 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Leanne
Date: 2002-01-08 03:07
It's been a while since I've posted, but something happened to me today, and I don't know where else to turn.
When I quit band, my original intentions were to major in music anyway, but now I'm not even sure that I want to join college band.
The band director said some rude comments about me to the band. My friends who told me said that he was all but naming me.
He's buddies with the band director at the college I've been accepted to (University of Northern Colorado), and if he's talking trash about me to the band, I don't even want to know what he's said to him.
I feel so violated and betrayed.
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Author: Leanne
Date: 2002-01-08 03:34
Reading back over my post, I wish I hadn't posted it at all. I didn't really ask a direct question or anything--I don't know what to ask. Anyway, disregard my whining--I'll try to be more helpful in the future.
Sorry.
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Author: Zannah
Date: 2002-01-08 03:42
In my senior year of high school I also quit band with intentions to major in music. Then that director hated me and talked openly about me as if I had personally attacked him (actually yelled at my friend at the mention of my name). I am now a performance major.
Unless your former band director was aware of your intentions to attend this university, the university band director may not have heard about you. In my opinion, your relationships with the clarinet professors is more important than with the band director. If you are determined and talented, no rumor will hinder your sucess.
It hurts to hear that someone talks trash about you, but it is exponentially worse when it comes from an adult with whom you should have a professional relationship. Keep up your practicing, it will be okay!
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-01-08 03:52
Wow - it seems as if American band directors are hell bent on discouraging talent. I'm old fashioned, when I conduct an orchestra (usually for opera), if the players are outstanding I tell them. I'm certainly never rude to musicans (it's easy to alienate them), besides, it would be hypotrical seeing as I was once a performance musician.
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Author: LynnB
Date: 2002-01-08 04:23
Leanne,
You're not whining. I know how much this can hurt. I too didn't get along with my high school band director but went on to college to major in music. High school can seem like your whole world when you're in the middle of it and once you're out the real world is open to you. I swear it seems like SOME school band/orchestra directors just want to run their own empire and forget about the students that look up to them for direction. Please don't let this one misguided soul ruin the relationship between you and your clarinet. Your instrument and talent will last a lot longer than some of the relationships you come across.
BTW, I had a blast in college and forgot all about the little back stabing that can happen in High School. Good luck and enjoy your playing.
LynnB
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Author: Kim L.
Date: 2002-01-08 04:59
In high school, I had a very similar situation. I went through three band directors. The third band director seated a freshman ahead of me my senior year(sigh...). Anyway, I am now a music major and very happy.
Don't let these bumps and bruises make you any less interested than you already are. Stand up for yourself by continuing. If you quit, you let the band director win, not yourself. Let me tell you a story:
Last semester, I entered my third year as a music ed major, which meant conducting. I was scared to death! The professor in this class was totally mean and obnoxious, anything but supportive of me throughout the whole semester. Eventually, I understood what he was trying to accomplish. He wanted me to have confidence in myself which I now have more of.
What I'm trying to say is rude comments although upsetting, are encouraging. Every year that I've been in college, this professor, also my band director, has said something to get on my nerves. At times, he's even brought me to tears!
So just relax. Everything will be okay. Just do what you want and not what others want for you.
Good luck,
Kim L.
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Author: Aures
Date: 2002-01-08 06:06
Yeah, I had a similar experience while in high school. The thing of it is that some high school band/music directors are not confident enough about their abilities as musicians and conductors and they do not act professionally toward some of their students. For example, very talented and motivated musicians, such as yourself and I pose a threat to their "authority" and "dominance" and will tend to disregard, hate, or avoid helping or caring about your musical progress. Such a teacher can actually can prevent you from improving your skills or expanding your musical knowledge.
I too eventually quit symphonic/marching band after my junior year because I had the same problem with the director. I was a very motivated student from my freshman year and was able to become a 1st chair clarinetist and a member of all-county and all-region bands without much help from him.
He would not offer any help even if I asked for it because he thought that he didn't get paid enough money to do it and he was not required to teach beyond what the other beginners were learning. For auditons, I had to learn everything on my own because nobody would help me and I had no private tutor. This kind of thing can be very discouraging and annoying. So instead of fighting with this I quit; he lost a good student and I was free of this bad situation. It is always good to look at things from a broader perspective when things go bad because somethings the little things get a bit to pesky to deal.
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Author: Richard Fong
Date: 2002-01-08 06:08
Leanne,
You still have long long road. Don't do/say any stupid thing, like rude the band director somthing, take it easy.
Find some of the day, have tea with the band director, let him know you ARE NOT hate him, you are still friend. Keep smiling, just like another interview.
For what? Let him don't rude you anymore. Let him know you are so nice.
Connection is still important in the music career.
Trust me, that's a small case in your life. Take it easy.
Cheers.
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Author: Aures
Date: 2002-01-08 06:22
That is some nonsense there Mr. Fong with your half broken english. Any director who acts with such disrepect deserves no symphathy and to act in an artificially nice way just so you can look "good" is pointless.
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Author: Richard Fong
Date: 2002-01-08 06:42
Aures, (^_^) , I will work hard on my english. I wish my clarineting is not poor as my english...
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2002-01-08 12:54
Aures, your bigotted criticism of another poster's English was totally uncalled for. Participants on this board come from all over the world and are not all American-born with English as their first language. The only requirement for posting here is an interest in the clarinet. Your own far-less-than-perfect use of the language would have been overlooked had you not criticized another on this irrelevant matter.
Mr. Fong, on behalf of all other board participants, I apologize for the rudeness of Aures. You do not need to apologize for your English. I doubt that many of us are so fluent in a second language. I also think your points are valid. No matter how others treat us, we should try to "take the high road" and treat them with more respect than they have given us, as you have done in your second posting.
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Author: Danette
Date: 2002-01-08 14:16
Oh, yeah, I wanted to add something.
I had a kinda reverse situation. My high school band director was very awesome and did his best to help me reach my goals (i.e. make it to All State) even though he wasn't that knowledgeable with clarinet.
In college I was not a music major (too many horror stories about theory and aural skills) but played in the symphonic band b/c they needed clarinets. At first I loved the band director, he seemed great. But in my later years, my course load conflicted with rehersal times and I just couldn't find time to practice. I definately was not an asset to the band anymore, but my band director was still angry when I quit.
I guess my point is, there are people out there at various levels who just don't seem to 'get it'. However, NOONE should stop you from doing anything. While I left the college band with a bad taste, I still had some wonderful times and great experiences I wouldn't trade for anything.
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Author: Ralph Katz
Date: 2002-01-08 17:31
My experience with HS & college band directors was mixed - I have seen the good, bad and ugly. There are a lot of really great public school music teachers. Then again there are a lot of pip-squeak dictator Toscannini wanna-be's, and you are probably best served by steering clear of them. Many, many band directors regard themselves as the only thing between their students and abject barbarism. This level of paranoia serves nobody, least of all students. It also doesn't explain all of our good friends and neighbors who never have and never will taken up musical instruments. Music is a wonderful thing, but it is not the only thing.
One director in particular that I recall got in trouble for bad-mouthing students in front of the class, big trouble. The normal mode of dealing this is to just knuckle under to their bullying tactics. It was a thing of beauty when these particular students' parents proved to be assertive and have good lawyers. As a parent myself, I think much like Dirty Harry: "Make my day." Fortunately for little old hot-headed me, my kids have chosen to be in orchestra, where the teachers all seem to know about civility.
Students can feel absolutely dependent on their public school teachers to guide their careers, but this need not be the case. You can feel better about yourself by taking charge of your own education, getting the best teachers, and finding your own good performing opportunities. Even if you feel absolutely trapped, remember that This, Too, Shall Pass. Orchestras are full of players who have succeeded in spite of bad teachers.
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Author: Dave Beal
Date: 2002-01-08 19:03
Leanne, you said that you have a suspicion that your band director has disparaged you to UNC. But maybe he's more of a professional than you give him credit for. And even if he did say something negative to someone at UNC, that doesn't mean they've taken it to heart. If he's really a bum, others will realize it and will give his words less weight. This is no reason to abandon your goals. Pursue your love of music at UNC.
This whole discussion has made me appreciate my high school music experience even more. I attended a relatively small high school in a middle class (at best) suburb. But both our band and choir programs were excellent; they were clearly the most successful extracurricular programs in the school. The band director was a wonderful musician, teacher and leader. Our concert band consistently got Superior ratings in competition, sometimes competing against schools two size categories higher. She was also gay. I was so naive at that age that I never realized it, but unfortunately some of the parents and students knew it and made life very difficult for her. She gave up both teaching and music the year after I graduated, which was a great loss for the young people of the area.
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Author: ron b
Date: 2002-01-08 20:26
I can't tell you my similar story, Leanne, because all the participants are not dead yet :
I wish to second Don's comment that Mr. Fong has made two very good points. Remember the good qualities of your former band director and mention them to anyone who brings up his name. You'll feel better and he'll look like the jerk he is. If you have the opportunity you might quietly ask him why he's behaving like a kid. Compliment him on his good qualities and try to part as friends. Mr. Fong's final observation is well taken that ongoing connections are important in any business and this director will prove to have been a rather insignificant one in the long run.
I will not apologize 'for' Mr. Aures -- he stuck his foot in his face before he finished his first sentence.
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-01-08 21:10
Leanne:
You are the same girl I had a long discussion with about marching band via email, right? The same girl whose email address consists of the sn "bandgeek"?
What bandgeek would let their director stand in their way? Don't let your former director get you down.
If you still have a passion for music, join college band!! Or join an orchestra. Nobody likes to see a musician go to waste, after all. Everythig will be wonderful.
Just hang in there!!
Richard Fong:
You are a reminder to me about how much we Americans asume we're on top. Perhaps we need to learn how to accept the fact that there are other people besides us. I don't know two languages, though it would be nice if I did, and your advice is always appreciated on this forum.
(We should all make everyone feel welcome on this site, IMHO. Who knows who we might run off if we don't?)
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Author: Aures
Date: 2002-01-08 21:26
LOL! Guess what.. English is not my first language either and don't take my comment so personal Mr. Poulsen, it wasn't directed at you anyways. I love people who apologize for me that's very nice, how "lofty" of them... LOL! Some people just take this too seriously.
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2002-01-08 21:45
I didn't take your comments personally. And I don't fault you for using less than perfect English. I just feel that a criticism of another poster's English is unnecessarily rude and inappropriate to this board. In reality, when this is done, the person making the unnecessary insult is the one who ends up looking bad.
Your remarks can also be made more effective by not calling another poster's remarks "nonsense," but by saying something to the effect of "I disagree with what you say because..."
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2002-01-08 22:35
I recall someone unnamed some time ago who's term was "Bull...." I didn't care for that term.
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Author: Leanne
Date: 2002-01-09 03:10
I cannot thank you all enough for your kind words, stories, and encouragement.
The strange thing is, some of the students that were mad at me are treating me better. I think the band director has finally messed it up, and now they all realize they should have jumped ship too.
As for UNC, I am going to sign up for band. If the band director there doesn't give me a chance, he isn't the great person everyone makes him out to be.
I'm not going to let this man ruin my fun for me.
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-01-09 03:21
Leanne - this is great - I read your story and felt really sad for you. I'm glad you're not deterred - "you go girl"
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-01-09 12:30
Aures wrote:
>
> That is some nonsense there Mr. Fong with your half
> broken english.
What an ignorant cur! Trying to emulate thios "band director"?
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Author: TO AURES
Date: 2002-01-09 22:23
OK you ignorant fool, that's some pretty jacked up to comment on his english. What's your full name? that's probably the most offensive thing i've heard on this bulletin board. So how good are you on the clarinet aures? let's hope it's better then your maturity, cuz u seem like you were brought up by poor parents.
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Author: TO AURES
Date: 2002-01-09 22:27
OK you ignorant fool, that's some pretty jacked up to comment on his english. What's your full name? that's probably the most offensive thing i've heard on this bulletin board. So how good are you on the clarinet aures? let's hope it's better then your maturity, cuz u seem like you were brought up by poor parents.
You think this is a joke aures? with your attitude, I KNOW you won't succeed in music. reading your post brings two words to mind: CLOSEMINDED
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-01-09 23:48
Umm - I think we all get the point ... can we be a little civilised here and not so quick to judge??
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Author: julia
Date: 2002-01-10 18:50
Aures said: "morons"
oohhh----no comment. if I were you I would take the well founded advice others have given you. BTW, have you ever heard the saying that goes: "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all"?
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Author: Leanne
Date: 2002-01-10 19:12
oh gee---first I ruin the band, now the bulletion board...It's amazing people talk to me (haha)
By the way--
I happen to hang out with two foriegn exchange students all the time...broken english is alright with me. If it makes sense to me, that's good enough.
The only way to learn is to practice---if someone told you that your clarinet playing was awful based on one short etude how would you feel?
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Author: Aures
Date: 2002-01-10 23:52
Julia:
Unfortunately, not everybody lives by that rule and as you can see, by reading this thread,you can't expect people to follow that anyway; it is and always has been broken. And in my opinion, it is unrealistic to expect such a thing from everyone cause as history and time have shown us, it is very unlikely to change. I guess it is the part of human frailty and a source of weakness. We are not all divine beings on this earth, although many try to be...
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Author: diz
Date: 2002-01-11 00:17
Julia - there's something I'd like to say to you, but not in this public environment - but I can't seem to work out your email address! :-) thanks, diz
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2002-01-11 01:05
It's been my experience in life that the areas where the strongest criticism come are those where the greatest rewards are buried.
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Author: To aures
Date: 2002-01-11 15:06
hmm.....what college u plan to go to aures? don't let it be anywhere near ohio, because I would make everything in my best effort to keep you away.
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