The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: MarkS
Date: 2024-12-28 00:41
I am playing a transcription for clarinet duo of the Beethoven Gassenhauer Trio. Toward the end of the first movement, there is a sequence of four measures of sixteenth notes to be played at 88 bpm (or faster). The first two measures alternate clarion C-D-C#-D, while the remaining two measures alternate clarion C-E-D#-E. In each of these cases, would you play all the pinky notes all on one side (presumably the right hand), or would you consider alternating sides?
If you would consider alternating sides, how is your decision tempo dependent?
Mark
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Author: m1964
Date: 2024-12-28 01:10
MarkS wrote:
> I am playing a transcription for clarinet duo of the Beethoven
> Gassenhauer Trio. Toward the end of the first movement, there
> is a sequence of four measures of sixteenth notes to be played
> at 88 bpm (or faster). The first two measures alternate clarion
> C-D-C#-D, while the remaining two measures alternate clarion
> C-E-D#-E. In each of these cases, would you play all the pinky
> notes all on one side (presumably the right hand), or would you
> consider alternating sides?
>
> If you would consider alternating sides, how is your decision
> tempo dependent?
>
> Mark
I would alternate pinkies on C-D-C#-D- I understand you are talking about "long" C and D.
On C-E-D#-E I would use Rt. Pinky.
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Author: Tom H
Date: 2024-12-28 02:37
I'd do both using RH pinkies only-- based on it's easier to coordinate fingers on one hand rather than two. But either way is not difficult. I always recommend practicing stuff like this both ways (or more ways if an option for more).
The Most Advanced Clarinet Book--
tomheimer.ampbk.com/ Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001315, Musicnotes product no. MB0000649.
Boreal Ballad for unaccompanied clarinet-Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001314.
Musicnotes product no. MNO287475
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Author: symphony1010
Date: 2024-12-28 18:04
Strangely, this vital topic is omitted from so many tutor books and guides. Even Paul Harris' recent and otherwise comprehensive book says nothing which surprised me greatly.
Some choices of L.H. or R.H. are personal but I have students arrive who have grown up playing L.H. B in a G major arpeggio or L.H. C in an F major arpeggio.
They find it har to change once the choice has become instinctive. They really hit the buffers once arpeggio roulades are required in some orchestral work and only see the need to change when they can't keep up with players alongside them.
The youngest players need strong direction in this matter in my opinion and another factor is starting before hand size is large enough to really control the little fingers and reach the keys comfortably.
It's so common in my experience that it's one of the main reasons I would cease to teach - I have sometimes found it impossible to correct this and it pains me to hear poor movement through these areas of the instrument.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2024-12-28 19:20
symphony1010 wrote:
> The youngest players need strong direction in this matter in my
> opinion and another factor is starting before hand size is
> large enough to really control the little fingers and reach the
> keys comfortably.
>
I've also seen the result when a student, whose hands were too small when they started, was taught to use LH F/C all the time because it's within easier reach than the RH key. It's a hard habit to break, and the linkage from the LH F/C key is less efficient than the RH key.
Karl
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Author: symphony1010
Date: 2024-12-28 19:40
(I've also seen the result when a student, whose hands were too small when they started, was taught to use LH F/C all the time because it's within easier reach than the RH key. It's a hard habit to break, and the linkage from the LH F/C key is less efficient than the RH key.)
Glad it's not just me!
Post Edited (2024-12-28 19:41)
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Author: Fuzzy
Date: 2024-12-28 20:35
I didn't receive lessons until the second half of my high school years. As a result - I didn't even know about alternate fingerings (sure, I saw them in the books, but why bother when they didn't seem any better than the "normal fingerings?" Right? WRONG!)
Sometimes success (when compared to those around you) only strengthens bad habits!
Once I started lessons, I understood how wrong I had been. It took years for me to feel as comfortable using secondary fingerings as equals to the "normal" fingerings. Old habits die hard!
Fuzzy
;^)>>>
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2024-12-28 21:24
I would recommend playing this with the pinky configuration that is most comfortable to you.
I would recommend practicing stuff like this with all possible pinky configurations so as to develop the muscle memory to handle such variations for times when using the other pinky, or varying pinkies proves easier or necessary.
In my "next life" I want to write an etude book, in some ways not different from Tom's excellent one referenced above, that offers such varied and random musical phrasing that it has limited ability to be memorized, forcing the player to maximize concentration, only mine would be focused on a player learning to recognize, by reading ahead a note or two, and/or recognizing patterns, when notes must be taken with a particular fingering in order to not "get stuck."
For example, when the notes , and appear in sequence, most of us know that taking that with the chromatic key will lead us to far more difficulty in playing the following than taking the with the middle finger.
Such a book would explore when sliding off, for example, the / lever on to the / lever is necessary (or advised even if in possession of a clarinet with a left pinky / lever, when to use/not use chromatic fingerings and when, for example to use alternate fingerings of to be able to take the note that follows with greater ease.
It would cover situations where mid note pinky swaps are necessary, and when forked fingers are often easier (or advised against), and useful fingering alternatives in the 6th octave range to go from one note to the another or gliss between them.
Post Edited (2024-12-29 00:15)
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Author: symphony1010
Date: 2024-12-28 22:30
I think some very specific studies for good routes through typical passages would be helpful. The Jeanjean Vade-mecum does do this but it is so poorly edited and presented that I rarely use it. The reader is expected to have a chart as a key to the fingering requirements and the habit of not including accidentals in other octaves is espoused in material towards the end of the book. It COULD be so much better laid out if only an editor was engaged to sort it out!
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Author: Tom H
Date: 2024-12-28 23:28
kdk-- I agree and can't recall teaching LH pinkies to 6th grade beginners because of their reach/smaller hands. Perhaps if you had younger beginners than that it would be necessary?
SecondTry-- Your philosophy of alternate fingering use is a major point in my book. I practice every possible fingering-- sliding, etc. in situations where the other choice is what I'd use when performing.
The Most Advanced Clarinet Book--
tomheimer.ampbk.com/ Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001315, Musicnotes product no. MB0000649.
Boreal Ballad for unaccompanied clarinet-Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001314.
Musicnotes product no. MNO287475
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2024-12-29 00:43
Tom:
Yes, both expressly covered in their own sections, and reinforced in exercises whose primary focus may be something else but still trains the proper choice of alternate fingerings, your book is an excellent one.
For example, and simply one of hundreds, in the first measure of Tom's "Seconds and Thirds exercises" in the book, Tom throws at us a , , and , I am sure by design, which the experienced clarinetist knowns best requires the to be taken chromatically, so the can be taken chromatically, so the is easier to make without the presence of unwanted notes that can occur when moving the conventional way between the and with the pointer and thumb.
Maybe cheating, (lol) but I have all sorts of scribbled notation in its confines on what pinky to take a note with, if mid note pinky swaps are indicate, or chromatic or slide fingers required, to name but a few approaches best warranted by a passage.
About two years ago I put this on my golden era R13s https://www.clarinetworks.com/product/bolt-on-alternate-e-flat-key/ but practice as if I both have and don't have access to this key.
For those new to pinky swaps, envision a clarinet with no left / key and music that demands, for example these 4 notes to be played in succession:
, , and again. Well either that or note (but not both) will need you to swap pinkies mid-note to insure that the is taken with the left pinky to make the possible.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2024-12-29 03:42
Tom H wrote:
> kdk-- I agree and can't recall teaching LH pinkies to 6th grade
> beginners because of their reach/smaller hands. Perhaps if you
> had younger beginners than that it would be necessary?
>
The elementary schools in our area typically start students on band instruments in 4th grade (about 9-10 years old). Most of those kids can reach the RH keys. But there's one with smaller hands who can't. And for a number of reasons, good or not, their preference to play clarinet is honored on the ground that "he'll grow into it."
The ones I taught with LH F/C habits had actually started before they came to me for lessons, even when I taught at the elementary school level.
Karl
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Author: Tom H
Date: 2024-12-29 07:13
SecondTry-- Yes those mid pinky swaps-- interesting to see how fast one can do them.
kdk-- I started in 4th grade as well. Think it a common thing in the U.S (not here in Canada).
The Most Advanced Clarinet Book--
tomheimer.ampbk.com/ Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001315, Musicnotes product no. MB0000649.
Boreal Ballad for unaccompanied clarinet-Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001314.
Musicnotes product no. MNO287475
Post Edited (2024-12-29 07:16)
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