 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-01-17 20:56
Just a short note concerning BBoard etiquette:
1) If someone has a "pen name" here, please use it on the BBoard even if you know their real name.
2) Short little witty replies are fine - as long as we don't start using the BBoard as a "private conversation" channel. If more than 20% of what you're posting is "witty one liners" - perhaps you're not as witty as you think.
3) Use appropriate titles. From now on all posts that don't have appropriate titles (or totally misleading ones) will be deleted.
4) If you don't want to leave your email on the BBoard, please leave the email address blank - don't be "cute" and leave some bogus address. I get email bouces from those "cute" addresses, and they're annoying.
5) Don't point out spelling errors in posts - rather, use the correct spelling if you post a reply (including correcting misspelled titles).
6) Don't use the phrase "I'm sorry if I upset anyone, but ..." (or similar ones). You don't have to be sorry to express your opion or the facts. Just remember that not everyone will agree with your opinion and people often dispute facts.
7) Disagreements (even vociferous ones) are not flames as long as they're not personal. Ones that start with "Jane, you ignorant **** ..." are flames. Don't respond in kind. Let me take care of it.
8) You will be "called on the carpet" when you start off a statement with "Everyone knows ...". Be ready for it. It's not a flame, it's a challenge.
9) There is no excuse for bad language. Ever. I'm the final arbiter of what "bad language" is. Some of you may not agree with my taste - all I can say is "too bad". It's my football.
10) Religion and politics come up from time to time. Tread carefully over that pit lest the snakes come up to bite you. Generally I discourage those in any topic. Rare exceptions have occured.
The audience for the BBoard ranges from pretty young to young at heart, from elementary school to PhDs, from barely able to write to newspaper writers and editors. It's fun, I enjoy the challenge of being the immoderate moderator, and I hope you have as much fun as I do.
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Author: A David Peacham
Date: 2002-01-17 21:30
(Re: 4) Better still, do what I do and leave a webmail address that you keep for just for BBoards. It'll collect a load of spam, and occasionally something interesting. Usually the message title will tell you which it is, so you can delete the spam without incurring the time and cost of downloading it.
Also - and I'm surprised Mark didn't reiterate this - no libel, no copyright violations.
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Author: sarah
Date: 2002-01-17 21:52
Do you think that you are some sort of god because you have the power to delete messages? Although I believe that people should use their best judgement when posting and replying, the people really run this board and not you Mark. YOU have to remember that there ARE a lot of younger people out there who might be turned away by all of your strict rules.
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Author: Pam
Date: 2002-01-17 22:15
Mark is in charge here Sarah. He pays the bills to keep the server up and running and does much more that we don't know about. I think his rules are common-sense. We all need a few rules in our lives to help us get along with other people.
Let's show a little respect.
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Author: Dan
Date: 2002-01-17 22:58
To Mark: Thank you. I have been advocating verbal rules of conduct and am pleased that a good start has been made. However, I still believe that verbage which is shaming, belittling, berating, insulting, or mocking should not have place on this BB. (Is this what you mean by "bad language?") Peter's response to Jenny's breaking of 5 clarinets was almost more than I could stand. Here we had a young girl who had the guts to own up to a problem, ask sincerely for help, and received a reply which almost brought me to tears. I wonder how she felt...I don't care if she broke 25 clarinets, every post deserves a respectful, dignified response.
To Sarah: I agree with Pam. Mark is in charge. My only disagreement with Mark is that I don't think his rules are strict enough. IMHO, rules regarding etiquette are not just necessary but absolutely mandatory. Young players will be enticed to return if they are treated in a helpful, friendly manner. Courtesty does matter.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-01-17 23:38
Sarah,
You're wrong. I own & run the BBoard. The rules here are anything but strict.
If any people (young or old) are turned away by these very simple and easy rules then I'm glad they served their purpose.
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Author: RonD
Date: 2002-01-18 00:14
I suggest for the enlightment of all the members and potential posters that a list of rules should be a permanent part of this board and be placed next to the search option at the top of the page so new and existing members can reference the accepted format re etiquette. This can stop some of the excesses that are now posted.
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Author: dennis
Date: 2002-01-18 00:57
Mark.......thank you. and thank you for your time, energies and efforts
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Author: sarah
Date: 2002-01-18 02:44
One thing I don't think is good etiquette is emailing people who post their opinions on this board. I meant what I said above, but no one has to agree with me. Or send harrassing emails.
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Author: Peter
Date: 2002-01-18 03:12
Dear Sarah,
I don't know what to say.
Are you. by any chance, one of these young people you mentioned? That was quite immature, if you don't mind my saying so.
When I was a young person my parents had rules I had to follow, and to tell you the truth, some of Mark's rules are very similar to ones my parents imposed on me when I was growing up.
When my children were growing up, I had rules they had/have to live by, as well, and when thier friends visit, so do they.
Did your parents not have rules you had and/or have to live by?
Most especially young people need to have well defined rules to live by. That is how we all learn to eventually behave in a civilized manner and develop a conscience to guide us when our parents are no longer there to curb our "bad habits." Looking at it from that perspective, citing young people who may not like Mark's rules is not even close to a valid argument.
Strict rules from Mark? Not hardly.
Does society not impose proper rules of behaviour on us all?
If you go visit friends, are there not rules of comportment that you have to follow in their homes?
Well, this is Mark Charette's "house." Here we behave as Mark would expect us to, regardless of whether his rules are good, bad or mediocre. In my "house," he'd have to behave accordingly, as well.
Who did you think owned the Sneezy serverit? Who sets it up? Troubleshoots it? Add and deletes new sections? Maintains it? Watches over it? Not you. I don't either. It's not my "house." Neither is it any of the other inmates'. I, like you and the others, am a guest in Mark Charette's "home," and I think it's not unreasonable for us to be expected to behave as such.
My mother used to tell me that I had to respect "her" house, and that when I wanted to do any differently I would have to go out and get my own house in which to act as I wanted to act.
The really great part about all this (for you,) is that, from what I've been able to gather thus far about Mark, is that he's such a really good fellow, that he's very likely already moved on to other things and won't dwell on the fact that you just insulted him, which, frankly, you did.
Mark said, "Disagreements (even vociferous ones) are not flames as long as they're not personal. Ones that start with "Jane, you ignorant **** ..." are flames."
So, you said, "What doyou think you are a god because you have the power to delete messages?"
The only thing Mark has to remember is that it is "his" bulletin board and that he can shut it down in the next five minutes, if he wants to, even without prior notice to you or me. That's our position here.
Too much said.
(Believe it or not, it wouldn't surprise me if Mark e-mails me to tell me to mind my own business in regards to this.)
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Author: Lisa
Date: 2002-01-18 03:13
Mark:
You ARE a god!  Whether I agree with the rules or not (which I do, by the way) I think you deserve loads of respect and THANKS for taking what must be a huge amount of your time and effort to host and moderate this board. I've seen posts in which you've been called a punk among other things and I have to shake my head and laugh.
I read far more often than I post, but I feel you deserve much thanks and wanted to put my 2 cents in.
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Author: Peter
Date: 2002-01-18 03:17
Gee, sorry Sarah, I meant to quote you and wound up paraphrasing you, and pooly, at that.
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Author: Mary
Date: 2002-01-18 03:34
Hear hear for Mark and the wonderful website and bulletin board we have! I have yet to find a flute or sax website that even barely comes close. The rules to "be kindly" as my mother-in-law says promote discussion rather than heated name-calling. Shoot, if only all the world (and all of us) acted that way all the time...
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-01-18 03:48
Peter wrote:
>
> When I was a young person my parents had rules I had to follow,
> and to tell you the truth, some of Mark's rules are very
> similar to ones my parents imposed on me when I was growing up.
The rules we live by (or adhere to on this BBoard) are for young & old alike. I in most cases have no idea of the age of the participants and in fact I'm routinely surprised by the ages of the participants - some I though young and immature by their language were old (well, near my age), and some I though aged and wise were barely in their teens!
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Author: Jim E.
Date: 2002-01-18 04:21
The very role of a moderator is to apply structure and order to interaction for the good of the group. Not an easy task - I've chaired my share of meetings.
Mark - You're one of the best! And sometimes your patience amazes me.
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Author: kenabbott
Date: 2002-01-18 11:01
As a contributor to several music bulletin boards, I can say that this one is the best organized and regulated. There is no smut and mainimal nastiness. Mark does a great job keeping order and keeping things on the straight and narrow. Sarah, if you don't like the rules, the answer is simple: don't post.
Mark: You da man.
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Author: javier garcia
Date: 2002-01-18 11:20
Please, don't forget that some of us are foreing clarinetists, and english is not our native language. For the language, we don't understand all you write, so try to keep in "academic" or "standard" english (although languages evolve with people's use) as far as you can.
Sometimes I realize that I miss interesting posts.
Thanks
Javier
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2002-01-18 13:04
Mark, you ignorant slut--
<i>Everyone knows</i> that in Rule 10, the last word, "occurred," should be spelled with two r's.
<i>Crap</i>, I just broke Rules 3, 7, 8 and 5. Oh, dang! And now probably 9 and 2 as well. (I was trying to be witty, but most people probably think I'm some sort of unfunny heathen who won't vote the party line.) And there went Number 10!
Don't throw me off. I kept three of the commandments! (Boy, I can't leave Number 10 alone.)
;-)
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2002-01-18 14:16
Well said, Mark. What an interesting discussion has been initiated!! As in the "Fantastics ", I'll try to "follow" X many! Don
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Author: joevacc
Date: 2002-01-18 14:32
I have never contributed to these sort of postings but I can't help myself this time.
It's a shame that people have to be told these simple things about etiquette, I am amazed!
Don Poulsen wrote: Mark, you ignorant slut-- [snip]
Don if you don't have the guts to say something like that to someone's face you shouldn't sat it at all.
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2002-01-18 14:47
Joe--
Calm down, my friend. It was a joke. (I assume Mark took it that way. If I could, I would have been willing to say it to his face, with a smile on mine and my best imitation of Chevy Chase saying it to Jane Curtain on Saturday Night Live.) I respect Mark, his bulletin board and grant that he has the right to set some minimal standards for it. I like having an oasis of civilization in the Internet desert.
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2002-01-18 16:29
When you own something, you get to decide how it's run--or you run it yourself and set the rules and govern it--or get someone to govern it. Mark's the boss, but a very fair one. Where else is there such a board for clarinetists that professionals and beginners interact with each other? When there's such a broad range of personalities and expertise, it's essential that there be some kind of etiquette. If you don't like it, don't open up the Sneezy page.
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Author: Robert Small
Date: 2002-01-18 17:26
A number of the regulars on this board also frequent the saxophone site Sax On The Web (myself included). We can tell you what happens when people choose to ignore basic rules of civilized behavior. One of my favorite areas of SOTW, the non-sax related discussion area, was shut down due to flooding (an excessive number of new threads from one person), flaming, trolling, threatening posts, etc. A few common sense rules of etiquette are necessary to keep a forum like this working.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-01-18 17:28
joevacc wrote:
>Don if you don't have the guts to say something
>like that to someone's face you shouldn't sat it
>at all.
Here's a problem. I knew Don Poulson meant it in jest (Don's been around for a while) but not everyone else does. joevacc reacted properly here, not knowing Don's history.
Don I'm sure wouldn't want everyone to use that kind of language here (and in fact I wish he wouldn't have filled in the asterisks!) or break all the rules he purported to.
The board is a very public place - it's best if you don't assume everyone will "get it" when you make a joke of that kind. Send it to me in private email!
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Author: joevacc
Date: 2002-01-18 18:06
I guess my SNL memories are waning. I should have not gone against my usual practices in public.
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Author: beejay
Date: 2002-01-18 22:08
Javier tiene mucho razon. Estamos una communidad mondial.
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Author: Paul F
Date: 2002-01-19 06:25
I have to agree with Mark. It is his football.
He's won very prestigious Web awards with this site. So, it's well worth keeping a very high standard of behavior, not only to earn more awards when justified, but to keep the ones already earned.
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-01-19 12:44
I must say I've been watching the progress of this board for about six or eight months now. I'm one of the "younger" people Mark spoke about (not the wiser man reference in reply #10, just a younger one, still in high school.) and even I have noticed a few evolutions for the worse on this message board, but at least it still has its evolutions for the better: steady, knowledgeable members; wide array of regular posts (If I miss a day posting I have to back up a few pages and take a few hours to catch up, which I'm doing right now!); and friendly people who help keep this board alive. (Including a particular webmaster whom I personally believe has the right to set any guidelines he wants.)
Mark, I like these rules. BTW, thanks for letting me inside.
David Pegel
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2002-01-19 15:13
As one of the Sneezy sponsors, I've been particularly proud of the way people maintain civility toward one another (in most cases). I know Mark has remained a steady hand in this, and it really sets the clarinet people above some others in the web world. We (via Mark) don't tolerate obscene messages or hateful spats. There's no place for that kind of behavior here on Sneezy. We remain a "class act" as long as we observe Mark's valid rules of behavior.
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Author: Ed
Date: 2002-01-19 19:09
I want to add my thanks to Mark for all of the time and effort he spends on this BBoard, the sneezy sites, Klarinet, etc. As a true clarinet junkie, I love reading and posting and think it provides a wonderful resource. Thanks many times over and keep up the good work.
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Author: Sarah
Date: 2002-01-19 19:26
I think this board is great and agree with all the rules Mark has stated. I do not agree with the other sarah who says they are too strict. They are there to prevent problems for us all and keep it sensible. Most are just common sense: bad language etc. We all share one common interest and thats what we are here to do, not cause rifts between people. Thank you Mark for being so great at keeping this board going, it has been helpful to me and im sure for everyone else here too.
Thank you.
Sarah
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Author: ~ jerry
Date: 2002-01-19 21:27
(fill in name here, as appropriate),
if someone barrows your new car and you ask them not to speed and do wheelies, and be sure to check the oil, and no smoking, eating or drinking in the car, do you epect them to follow your rules?
Or, is it okay for them to tell you that the rules are not fair and that other people will not want to barrow it because of your rules? MAN!! Do you lose out on that one because of the rules!
The same could be said about one's new clarinet, or any number of posessions.
I'm certainly glad there are rules to get me through traffic, comming home from work!
My 20%
~ jerry
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Author: beejay
Date: 2002-01-19 22:12
That's twice I've seen 20% in this thread. Where does it come from? Is it a modern way of saying two cents?
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Author: beejay
Date: 2002-01-23 12:26
Wendy and others
Humble apologies.I read right over it.
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The Clarinet Pages
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