 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-27 19:55
looks like a B-12 case. I emailed with a number of questions, will report back anything I hear. mw
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2001-08-27 21:41
This is all based on hearsay but I believe they cost around $100 more than a standard B12 when Buffet was making them and were reputed to have somewhat better intonation. Giora Feidmann is reputed to play one on occasion. This guy knows what he has. When I first learned about them, I tried to find one but they had been out of production for a couple of years. I've been looking ever since. (But I'm not inclined to pay what he wants so I probably won't get one unless I get lucky at a pawnshop.) Almost as soon as Buffet stopped manufacturing them, they became desirable collector's items. This is only the second one I've seen on eBay in about three years. As I recall, the other one started quite a bit lower but drew alot of bids and finally sold for several hundred dollars. If he does reasonably well with it, perhaps it will bring some others out of the closet. Too bad his opening bid isn't in deutschmarks.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Josh
Date: 2001-08-28 00:35
I remember when I was younger, I would have KILLED for one of these...I begged my mother for one for ages...*sigh*....If only I hadn't just bought that damn piccolo...:) SOMEone's gonna be a lucky kid
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2001-08-28 00:41
I still have to make the statement "I don't get it!"........
It is a B-12, after all. Go for it...I'll sit back and watch the bidding.
John
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-28 01:19
John it is a UNIQUE clarinet. Certainly, no one has mentioned or made anything of QUALITY out of this. Nevertheless, there is a UNIQUENESS to the material ... see-thru LUCITE. The copper keywork adds a COLOR we haven't see before, except on gold-plated keywork. I was MOST attracted by the fact that we can see-through to the CORK on the Tenons's ...
Personally, I don't think that a clarinet like this is worth much more than it's original cost, while other collectors might feel very different. BUT, let's remember that Vegetarian's don't see the point at all of eating a BIG JUICY STEAK ... Beauty, after all, is in the eye of the beholder.
Actually, I was _very happy_ to run across this Clarinet on eBay auction. While I had heard about this Lucite Buffet Replica Clarinet, I never had true confirmation of it's existence ... not having seen tha eBay Auction that Jack K. referred to.
Best,
mw
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2001-08-28 02:28
Dear mw, there was a twin on EBay about six months ago - I guess in mint shape that was posted on the BB as an oddity. I thought just for the fun of it that I would bid - yea right I really need another clarinet especially a B12. I had these visions of using it on certain gigs - not the serious ones - for showmanship (of which I need much help). Anyway, have a very good "snipe" program at hand because it jumped from about $300.00 to the selling prince of $799.95 in the last two seconds of bidding - probably a collector.
The Doctor
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2001-08-28 02:42
Is that plastic or glass or something else? It's a very intriguing model, but glass would be dangerous for clarinets (What if it fell over and broke?) Clear plastic seems more reasonable.
If it had a fiberglass key mechanism, which I assume owuld be imprctical if not impossible, from a distance you wouldn't be able to see what they were playing until the inside fogged up from your breath. At least this would make it easier to see where you need to swab! Of course, whoever the lucky bidder is probably won't play it but just have it for display...
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-08-28 03:10
My old piano teacher (correctly read both ways ...) had a clear Oehler system clarinet from Germany hanging on the wall from the 1940s. I don't remember the brand, but it was playable (I tried it out - at that time I didn't know what the Oehler system was and had a heck of a time figuring out the keywork).
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Author: willie
Date: 2001-08-28 03:33
Didn't they make a few Vitos like that too for display? I've always wanted to rig one of those micro bulbs in each section, rigged to come on when played. It'd make a great jazz horn for dark stages.
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-28 03:44
Omar --- I have no interest in this clarinet at the opening price or a higher price (I though I made that clear in my post above, sorry). As I said --- for the original cost of $200 - $250 or whatever --- it would be a nice addition to a collection, any more than that is too much IMO. Again, I thought there was an educational benefit to introducing the photo in this Thread. Nothing more, mw
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2001-08-28 09:30
Dear mw, you are right that this is a very interesting clarinet and one not seen often. I guess rather than a specific warning to you it should have been a general warning to BB readers that the current price, and what a collector might pay for it are disparate. I do love your EBay posts.
The Doctor
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Author: Werner
Date: 2001-08-28 11:10
About two years ago a kraftsman from Idar-Oberstein / Germany buyed a
student Buffet, disassembled the keys, reproduced the body out of
rock crystal, assembled the keys (after he goldplated them) on that
new body, had it repaddet and tuned. It was playable, around 100000 DM
worth - it's very likely standing now on the desk of a rich sheikh ..
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-28 17:27
100,000 Deutsche Marks is presently about US$46,500 give or take .... are you sure it was THAT much? mw
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-08-28 18:06
There's an identical twin of the instrument in the Metropolitan Museum in New York. It's stunning. It's definitely a B-12, with the standard keywork. As I recall, the keys are closer to copper than gold colored, but if it's copper, there would have to be a lacquer coating or something similar to prevent tarnishing. Perhaps it's anodized to a copper color.
The body material of plastic clarinets starts out clear. Carbon black is added to it, or other colors in the case of the plastic Vitos and the Chinese CSOs (Clarinet Shaped Objects) on eBay.
Giora Feidman plays on a crystal mouthpiece, so it would be a completely "clear" setup.
I want it, I want it, I want it. But not at that price. Now if Buffet would leave the wood dust out of the Greenline and make a professional level Clearline.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Werner
Date: 2001-08-28 20:38
mw wrote:
>100,000 Deutsche Marks is presently about US$46,500 give or
>take .... are you sure it was THAT much? mw
No, it could have been 150,000 or 50,000 DM .. these things don't have price-tags.
They wrote in the newspaper something like ' .. the price of a upper-class car .. '
The really interesting thing about this piece of art isn't the price anyway.
Producing a clarinet out of a gem like rock crystal is extremely difficult.
This clarinet is the stunning masterpiece of an artist.
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-28 21:55
Ken, I only mentioned gold because of _COLOR_ (not as a comparison to the metal or material). That is, I (do) think the Copper Keywork is quite STUNNING, as you say.
Werner, everything has a limit in trems of value in this world. 150,000 DM? The "Shiekhs" are stereotyped from the 1950's ... today's "Sheikhs" are very smart fellows & have the BEST of advisors. Besides an Andy Warhol Clarinet would, no doubt, bring more ...
best,
mw
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Author: Werner
Date: 2001-08-28 22:20
mw wrote:
>The "Shiekhs" are stereotyped from the 1950's ... today's "Sheikhs" are very >smart fellows & have the BEST of advisors.
I don't know the stereotypes you are talking about.
The Sheiks I am talking about are very smart, and very very rich.
There aren't much people willing and able on this planet to pay for decoration pieces like this clarinet.
Who is Andy Warhol by the way ?
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Author: werner
Date: 2001-08-29 00:21
Thanks Sylvain. I knew his Monroe, but his clarinet .. I tried
Andy Warhol
Andy Warhol Clarinet
"Warhol Clarinet"
But the search engines don't help me.
I'll try it tomorrow again.
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Author: jim
Date: 2001-08-29 01:21
At least one maker offered a crystal boehm version in the 1930s. I believe that in this context, crystal means a glass with a very high lead content.
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Author: David Pegel
Date: 2001-08-29 01:52
Glass with high lead content? So not only is it fragile, but it's lined wth more content of a poisonous element? What's wrong with this picture?? Did they know about lead poisoning in the 1930's? Would it be enough lead to poison?
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Author: Ken
Date: 2001-08-29 01:53
I wonder if you could string some christmas lights through it and stick it on top of a grand piano for maximum effect..."I wish my brother Georrrgggeee was here" hehe
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Author: Bob Arney
Date: 2001-08-29 03:10
If I recall (it's been a while for my tired brain) the Dupont Chemical Exposition in the World's Fair in California (about 193?) featured one. I was there with the "Sons of the American Legion Band" and I remember standing and staring at it for quite a while.
Bob A
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Author: Stephen Froehlich
Date: 2001-08-29 03:18
As for Andy Worhol - an actor - his film career was marked by several shorts and reached its pinnacle with an appearance on "The Love Boat" - but we won't go there.
Lead does not leach out of lead crystal or glass at all. It is commonly used today for fine glasswear with the FDA's the FTC's and OHSA's full approval. However, lead glass is very heavy. If you think your right thumb hurts now, imagine playing one of those.
The lucite Buffet is very beautiful. I would like to, just for effect, send a beginner off to school with one of those the first day of band, get the angry call from the director saying that it wasn't on the approved list, and then say - Its a Buffet B-12, isn't that on your list? What? No, ma'am, you didn't specify color anywhere? Are you going to make me return this? The next day, of course, the 6th grader would show up with my old Yahama.
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-29 04:20
Andy WARHOL, an artist of legendary dimensions. As the folks at Christie's would say ... "it's not what it is, it's _WHO_ owned it!"
Werner, by WARHOL CLARINET, I was referring to a make-believe-item which would attract large sums at an auction house because it had been played by a famous person. Some of these Auctions are very private or limited as to attendance --- belongings of famous people attract large sums. The mixture brings the best out of the BIG pocketbooks. Thus, my joke. Sorry to confuse.
best,
mw
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-29 05:55
Ken, I think one of these "ceealls" would be great for Klezmer. mw
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Author: Werner
Date: 2001-08-29 09:48
mw wrote:
>Thus, my joke.
A good one. Thanks for clarifying.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-08-29 13:22
David: Lucite is a trade name for acrylic (Perspex/Pexiglass?)
This is a reasonably hard-surfaced plastic, but when the surface is covered with minute scratches (with use) it will look bad indeed.
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Author: IHL
Date: 2001-08-30 09:12
why are these such valuable collectors items? couldn't *any* company just make one like it?
I read about a glass flute once (may have been on this BB but I'm not sure).
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-08-30 12:40
a limited number of the lucite clarinets were made. products are protected by patents from infringement. only buffet can make them & put the buffet logo on them. mw
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Author: IHL
Date: 2001-09-01 06:25
Ah, well I guess that makes sense then. Why did Buffet stop making these?
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-09-01 16:07
I think somebody said these were for some special occasion.
Practicality? I have no 1st hand experience. I have spoke to several Clarinetists who have played one, and another who owns one. What I hear is that they surprisingly don't sound that bad. Decent sound I am told ... I don't know what it means.
The German man selling the 1 on eBay bought it in France, has played it for family gatherings at home in Germany, and has a reserve of US$1,550.
best,
mw
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