 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: 2E
Date: 2022-09-27 12:32
Hi everyone,
I've been leant 2 different Backun Q Series Bb clarinets to try. One is grenadilla, the other is cocobolo with gold posts.
They both play well, but both suffer from a horrendously flat throat Bb.
Has anyone else experienced this?
Thanks in advance!
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Author: m1964
Date: 2022-10-03 04:02
Looking at their price, I'd think they should be in tune, throat Bb included.
Did you try to contact Backun directly?
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Author: donald
Date: 2022-10-03 12:18
Better be careful writing stuff like that, Backun might threaten legal action (like they did to me). Such a ridiculous man.
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Author: m1964
Date: 2022-10-03 19:02
Well, I certainly hope that saying "they should be in tune" cannot offend anyone.
I was not the one who mentioned "horrendously flat throat Bb".
My point is that they are certainly not cheap to buy, so one can expect some initial quality both in tone and tuning.
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Author: Hunter_100
Date: 2022-10-04 01:07
Could it be the adjustment screw on the A lifter has been loosened too much by someone before you got them? Is there debris in the relevant tone holes? Does Backun use blocking material on the keys to secure them during shipment? I know some bass clarinets ship like that and if you forget to remove one it will cause issues.
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2022-10-04 20:38
> Better be careful writing stuff like that, Backun might threaten legal action (like >they did to me). Such a ridiculous man.
Not surprised.
Steve Ocone
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2022-10-04 23:12
A point and a question:
Point: I think 2E is clearly reporting his opinion, which he is entitled to without fear of legal reprisal. Never did he say that all players or all Q series models have this problem.
I think in fairness to Mr. Backun though that, if I were in his shoes, I'd like people to say something akin to "my personal experience, on just two Backun clarinets I tried, YMMV, etc."
~~~~~~
This brings me to a point. Many of you know that the throat Bb on clarinets, at least the one played with the left hand pointer and thumb, rather than the one I prefer (when I have the luxury) where the left pointer presses the "A" lever and the right hand the side keys, possibly covering some holes the left hand for resonance/intonation is, well, not the best note of the clarinet. It's voicing and pitch often leave many players on many instruments wanting more, even after cleaning out venting pipes, etc.
I've been taught that part of these problems are attributable to the register key's double duty as a actuator of the throat Bb, and a register key. I've been taught that the register key's placement---like many keys on the clarinet--represents a compromise in tuning among similarly fingered notes.
I could have sworn at one point on this forum that I've run into discussions of Boehm clarinets that opened different vents when the register key was pressed, depending upon, I think, the position of other fingers: off the clarinet for a throat Bb, but on the instrument for, say, an E5 ![[E5]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/e5.gif) . Does anyone know of clarinets with such dedicated vents for register and throat Bb notes?
Post Edited (2022-10-04 23:17)
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Author: mddds
Date: 2022-10-05 11:29
i had the same problem.
only my throat Bb dropped significantly on my tuner (probably 30-40 cents).
the A clarinet was worse than the Bb.
tonight, i took off the speaker keys and cleaned the tonehole.
although they were not noticeably occluded, i removed alot of schmutz.
this solved the problem on the A clarinet.
the B clarinet improved about 70%. i might have to clean it out more thoroughly again or play with the adjustment screw.
i was amazed at how much the intonation was affected by a small amt of debris.
hope this helps.
p.s. i don't own Bakun clarinets.
-CK
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Author: donald
Date: 2022-10-05 23:00
SecondTry- yes, there were historic clarinets made with moving register vents in the 1920s/30s but these never caught on and are now mainly in museums/collections.
Rene Hagmann (sp?) has also customised at least 2 modern Boehm system clarinets that I've heard of with a "double register mechanism" (in addition to many horns with a mechanism similar to the SK mechanism- opening an extra vent to help throat Bb)
Take a look at...
< http://www.clarinetsdirect.biz/HagmannRC.html >
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2022-10-05 23:32
Some clarinets have throat Bb in tune (or close). Some models have less stuffy throat Bbs. And yes, it is never has a "great" sound.
Steve Ocone
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Author: m1964
Date: 2022-10-06 09:08
I tried once a Leblanc A clarinet that had a double-vent mechanism.
The Bb on that instrument sounded fantastic (compared to all the "regular" clarinets) but the mechanism had to be 100% regulated, with corks and adjustment screw(s), and felt slow to respond.
I did not like the response/feel of that mechanism (also did not like the overall sound) so did not buy the instrument.
Buffet, on the other hand, recently came out with the updated register tube that has a metal chimney outside (on the recent RC Prestige A clarinets).
The throat Bb is in tune and sounds closer to the throat A tone-wise. Not exactly the same, still a little stuffier but better than the same note on older similar level instruments (Festival, R13 Prestige).
I don't know if that feature is available only on RC prestige A clarinets or on the other models too.
The clarinet (RC Prestige in A) also has C/G# tone hole chimney.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2022-10-06 09:17
>> Buffet, on the other hand, recently came out with the updated register tube that has a metal chimney outside (on the recent RC Prestige A clarinets). <<
Do you just mean how the register tube sticks out more? Or something else?
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Author: Clariphone
Date: 2025-10-31 16:04
I have been told that the Backun Alpha and Q-series bass clarinets have the same keywork, which would make the Alpha a great alternative for not only the Q-series, but also for top-class Buffet, Selmer, Yamaha and other wooden bass clarinets. Did anyone carry out a side-by-side comparison of the Alpha and Q-series? If so, does wood justify the extra cost?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2025-10-31 17:34
You mean C#/G# bush - that's done on many Buffet A clarinets to better tune and stabilise a wonky C#/G# and give it better tonal substance as the C#/G# tonehole is too small and set higher up the joint from where it should ideally be because of where the middle tenon and socket are located. It's a common thing fitted to German/Oehler systems which is where Buffet got the idea from.
Bassoons and contrabassoons also tend to have a beefed up/longer C# tonehole on them to improve the quality and stability of that note.
The speaker tube extending further outside the clarinet is only done to make it less likely to getting your pullthrough stuck - it's still the same length as a regular A clarinet speaker tube (which is longer than the Bb counterparts) but fitted in such a way so there's far less intrusion in the bore and less risk of damage.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
Independent Woodwind Repairer
Single and Double Reed Specialist
Oboes, Clarinets and Saxes
NOT A MEMBER OF N.A.M.I.R.
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2025-10-31 17:36)
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Author: David H. Kinder
Date: 2025-10-31 20:28
Clariphone wrote:
> I have been told that the Backun Alpha and Q-series bass
> clarinets have the same keywork, which would make the Alpha a
> great alternative for not only the Q-series, but also for
> top-class Buffet, Selmer, Yamaha and other wooden bass
> clarinets. Did anyone carry out a side-by-side comparison of
> the Alpha and Q-series? If so, does wood justify the extra
> cost?
Michael Lowenstern mentions this, but not an exact side-by-side comparison. It's probably more of a budget consideration between wood and composite body material anyway.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3o4jFHQxsPQ
Ridenour AureA Bb clarinet
Ridenour Homage mouthpiece
Vandoren Optimum Silver ligature (plate 1)
Vandoren Traditional #4 reeds
ATG System, Cordier Reed Trimmer, and A.L.E. Reed Balancer
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Author: m1964
Date: 2025-10-31 20:41
Chris P wrote:
"You mean C#/G# bush - that's done on many Buffet A clarinets to better tune and stabilise a wonky C#/G# and give it better tonal substance as the C#/G# tonehole is too small and set higher up the joint from where it should ideally be because of where the middle tenon and socket are located. It's a common thing fitted to German/Oehler systems which is where Buffet got the idea from...
The speaker tube extending further outside the clarinet is only done to make it less likely to getting your pullthrough stuck - it's still the same length as a regular A clarinet speaker tube (which is longer than the Bb counterparts) but fitted in such a way so there's far less intrusion in the bore and less risk of damage."
Chris,
Thanks for explaining about the speaker/register tube- never occurred to me that it was done for convenience while swabbing the joint. However, on that instrument (RC Prestige in A), the throat Bb sounded noticeably clearer comparing to the RC Prestige in Bb and Festival in Bb, which both had a "regular" speaker/register tube.
Selmer have been using C#/G# tone hole bushings for a while too.
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Author: donald
Date: 2025-11-01 03:01
Incidentally, since making the posts above I had the chance to play test extensively both an Alpha and a Q bass clarinet. I found them to be amazing, to have many advantages over my 1935 Bass or the 1990s bass I frequently use, and did not encounter any problems with the tuning on throat Bb. I still prefer the tone of the older (wooden) instruments, but I couldn't say either Backun bass sounded "bad" either. Certainly a lot of thought and expertise has gone into making the bass play better.
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Author: m1964
Date: 2025-11-01 12:26
donald wrote:
> Incidentally, since making the posts above I had the chance to
> play test extensively both an Alpha and a Q bass clarinet. I
> found them to be amazing, to have many advantages over my 1935
> Bass or the 1990s bass I frequently use, and did not encounter
> any problems with the tuning on throat Bb. I still prefer the
> tone of the older (wooden) instruments, but I couldn't say
> either Backun bass sounded "bad" either. Certainly a lot of
> thought and expertise has gone into making the bass play
> better.
Since the 1990s, there were many developments in both Computer-Aided Design and machinery allowing to produce better instruments with more consistent quality, and, of course, the wind instruments production has changed a lot since 1935.
Still, when I look at pre-war Buffet, Selmer, Loree clarinets, I am just amazed how nice those instruments are. The workmanship of those old clarinets is as good (or better) than of some current instruments.
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