Airplane crashes kill a few hundred at a time so they <b>seem</b> to be a bad mode of transportation compared to cars - cars only kill people a few at a time. It's just that there's a lot more of those "few at a time" deaths. But, to our minds, the impact of a plane crash is so much more. We have other problems comprehending math in general (large numbers for instance. After a certain point we can't comprehend and thay all seem about the same ... even when there's orders of magnitude differences.).
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Author: Forest Aten
Date: 2002-01-24 02:41
In the past 3 decades (almost 4), I have had many, many opportunities to play Buffet clarinets at the U.S. distrubution point. I feel that the consistancy and quality currently put forth by Buffet is simply the best in these three decades.
I have selected and purchased, for myself or students, over two dozen clarinet in the past 12 months and all have been wonderful instruments. (NOT ONE INSTRUMENT HAS CRACKED BY THE WAY)
Buffet's response to competition in the past decade has been nothing short of remarkable. The lineup of very fine professional line instruments is impressive. Everyone is chasing Buffet in the marketplace.
R-13
Festival
Vintage
Prestige
Elite
RC
Greenlines in the R-13, Festival, and RC bores (maybe more now)
These all in chrome plate or silver plate.
The Buffet division of Boosey-Hawkes is doing their fair share in contributing to the bottom line. Boosey's business problems are complex and are not going to go away soon. Look for the profitable divisions to be spun off to the highest bidders....and perhaps even better days ahead for Buffet.
Forest Aten
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Author: Forest Aten
Date: 2002-01-24 02:50
I failed to mention the incredible work done to bring Buffet's bass clarinet into the same top professional league to compete with Selmer's dominate harmony clarinet business. I play a fabulous Selmer Model 37 bass clarinet in the Dallas Opera orchestra but if given a lotto win, would buy one of the new Buffet bass clarinets in a heartbeat.
(Of couse I would fund my retire plan first...haha)
F. Aten
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Author: Stephane
Date: 2002-01-24 08:21
I second Forest's opinion about B&H financial turmoil affecting or not Buffet. A few years back, when Buffet lost their independance and joined the B&H corp. there was big concern that it might affect the local management and their high quality policy. It didn't happen at all, quite the contrary. Buffet is a very valuable jewel in B&H crown (probably the finest), and whatever happens, the new owner (if it happens at all) will not be mad enough to challenge Buffet's hard-earned position on the market by fooling with quality or even dismantlement (which is totally unrealistic IMHO)
The clarinet market is still growing (hence the concern with grenadilla wood... and the wise R&D put on the Greenline series by Buffet), and Buffet still remains the leader. Whatever happens to B&H in the future, that should not affect Buffet presence on the market (too much...) and one should still buy their products with confidence.
And by the way, I play Buffet AND Selmer too!
Stephane (France)
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2002-01-24 13:43
I've purchased (both for myself and others) dozens of Buffet clarinets this year. I've never had one to crack.
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Author: beejay
Date: 2002-01-24 16:20
Remember, it is libellous to suggest a company is in trouble without factual proof. I keep a close watch on such things, and I have never heard the remotest rumour about difficulties at BC, which is a well-run and friendly company with superb products. (No, I don't have shares).
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Author: Robare - GFHS
Date: 2002-01-25 02:34
I've had notoriously bad luck with my R13s. As of now I've gone through two, and am going to purchase a third this weekend.
The first one had a natural groove in the wood that slowly got wider as I played on it.
The second was a replacement of the first, and the store I purchased it from only agreed to replace the two main joints, not the barrel and the bell. The barrel never fit properly and led to the second instrument cracking (it made a noise like a firecracker and cracked down the back near the register key).
Now I'm finally getting a horn with all the adjustments I would like. Silver keys, cork pad replacement on the upper joints, the whole nine yards, and though I've had problems with cracking, the instruments themselves are wonderful. (Well...the first one was. The second I am convinced was not the one I had picked out in the store after 6 hours of testing)
Keep in mind thought that I live in upstate New York, where both moisture and large temperature shifts (especially in winter) can really throw off the instrument.
Just note that R13s may crack, but they are good instruments. It's wise to get a replacement policy just in case, but don't shy away from them for any reason.
(Note - this is coming from me, a high school students, so you may or may not think me a reliable source)
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Author: Rob
Date: 2002-01-26 04:24
beejay wrote:
Remember, it is libellous to suggest a company is in trouble without factual proof.
beejay,
Let us try to not be a legal alarmist. I believe the following to be true and applicable to the situation. I hope any attorneys out there in Sneezy-Land will correct me if I am wrong (or tell me if I am correct):
For a statement to be considered libelous under the law, It must be: untrue, presented in writing, usually published (an internet BB may qualify as published writing, though it is a somewhat gray area under the law, as I understand it) and it must be defamitory in nature. Stating that B&H may be experiencing financial difficulty is not in and of itself defamitory unless it appears in a permanent, published forum in which such a statement could have an adverse (defamitory) effect on B&H. Examples of that might be a statement by an investment analyst in a published document that constituted investment advice, or a written statement that suggested or claimed that any existing financial difficulties were the result of negligence or malfeasance by the management of the company.
Merely stating "I heard they may be (or are) having problems" or asking "if anyone has heard about problems" are not libelous acts because in neither instance is a claim made that problems exist in certainty. There is no claim of fact in those instances. Also, the claimant would also need to prove that they have been damaged (defamed) and (due to their public stature in the case of B&H) that the defamation was done with malice or deliberate negligence, as well as proving that the statements made are not true. It is not necessarily the case that the person who made the statement must have factual, undeniable proof for the claim of libel to fail. In many cases they must merely show that they had just cause to believe that their statements were true and therefore not made with any malice or deliberate negligence.
As far as the internet is concerned (generally speaking anyway) Section 509 of the Telecommunications Act of 1996 states "No provider or user of an interactive computer service shall be treated as the publisher or speaker of any information provided by another information content provider." This doesn't mean that everyone is necessarily untouchable in this forum here, but it would be a rather tortuous road for B&H to actually meet all of the requirements for a successful claim stemming from the comments I've seen here on Sneezy.
This posting does not constitue and is not meant to be used as legal advice or opinion. I mention this because making reckless statements such as "Remember, it is libellous to suggest a company is in trouble without factual proof." could be considered dispensing legal advice since you did not qualify your statement with a claim that you are not a legal practitioner. I do not know, beejay, if you are licensed to practice law in any capacity, but I suspect that you are not, due to the recklessness of your comment. You may be interested to know that dispensing legal advice without a license is a crime.
NOTICE:
This posting does not constitue and is not meant to be used as legal advice or opinion. Neither is it the author's intent for this posting to be used as investment advice. The author is not an attorney.
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