 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Jessica
Date: 2001-09-09 01:59
I have a friend who is looking to invest in a good plastic intermediate clarinet; he doesn't want a wooden one because the main of what he does is marching band and he doesn't intend to go professional in any way, but he's realized that (who would've thought?) he can get a much nicer sound on better clarinets
Anyway, I would love to advise him, but I don't know anything about intermediate clarinets... I went straight from my Bundy to a Festival (that's what my parents bought me when they got my sister a Mustang
If you have any opinions on the subject please write back.
Tia, - Jessica
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Author: KJ
Date: 2001-09-09 02:34
First of all, there's really no such thing as a plastic intermediate grade clarinet. Plastic instruments, due to the low cost of material when compared with wood, are inherently cheaper and are more attractive to beginners due to price. Because these instruments are focused at the beginner market, they usually display lower workmaship than your Festival, per se (or some high-end intermediates). The key action will be a little more stodgy, the scale more uneven, the tone holes straighter, and so on.
The big question here is, what does your friend play currently? When staying in the field of plastic clarinets, it's much harder to make a step above than a side-step. However, if he's playing something like an antiquated and maladjusted Bundy Resonite, he can get plastic instruments that are comparable or better than his current horn AND some low-end wooden clarinets (Selmer Bundy Signet/103, Normandy 4). Where I live can accurately be described as Yamaha country, seeing as the most popular music rental store around here only offers the YCL-20, which is a wonderful plastic instrument. However, I've always found the Selmer CL300B (when coupled with a good mouthpiece, the one included with it is nothing short of horrid!) to be the best plastic on the market. In fact, it even plays better than my friend's E-11! There's also the Vitos and Buffets, but...you'll get the point, each to their own. If he has a decent clarinet and good set-up at the moment, then there's no need to switch to another plastic model.
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Author: Anji
Date: 2001-09-09 03:02
Jeezit KJ, whatta load of c**p!
The Boosey and Hawkes 1-10 is a plastic horn, and some have impeccable intonation. Ya gotta look, but good student horns are surprisingly common.
This preconception that plastic is bad, wood is good overlooks the necessary step;
play the damn horn before you decide!
The Selmer Cl-300 IS an excellent choice, given that it is actually machined and may have more quality in the assembly but writing off the Vitos, Bundys and Roths of the back bin is myopic to say the least.
For marching band, why inna hell wudja spend big bucks?
Jess,
Gettim ta spend serious money on the mouthpiece, good reeds (trya Legere!)
and a well-maintained Vito. From the sidelines, who could know if he's a wee
off here or there?
Let's get real about this, shall we?
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Author: David Kinder
Date: 2001-09-09 03:36
Jess,
I've been weighing the two above posts, and I hope I can give you some straight advice as well.
Stick to the "big 4" - Buffet, Selmer, Yamaha and Leblanc. Now, if you're looking for an intermediate plastic, I believe that Leblanc makes one under the label "Holton" - which will look like a music lyre on the upper joint. Of course, play test it first.
But, why not look into a greenline Buffet R-13? Sure, he doesn't need a professional clarinet for a music career, buy why not for his own enjoyment? The greenline is safe to use outdoors and will have much better sound and intonation (my opinion) than any other plastic clarinet out there. They're also being sold at record lows right now. It's just another thought.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-09-09 04:06
David Kinder wrote:
>
> ... But, why not look into a greenline Buffet R-13? Sure, he
> doesn't need a professional clarinet for a music career, buy
> why not for his own enjoyment? The greenline is safe to use
> outdoors and will have much better sound and intonation (my
> opinion) than any other plastic clarinet out there. They're
> also being sold at record lows right now. It's just another
> thought.
It's fine to use outside but I wouldn't march with it at least not in parades where you are on concrete. The possibility of dropping and breaking an expensive horn is not a worthwhile risk.
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Author: Katherine
Date: 2001-09-09 05:09
I just have to say that the responses I read here all good and helpful, but there's absolutely no need to bash what other people say, they're only trying to help. If you disagree, that's fine, but deal with it for god's sake, don't make a scene swearing and stuff, that's pathetic. You know who I'm talking to. And I have tried the buffet b-12 and they're quite good for plastic clarinets, though are considered "student" models. I don't believe I've ever seen a clarinet classified as an intermediate instrument that's plastic, but plastic clarinets can play decently if you get a good one, even though it might take some searching. Also, you'd want to make sure it's adjusted right if you buy it used. good luck!
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Author: jenna
Date: 2001-09-09 05:38
I second the Legere reeds notion! However, I can't find Legere around where I live. I use Fibracells instead, and they work well, too. Especially in marching band when a lot of factors play on the reed itself. Synthetic reeds are consistent, can be played a little dry, and seem to be a lot harder to break, among other favorable/necessary marching band qualities. =)
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-09-09 11:10
If I was playing a plastic Yamaha, WELL ADJUSTED, my audience would probably not notice the difference.
Contrary to some above statements you cannot compare makes by playing them unless the instrumets being compared are in an excellent state of adjustment. That is rare.
The plastic Yamaha, at least the ones we get here from Japan, are made to a very high standard, including undercutting of tone holes and screwed-in (not moulded) posts. They are esy to play, come with an 'acceptable' mouthpiece, and have excellent intonation. What more are we asking for?
I am not too familiar with Selmer Cl-300. Is it made to these standards.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-09-09 11:48
Put a high quality mouthpiece on a good plastic student clarinet (i.e. Leblanc, Buffet, Selmer, or Yamaha) and be sure the instrument is in good repair and properly adjusted.
As far as I know, just as others have stated, there are no intermediate horns made in plastic. You would have to jump up to a pro horn to get one. There is the Buffet Greenline (a sawdust filled epoxy composite) and I believe Howarth makes one of PVC. Howarth's are very uncommon in this country.
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Author: KenAbbott
Date: 2001-09-09 12:28
There *are* plastic intermediate horns out there, but you have to look. I own a Conn 19/7 (almost a FB) from midcentury. This horn was probably designed for outdoor use. Perhaps a (carefuly selected) metal horn should be considered.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-09-09 13:09
KenAbbott wrote:
>
> There *are* plastic intermediate horns out there, but you
> have to look. I own a Conn 19/7 (almost a FB) from
> midcentury. This horn was probably designed for outdoor use.
> Perhaps a (carefuly selected) metal horn should be
> considered.
Most of us were thinking in the new category. It can be difficult to track down older instruments that are no longer produced and be sure of the grade and quality of the instrument.
Although Conn made great saxes, their clarinets were not up to the same caliber. In my opinion (and others may disagree), a Conn intermediate is no better horn than a beginner grade from our current big four. Conn's pro horns were no better than the intermediate ones made by our current big four.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-09-09 13:11
Another possibility to look at, if one wants to go the older used horn route are the instruments made of hard rubber. There were some very good quality ones made in this material. Again the problem is assessing the grade and quality.
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Author: Bob Arney
Date: 2001-09-09 19:21
Jenna--Legere reeds are available from suppliers on line by mail. That's how I got mine for both my Bb and my Bass.Bob A
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Author: Fred
Date: 2001-09-09 22:42
The Vito V40 definitely deserves a look as an intermediate plastic horn. It has a nice brushed finished (doesn't look like a cheap shiney beginner model), undercut tone holes, and feels really good in the hands. Not rumor . . . got one. It's not a common horn . . . but they do show up once in a while.
I would advise, however, to try to pick one up used - even if you have to put a little money into getting it fixed up (the tenon corks are trash.) They can be pretty pricey new, but intermediate horns command little premium over beginner horns on the used market . . . especially on ebay and at pawn shops.
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Author: IHL
Date: 2001-09-10 06:32
are there any elements (like weather) that plastic clarinets are vulnerable to, like wooden ones are vulnerable to extremes of tempurature, humidity, etc?
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Author: C. Hogue
Date: 2001-09-10 14:31
IHL --
Rubber (not plastic) horns tend to turn blackish green due to sulfur emissions in the air. But so do hard rubber mouthpieces. It doesn't affect play, just looks. I don't know if plastic horns eventually oxidize due from the sun's ultraviolet light or not. I've had one for 30+ years and though it has some surface scratching, it's not oxidized.
The one bad thing is -- don't break a tenon on a plastic horn. I have no idea if it can be repaired or is worth the cost of a repair. My husband recently knocked a chunk out of the L.J. tenon on my old student clarinet. Since the horn can still be put together and still plays OK, I'm not getting it fixed.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2001-09-10 20:22
Plastic tenons can be repaired (replaced). The process is the same as for wood ones. The last time I checked, the cost was about $60 - $70.
jnk
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Author: ron b
Date: 2001-09-10 23:39
I've been pretty successful repairing plastic tenons. It's a lot easier if you have the broken piece(s). Clean the surface(s) first. Black epoxy (or clear... or any color for that matter), the hardware store kind, has worked well for me on three (so far) broken tenons and a couple of bad bell and tone hole chips. You fill in, scrape off, then sand smooth and polish. Pretty neat. Ferree's offers Jet Magic which is advertised as a good product for building up where there are missing pieces or severe gouges. I haven't tried it yet. ABS plastic glue is supposed to be very good for gluing in new sockets and tone holes. It might be good for putting pieces back together.
- ron b -
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Author: David Spiegelthal
Date: 2001-09-11 15:57
A true funny story: When I was in 5th grade, I inherited my older brother's Vito plastic clarinet when he quit playing. A few months after starting to learn to play it, I accidentally dropped the clarinet and it broke at the tenon. Afraid to tell my parents about the disaster, I glued the tenon back together with some epoxy I 'borrowed' from my Mom's tool drawer. I played on that "professionally repaired" instrument for the next three years (treating it very carefully!) until my folks upgraded me to a better instrument. But they never found out about the broken clarinet, and that's how I got my start in instrument repair. By the way, epoxy generally is not the best glue to use on plastic --- I must have gotten very lucky!
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Author: Casey
Date: 2001-09-11 18:59
i wouldnt know, i dont like plastic! Try an E-11 it is by Buffet and it is wood. It is a great intermediate clarinet i use it myself! Although i really want a R-13 but i am getting there!
Casey
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