 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Sara
Date: 2002-01-16 03:09
I just got back the allstate callback list and my director yelled at me because I messed up on scales and terms, but I made a oerfect tone and solo and almost perfect sight reading, because he wanted to know why I didn't care, and he didn't seem to understand it when I was trying to explain that the reason I didn't want to be there and didn't really try was because I just want to play for fun
Why it is that people push competition so much, and chairs, why is it that the good players always have to sit in a certain chair and why it that its always you have to make this or win this award. This is especially true in clarinets, at least at my high school, our section is the most hostile about chairs and what part you play and what you make in region and all state. Is it becuast he clarinet makes one hostile or something. I think that if I find out that college playing will be the same that I'll quit, and just play with my private teacher and for fun. What do yo guys think?
Sara
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Author: Joseph O'Kelly
Date: 2002-01-16 03:27
competition is what makes oneself a better player. If one wishes to become a pro player (I know I do) you can't settle for anything less than the best. I know when I am in college next year I want to compete for first chair in the highest ensemble. I was never one to enjoy being in the second seat.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-01-16 05:11
You know, I've got a kid who's a junior in a major conservatory, and I never hear him talking about "competition" per se. He's too busy I think to be worried about it - I just talked to him after 5 hours of rehearsals (he's in two orchestras at the conservatory along with chamber music & wind ensemble) and now he's got to practice along with doing his regular courseload.
I have no idea what chair he is (I think "it depends"). I know he's looking at going to some competitions over the next few years for professional reasons (he's thinking of attending the Tokyo Geidai to prepare for competitions in Japan) and he may enter some competition for summer festivals, but it's not a all-consuming thing. There's a good number of professionals who have never won a competition, and winning a competition may not mean anything in the long run. Just take a look at the Van Cliburn piano competition winners. Not all that many winners have gone on to stardom even though they're some of the finest pianists on the planet!
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Author: Richard Fong
Date: 2002-01-16 06:09
Sara,
How about think of this.
You can change other people mind, they also can't change your mind too. Fair, right. Don't worry other people mind, be nice, treat them good are enought.
Competition, that's other kind of fun, other way of learn. In my option, I will see the competition as a project (just like a office job, yeap). When I want to finished it, I need to do research, pratice ......step by step. Then, I will learn a lot a lot, and fun too!
The result, just a bonus, if i work hard, may be will get a good result.
One more, I also see a competition as a gathering, lot of good clarinetist come form difference country, share their experience... you may find....
"Wow, cool, this young player form ????? play Mozart concerto so nice!"
"Oh... Ms. XXXXX is using xxx and xxx , and xxxx in the xxxx ...."
What is this? Interesting, exciting and FUN.
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Author: Peter
Date: 2002-01-16 06:12
Mark,
The problem is not the kids, but the teachers. Many of them really get off on this competition stuff. Much more than the kids, who they often push into these competitions, whether they are ready for them or not.
My son's band director is one such. His only saving grace is that he often recognizes when a kid has had enough, then rather than turning nasty, he turns motivational instead. He's not always a nice guy, but he could be worse.
I've seen some of them (music teachers and band directors) at their worst. Sometimes it's amazing they don't turn most of their student's off on music.
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Author: Sandra F. H.
Date: 2002-01-16 14:16
Competition, just like any other venture in life, has virtues and downfalls. I personally like the first chair spot, fairly placed, because I like the parts. I find it challenging and fun to have that position. It's incredibly frustrating to me to sit in a lower position and watch someone fumble over and over with solo parts that I can play effortlessly. Also, to be first means invitations to perform with other ensembles. Conversely, I had for a couple of years, in High School, a director who didn't believe in competition or chair placement and left it up to the students to seat themselves. For me it was awful. There wasn't any musical refinement. Another director was exceptionally strict and musical, but many non-serious students weren't "having a good time". The music ensembles were improving, but the director was fired because the school board felt that students quitting marching band meant that he "wasn't doing a good job"! Go figure! Competition is what you make it. It's difficult, sometimes, to be in the spotlight, but then do you really want to be like everyone else?
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Author: LynnB
Date: 2002-01-16 15:06
Sara,
Here's my .02....Personally, I was always the type that was only having fun if I was first chair and miserable if I was second. So competition was part of the fun. But that's just me! I've seen plenty of decent players who just enjoyed the music, social scene, and events and didn't get wrapped up in the 'have to be first' mode. I think sometimes they were pretty good BECAUSE they didn't care so much. Since it was life and death to me, I put so much pressure on me that it sometimes took the fun away. Now I realize there is a balance between the two. So anyway...I'm blabbing on here...if you want to have fun and not make this a career, sounds good to me.
LynnB
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Author: Bill
Date: 2002-01-16 15:42
Competition is good, but I find that it is typically over emphasized at the high school level. I remember that in my high school, one could 'challenge' the next seat up on a weekly basis. This was too much, and frequently led to rather unpleasant conflicts within the clarinet section. I was challenged almost every week in the tenth grade, because a senior, who believed that first chair was her birthright as an upperclassman, was put off by the fact that a newcomer had displaced her. I was really mistreated by the other seniors, who generally sympathized with her situation.
I'm happy to report that, try as she might, she never prevailed. I had two advantages: (1) a very fine private teacher that was a close friend of my mother, and (2) I had been playing violin since I was very, very young. Still, this weekly challenge thing was just a waist of time. If a more comprehensive audition had been conducted at the beginning of the school year, she would have lost her chair without a chance for regaining it. This, I think, would have allowed a healing process to begin.
The competition for position has a place in the scheme of things, but overall health of the ensemble should come first. So what if you have to "play second fiddle" to a better player once in a while. That is just part of the experience. It has happened, and will continue to happen no matter what we do. The proper attitude is to work hard at playing your own part in the best possible way. This is fundamental discipline. Discipline is not always fun, but it is the mark or a mature individual.
Especially in these times . . . I, too, used to scoff at soccer leagues for my kids where no score was kept. But considering the mindset of many parents these days, I have come to believe that it is a very positive thing. Even at games where no score is kept, I have seen parents get woefully out of hand. (Did you see that trial in the news last week?) What ever happened to being gracious in victory and humble in defeat? These qualities are usually delivered to children by the example of parents or mentors, but far too many lack these qualities themselves these days. So, the level of competition that was healthy and proper thirty years ago might be excessive for this generation.
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Author: Pam
Date: 2002-01-16 17:44
Everybody is different. Some people thrive on competition, others do well when they don't always think about how they stack up to someone else (or everybody else!). I think that a little competition can be a healthy thing to motivate us to do better. That's the way I am anyway.
It sounds like you have a pretty good attitude and know what you want from your music so I hope you won't let what others say or think, even those in authority, bother you too much.
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Author: Kim L
Date: 2002-01-16 20:59
I've always wanted first chair. I don't what's so important about it though! Playing is fun and that's all that matters. I am in college now and quite happy playing in the Symphonic Band instead of the Wind Ensemble. IMHO, you take what you get and make the most out of it. Music is music and that's all that matters. I mean, there's always something to improve on no matter what the piece is.
Good luck,
Kim L.
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-01-16 23:36
I lke being first chair for second part, or second chair for first part, for some odd reason.
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Author: Rob
Date: 2002-01-16 23:46
Perhaps the problem is not competition itself, but the way in which competition is fostered. I attended high school in NJ in the mid 70s (to give you some context) and we also had a very competitive clarinet section, but there was rarely any bad blood among us. This may be because competition was encouraged and supported but not required. If your school program requires that you compete (mine did not), then criticism of your conduct is valid. You should also remember that when you are competing in a venue such as an all-state competition, which is sponsored and organized by an education organization, your conduct in that competition is a representation of the music program in your school. When I was in high school, we had to ask for the privilege of competing, and not everyone was given that privilege. I should also add that the granting of that privilege had little to do with the chair you occupied. Out of respect for the privilege of competing, you were honor-bound to do your best. If you are not willing to do so, then maybe you do not belong there. If you are only playing for the joy you derive but you are also required to compete, then maybe the program is not a good fit for you.
As for people who think the chair in which they sit is an indication of the type of musician they are, their performance ability, or talent, they have a great deal to learn. There is so very much more to it than that. Understanding just how much more there is to it, by the way, is one of the things that you are supposed to learn from competition.
Good Luck!
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Author: Bea Starr
Date: 2002-01-21 18:57
I'm in 8th grade and I recently preformed the first 2 movements from the Mozart concerto for solo festival, which counts as your tryout for All-County Band, last week. I had a killer hard judge while my friend, who is in ninth grade got an easy judge. She got a 97 out of 100 while I got an 83 out of 100. Now you can ask anybody whose heard us both play-I'm the better player because I practice more and I work much harder than she does. So, now that the results for All-County are out, she made 1st chair while I made 3rd. Let me tell you, that hurt me alot, and only now am I just starting to recover from it. My director/teacher only tries to make me feel better, and in no way shape or form did he yell at me for doing so "poorly" or not trying enough. I'm still very mixed up about if I should have played better or if I'm just not "trying" enough........Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that competition can be brutel and very painfull. Even when you are much better than other people, you can be misjudged and mistreated,but when these things do happen, all you can do is think, "I'm a great clarinetist and there's always next time to kick some butt" But don't let these things keep you down, keep practicing and most importantly, keep smiling
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