 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Mary Butler
Date: 1999-06-20 22:12
My father picked up a Cundy Bettoney (H Bettoney) clarinet when he was young (about 11 years old). The serial # is A4216. The only other markings are the company name (H Bettoney CBCo Boston USA, a symbol of some sort, and US imprinted on it. If someone could give me some information on it I would be very thankful. The clarinet needs repadding and cleaning. I would like to know if it would be worth the effort. I don't know if it is silver plated or just silver. The case has Cundy Bettoney on it as well as US engraved on it. It is still in the original case.
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Author: Fred McKenzie
Date: 1999-06-21 02:33
Mary Butler wrote:
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My father picked up a Cundy Bettoney (H Bettoney) clarinet when he was young (about 11 years old). The serial # is A4216. The only other markings are the company name (H Bettoney CBCo Boston USA, a symbol of some sort, and US imprinted on it.
Mary-
Can it be played at all? If you can determine that it can be made to play in tune, then it might be worth getting fixed up.
My Cundy Bettoney is the "Three Star" model. It seems to be made for A=445 pitch, and some notes can't be played in tune when adjusted for A=440 Hz. It is only good as a collector's item.
I understand the US indicates it was produced for sale to the US Military.
Fred
<A HREF="http://www.dreamnetstudios.com/music/mmb/index.htm">MMB</A>
<A HREF="http://www.nbbd.com/">NBBD</A>
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Author: jim lande@erols.com
Date: 1999-06-21 03:45
The Silva Bet models were intended as professional quality horns. I have restored 2 and one clearly is better than
an currently available student horn. They made a Columbia model that was supposed to be an intermediate model. They made a variety of student models. The most common were the Cadet and the 3 star. i have a 3 star that was not engraved but rather had some cellophane or tape like decal pasted on the bell. Well, you can see most of it. I could see how you would end up with no model name. CB was one of the largest sellers of band instruments between the wars and I have read on Sneezy that other manufacturers made instruments for them. Thus, the serial numbers may not reveal much. Look to see if there is a patent number. Sometimes companies made special models for the military where were the same as thier commericial lines, but not so marked. Is the barrel adjustible?
Fred: are you sure that you have the right barrel? I don't doubt that some high pitch metal clarinets were made, but
I think they are uncommon -- partly because most metal clarinets were made after 1935. How many inches from the highest pad to the bottom of the bell? how many inches between the centers of the highest and lowest of the six open holes?
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Author: mike
Date: 1999-06-21 12:36
in the area i live in to have a horn (clarinet)reworked from top to bottom (pads, cleaning, springs, corks and adjusting...) would run you btwn 105.00 to 225.00 (unforseen circumstances exceptions)....i believe all instruments that can be worked over and play well are worth restoring...the key wording being will it play at all or will it play well.....the least it would be is a good looking display (if not playible.....
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Author: Mary Butler
Date: 1999-06-22 02:27
Honestly, I don't know. It has some pads that are missing and a lot of pads have been eaten is what it looks like. When I got the clarinet I was still in High School. My band teacher said that it couldn't be tuned. Personnally, I think he just wanted it for his. To tell you a little about the age, my dad is now 48 or 49. I have only tried playing it briefly. All a could possibly get was Maybe an "A" out of it.
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Author: Mary Butler
Date: 1999-06-22 02:40
The barrel is adjustable. It is 20 in. from the highest pad to the bottom of the bell. It is about 6 1/4 in from the centers of the highest and lowest of the six open holes.
The onle numbers on the clarinet are A4216. I can't find any patent #'s. There is a metal paperbacked sticker in the case that has CBCo. Trade Mark Reg. U.S. Pat. Off.
That's all.
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Author: Mary Butler
Date: 1999-06-22 02:49
My Thank's to everyone for the help. I have made up my mind to get it repadded and cleaned up to aleast see if it will be playable. Wether or not it plays well I guess I will see. If anyone has any idea on how to get more information upon the history I would love to know how. I'm more than just interested in its value. It's a good conversation piece any way I look at it. Thanks again for all of the help. I will definitly be back to check out more tips and what have you in this area.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 1999-06-22 15:55
I had a memo, re: C-B, ready for posting when AOL crashed [momentarily] so I'll try to recall it. I have 2 Bettoneys, a mediocre 3 Star metal and a fairly-good Bet [USN avy?]wood. I believe the CBCo stands for C Bruno [NY -Boston] distributor [perhaps if Mark has time he can add to this]. Sounds like you have a Silva-Bet [or its clone!], the only patent I know of is US 1,705,634 which describes the features of the S-B, the best of the 1920-40 metals. You [or your reference librarian] can get can get a copy from a Pat Depository Library [at least one in each state] or via www.patents.uspto.gov or www.ibm.com [pat search site] cost?. Luck, Don
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Author: jim lande@erols.com
Date: 1999-06-24 02:40
Mary Butler wrote:
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The barrel is adjustable. It is 20 in. from the highest pad to the bottom of the bell. It is about 6 1/4 in from the centers of the highest and lowest of the six open holes.
The onle numbers on the clarinet are A4216. I can't find any patent #'s. There is a metal paperbacked sticker in the case that has CBCo. Trade Mark Reg. U.S. Pat. Off.
That's all.
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Based on length, the clarinet should play at modern US pitch (A=440). If 'adjustable' means you can slide the barrel in and out, then it may be a student model. If 'adjustable' means that you can turn a ring and the barrel gets longer or shorter, then it is indeed a Silva Bet. They were developed in the late 1927s and advertised as the first 'successful' metal clarinet (whatever that means.) Based on ebay listings, many were sold to the military and they were made at least through the 1930s. Bettoney sold them for the same price as their top wooden models. The Silva Bet came in a number of styles (single main piece or breaks in the middle, articulated C#/G#, extra trill keys, Low Eb, etc. If you have one of these, pay to get it working. It will run circles around a plastic student model (IMHO)
jim
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Author: Lelia
Date: 1999-06-25 22:05
One caveat about the model type: My Silva-Bet is engraved "Silva-Bet" up at the top, just below the tuning barrel. I was under the impression that the Silva-Bets were always marked as such, but maybe that changed over the years.
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Author: jim lande@erols.com
Date: 1999-06-26 03:20
I am guessing that most (if not all) Silva Bets were so marked. However, I have a "Silver King" that does not have standard markings because it was sold to the military. It is possible that to protect brand name value, a company would not brand instruments sold under a major contract. So, if there were obvious markings "US" or "USN" or "USQMC", etc, and it had all of the other features and the keywork looked the same (and especially if it had the patent number) then it would be a silva Bet. but this is speculation.
This is
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Author: Lelia
Date: 1999-06-26 23:10
jim lande@erols.com wrote:
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I am guessing that most (if not all) Silva Bets were so marked. However, I have a "Silver King" that does not have standard markings because it was sold to the military. It is possible that to protect brand name value, a company would not brand instruments sold under a major contract. So, if there were obvious markings "US" or "USN" or "USQMC", etc, and it had all of the other features and the keywork looked the same (and especially if it had the patent number) then it would be a silva Bet. but this is speculation.
It makes sense. Thanks!
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