 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Crissy
Date: 2001-10-11 18:10
Hi, I'm looking to get some info on the LeBlanc Symphonie III. I currently play a Buffet Festival and am looking to get a secondary instrument of nice quality. How different are LeBlanc clarinets from Buffet? Is there a different feel to the keys, or a different tone quality in general? The instrument I'm looking at is about $700 and is probably about 50 years old, but is in very nice, relatively new condition. Is this a good deal for my money? Any info you could give me would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!! =)
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Author: Crissy
Date: 2001-10-11 18:21
I believe this is the clarinet I'm looking at:
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1451003631
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Author: HAT
Date: 2001-10-11 20:58
What do you want the clarinet for?
In any case, I certainly wouldn't pay more than $450 for this instrument, regardless of condition.
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Author: HAT
Date: 2001-10-11 20:58
What do you want the clarinet for?
In any case, I certainly wouldn't pay more than $450 for this instrument, regardless of condition.
David Hattner, NYC
www.northbranchrecords.com
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2001-10-11 21:29
Hi Crissy,
I think the instrument you pointed us to dates closer to the 60's or 70's than to the 40's as the seller suggests. I have a pair (Bb/A) of "original" Symphonies which I believe date to the 50's or maybe the 40's. Dee Hayes can probably date yours closer. I've seen her mention a Symphonie II on several occasions that (if my memory is right) she dates to the 60's. She thinks very highly of that instrument. I have the impression that the Symphonie has pretty much been Leblanc's top-of-the-line when they have been in the line. The Symphonie VII certainly is now. My Symphonies are very well made and have unplated keys. Both feel lighter in weight than any other wood clarinet I have ever played (not because of the keys -- plating wouldn't add anything noticeable). I haven't actually weighed them but I presume that, if they are lighter, it is due to thinner walls or less dense wood. The most noticeable difference in the feel of the instruments will likely be on the right hand side trill keys. To me, they feel closer to the body on Leblancs in general. Actually, I think I prefer this feel slightly to my Buffet.
The "party line" on Leblancs vs. Buffets is that Leblancs have more accurate intonation across the range but not as pleasing a tone. I don't know whether this is generally true or not and, even if it is, it might not hold for this specific instrumnent. (I've never taped myself playing a Leblanc so I can't compare my tone between the two. When I'm playing a Leblanc, it "feels" like it sounds like my Buffet (if that makes any sense). Trying to describe tone verbally is like ... well, never mind, I can't do it.) The best thing for you to do is try the instrument and tape yourself to see if you find the tone pleasant.
Personally, I think $700 is a little on the high side for this instrument. Despite the fact that it looks mint, it is still "old technology." The seller has tried eBay twice (at least) now and hasn't gone much over $525. Still, if the instrument is truly in mint condition (as the picture suggests), needs no work (e.g., brittle pads) and plays well for you, $700 is probably not an outrageous price. You will pay close to that amount for a new wooden step-up instrument from the big mail order places. $700 would buy you a Selmer Signet in "good playing condition" at most of the music stores in St. Louis. ;^(
On the other hand, if you are patient, you can probably find a decent Selmer or Leblanc instrument (i.e., one that doesn't need alot of work) from around this one's time period for $350 - $500 on eBay. I have seen Leblanc L7's go for as little as $250. If you decide you want this one (and as long as it doesn't appear that the seller has another buyer waiting to snap it up at his/her asking price, you might try bargaining. An offer of $600 would be significantly above the best offer on eBay. If the seller says no, you can always pay full price later, if you *really* want it. Don't buy it without giving it a good test, though.
Best regards,
Jack Kissinger
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-10-12 01:38
When I talked to the fellow at Leblanc (Dave Surber), he told me that the Leblanc Symphonie II was from the early to mid 1950s. That would probably put the Symphonie III as late 1950s to possibly early 1960s.
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Author: Carmen Izzo
Date: 2001-10-12 02:50
The keywork on leblancs to me seems biggeer, not as compact? The word on the street is that leblancs are better in tune but some also say the buffets have a sound that is just BAM! Instant tone!
~Carmen
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Author: joevacc
Date: 2001-10-12 04:53
Looking at the key work I would have to agree that this clarinet is not as old as the owner has stated.
If you look at the c#/g# key specifically you can see that it is curved; on my 1947 Leblanc (which was dated by Dave Surber himself and others) it is straight.
Also the logo has been changed on the more modern instruments. I do not know when these changes occurred.
Best Luck,
-=[Joe Vacc]=-
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2001-10-12 14:34
Leblanc Symphonies are generally pretty nice instruments, but I agree with most of our fellow Sneezies who have said it is too much money for this instrument. But, that depends upon what you think. If you want to buy it and are happy with it and you don't plan to resell it and try to get your money back out of it, go ahead.
I play Leblancs and Buffets and like both for different reasons. The Leblancs do play better in tune in the upper registers and do have a different sound than the Buffets. It's a matter of personal preference. The key action on Leblancs is slightly different than the Buffets, so I would be aware of that before buying a backup that I might have to use in concert sometime without much notice. I once used a Buffet Prestige Bb and a Leblanc Concerto A as my two orchestral clarinets and really wished I had a matched set of one or the other because of the difference in the way they felt and responded. Not a big deal, but something to think about.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2001-10-12 15:36
Being a LeBlanc-Selmer lover, I much enjoy the discussions here and on the "Big Four" thread below, where I made mention of my recently-acquired Dynamic 2 [not the "H" [Pete F - similar] model]. It plays and "feels" very good to me, quite similar to my L7. My son's oldie ['40's?], my grandson's Classic ['50's?], a sold L70 ['70's?], and acquaintance with several Noblet-Normandy-Vito's via repairs, and ownerships of "specials" , Noblet-Stubbins and ?McIntyre? [my Bundy-Mazzeo is a Selmer "flyer"] are somewhat dated by their patents. I have a number of them so if anyone is interested, I can post some pat #'s, which can be viewed via the USPTO site, prob. searching using LeBlanc AND clarinet, since there are several inventor names. I plan to measure the bore of the Dyn 2 UJ to place it in this large group. As mentioned, Dee is quite familiar with LeB's as is Jack K, [and others], so I welcome their inputs to this interesting thread. Don
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Author: Joe
Date: 2001-10-13 16:26
The clarinet that we're discussing is back on the eBay auction ....... AGAIN!!! Price is still the same :$800.00, and he will NOT give a 3 day inspection/trial period. Hmmmmm.......
Joe.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2001-10-13 18:54
Joe - I acquired the Dynamic 2 above for less than half the 800. Communicate with the seller to negotiate!! The Dyn 2 IS a big bore cl, .590" = 15.0 mm, same as the "H" and the Pete F models, plays very well with adjustments of the fork Eb/Bb ring/pads and the artic. C#/G#, maybe worth at least $500? or more? Don
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