 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Maylana
Date: 2023-12-10 00:40
The middle C and B on the staff (On the break)always have this weird trilly squeak, especially when I play them solo. In the piece I'm playing right now the beginning is 6 Cs in a row and they always delay or squeak or just sound bad in general and I'm not sure why. I was having problems with squeaking but I moved up to a 3 Vandoren reed and now it's better except for the b and c. I think I might be blowing too much but when I try and do it less it doesn't come out. I get sort of tense when I play them and I'm not sure how to stop doing that. I'm not sure if I am doing it wrong. It's also not my clarinet's fault.
Also, when I play that one high note where it is just the octave key and my thumb and then take both off instead of going down to an F it goes up. Not to a squeak just a higher note. Does anyone know why?
I would call myself a beginning-intermediate, maybe intermediate at clarinet and I have a student's clarinet(Vito I believe) I can play all the notes on my fingering chart, which goes up to 3 or 4 lines above the staff. High notes are easier for me to play than low notes, and I have a problem with my finger liking to stray pretty far away from my keys, but I'm not sure how to fix it.
Post Edited (2023-12-10 00:53)
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-12-10 01:07
In this bit:
"Also, when I play that one high note where it is just the octave key and my thumb and then take both off instead of going down to an F it goes up. Not to a squeak just a higher note. Does anyone know why?"
It is possible that you are going up from the C to a D? Paul Aviles explained to me that it's possible to go from high C to an open D, because you can get that high open D just by overblowing with no fingers on at all.
I don't know about the rest but I'm beginning-intermediate intermediate too (playing five years and learning grade 4). I find it really interesting that you find high notes easier than low ones because I'm the opposite. It seems like that must mean something.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2023-12-10 02:03
Maylana wrote:
> The middle C and B on the staff (On the break)always have this
> weird trilly squeak, especially when I play them solo. [snip] I think I might
> be blowing too much but when I
> try and do it less it doesn't come out. I get sort of tense
> when I play them and I'm not sure how to stop doing that. I'm
> not sure if I am doing it wrong. It's also not my clarinet's
> fault.
>
> Also, when I play that one high note where it is just the
> octave key and my thumb and then take both off instead of going
> down to an F it goes up. Not to a squeak just a higher note.
> Does anyone know why?
>
> and I have a problem with my
> finger liking to stray pretty far away from my keys, but I'm
> not sure how to fix it.
That's a lot. You realize, I hope, that your questions are like my phoning a car mechanic who has never met me nor seen my car and asking why it makes a ticking noise when I go from 20 to 30 MPH and why it takes a long time to start and what makes it so bumpy to drive in? It would be much easier for the mechanic to have my car in his shop to diagnose any of that. You really should try to have someone who plays clarinet listen and see if he or she can help with this.
Let's take the easiest one first. High C (C6 - thumb and register key). When you open the thumb hole and close the register the note you should get is a throat G(4), not an F (unless you're talking about concert pitch). What you're getting is the twelfth above G (concert F), D (concert C). Inertia makes the air column tend to stay at the same harmonic given its 'druthers.
The "trilly squeak" sounds like something that might happen if you take a little too much reed into your mouth. Try backing the mouthpiece out of your mouth a little at a time and see if the squeak goes away.
I'll take your word that it isn't your clarinet making the problems, but I'm not sure how you know.
Fingers "straying from the keys" has to fixed by consciously practicing to keep your fingers rounded (flexed) and lifting them as much as you can straight up and down without letting the middle joint straighten. You need to practice the motion slowly at first and gradually speed up without allowing your fingers to straighten.
High notes easier than low notes may be too strong a reed, or it could also be that you're taking in too much reed.
Karl
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Author: m1964
Date: 2023-12-10 03:10
kdk wrote:
"... I'll take your word that it isn't your clarinet making the problems, but I'm not sure how you know..."
I've met a few decent amateur players who had no idea how to adjust the craw foot and also did not think their clarinets were leaking...
Nothing can replace a face-to-face lesson with a good teacher (IMO).
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Author: Maylana
Date: 2023-12-10 03:43
I quite enjoyed reading that and yes I do realize that. I took my clarinet to my section leader who I feel like just picked up his clarinet one day and played it perfectly, and after thinking about it, his advice was essentially just to be better, which isn't inherently that helpful.
You're right it is a G sorry.
I've heard of the throat keys, but don't actually know what it means...But I understand what you're saying. Is there any way to fix that?
I barely have any reed in my mouth as it is, my clarinet teacher always told me I needed to put more in my mouth.
You're right I really don't.
Thank you! I'll try to work on that.
I used to work with a teacher but she didn't really tell me anything(at least as I advanced a little), that I couldn't be told by my band director and I started feeling guilty for spending my parents' money on it.
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-12-10 04:25
Hi Maylana,
Is it possible that you could take your clarinet to a good technician to have it checked over? That might get you some more clues about what is going on.
If that's difficult then you could leak check it yourself - you can google for "leak check clarinet" if you have not done it before.
Would it be okay to ask how old you are? It sounds as though you may be a teenager. A lot of our new players are in their 40s so it would be handy to know where you are age-wise.
I know what you mean about the difficulty of finding a teacher who will talk about technical issues. I had a teacher who taught me wonderful things about musicality, but for technical stuff I had to go to the clarinet shop.
Jennifer
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Author: kdk
Date: 2023-12-10 22:12
Maylana wrote:
> I quite enjoyed reading that and yes I do realize that. I took
> my clarinet to my section leader who I feel like just picked up
> his clarinet one day and played it perfectly, and after
> thinking about it, his advice was essentially just to be
> better, which isn't inherently that helpful.
Well, if he could play it without the same problems you're having, it does tend to eliminate anything drastically wrong with the instrument.
>
> I've heard of the throat keys, but don't actually know what it
> means...But I understand what you're saying. Is there any way
> to fix that?
The "throat notes" are the ones at the top of the instrument - F# (or maybe even F through Bb - which use the shortest tube and have the least amount of resonance. The most common way, if the pitch won't drop from high to low by just releasing the register key, is to touch the reed with your tongue very lightly, not hard enough to produce a clear articulation, but enough to break the reed's motion and get it and the air column to reset to the lower pitch (in this case the fundamental).
>
> I barely have any reed in my mouth as it is, my clarinet
> teacher always told me I needed to put more in my mouth.
That could maybe cause the same effect if your lower lip is too far forward and not over your teeth. Finding the right spot on the reed to produce lip contact can be a matter of experimentation. Try moving the mouthpiece to different amounts and see what the result is. If you can find a spot that gets better results, then the best thing may be to get used to that spot, even if it doesn't feel right at first.
> You're right I really don't.
"You really don't" what? I've missed the connection.
>
> I used to work with a teacher but she didn't really tell me
> anything(at least as I advanced a little), that I couldn't be
> told by my band director and I started feeling guilty for
> spending my parents' money on it.
If you take formal lessons, it should be with a teacher who plays clarinet at a proficient level. It sounds like your clarinet teacher may have been a band director in private teacher's clothing. Maybe clarinet just wasn't her strength. That isn't to denigrate band directors, but most were trained on one instrument and then "had to" learn the others as a requirement for a teaching certificate. Many are very good musicians and very effective on their main instrument, but aren't strong technicians on the others. A good clarinet teacher would be able to tell you a great deal.
Good luck,
Karl
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Author: Maylana
Date: 2023-12-10 22:29
Hi, yes, I'm a teen. Which unfortunately means I don't have any way to get a professional look at it. And means I have a lack of real good clarinet teachers within my "Price range" (Or lack of money in general)
I'll look it up.
Sorry, I don't know that it isn't my clarinet, but since there isn't much I can do if there is, I try to focus on what I can do better.
Oh. Learning new things. Thanks for the advice about the throat keys, I'll try it out.
I will experiment.
That's true I know her primary instrument was flute and by the end she didn't actually play clarinet anymore and couldn't actually get above the break, so it was good for rhythm but not much else.
Thanks y'all! I've never actually posted something that I've gotten actual responses to!
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-12-11 00:42
Hi Maylana,
Thanks for explaining your circumstances. I started in a very similar place (no funds, no tech, no lessons, winging it with optimism).
It sounds to me as though one of the keys at the top of your clarinet is not sealing properly, so that when it is meant to be closed it is actually fractionally open.
For example if the register key is slightly open all the time, then it could be quite hard for you to play below the break.
If you could leak test, as suggested by SecondTry, that would be great.
You could also ask a family member to lend you a spare hand and try playing while your helper holds the register key and the A and G# keys firmly shut, just to see if that helps a bit. You might need them to hold the side lever keys shut too, which could need quite a lot of hands.
If that helps, then you really probably need to ask for help from your family to get your clarinet posted away to someone who will change the pads so that the instrument seals really well. You would probably find that your playing is magically transformed and that things get really a lot easier if you could get that done.
If you do try to leak test, let us know what you find. It might be something that could be fairly easily fixed.
Good luck!
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Author: Selmer Buff
Date: 2023-12-11 02:26
Checking pads with cigarette paper, or equivalent, sometimes reveals a leak that plug and blow (suck) does not. When a note is played, the resonance sets up a standing wave within the clarinet tube. The wave has higher and lower pressure nodes along its path. Thus, different notes will push on different pads and they can leak at different times.
I have a LeBlanc that did this. Tech said it didn't leak, but as I played it I could tell that it did leak. The side 'trill keys' were not perfect. I found this by pushing hard on the pad/key cup as I played the squeaking note.
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-12-11 02:56
With me, as soon as my clarinet starts squeaking, I know there is a leak. I had forgotten that with my first clarinet, but I used to get constant squeaks with the lowest notes.
It was really frustrating, and I ended up gripping the keys like a vice to try to make them seal, which is not the golden road to swift, musical playing.
The hard part after that is finding they money to get it repaired and that is a whole other thing.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2023-12-11 04:07
Selmer Buff wrote:
> I have a LeBlanc that did this. Tech said it didn't leak, but
> as I played it I could tell that it did leak. The side 'trill
> keys' were not perfect. I found this by pushing hard on the
> pad/key cup as I played the squeaking note.
I'm curious - how did the tech check for leaks?
Karl
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Author: senexclarinetta
Date: 2023-12-11 05:18
It's hard to say without seeing you, but it sounds like a leak. I know you say you can't afford or find a tech, but do you have a friend or teacher who can play it and see if it's you or the clarinet?
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Author: donald
Date: 2023-12-11 12:56
I'd say a crucial step would be for you to play another instrument and see if the problem was duplicated. If you don't know anyone who plays clarinet, you MAY be able to persuade a nearby music store to let you try a (new) instrument there....
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Author: Maylana
Date: 2023-12-11 18:57
I don't really have anyone who could play my clarinet(or more accurately that cares enough to actually think about whatever problems I'm having)
But my school does rent clarinets, and I have access to like 5 clarinets some of which are way better than mine so I can try and play those at school tomorrow and see what happens.
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-12-11 19:19
It might be worth asking your music teacher at school how he gets the school clarinets repaired. It might be that there is someone in your town who does this work and they might be able to fix your difficult quite cheaply. It might be that you just need two or three pads replaced.
I know what you mean about how it is diffcult to get help with these things as a teenager. I learned to play the violin aged 15 by watching videos recordings of orchestras on playback. I just looked really closely at the screen when they did close-up shots of the violin players. Sometimes learning music takes really a lot of strategy just to get access to information on how to do it.
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Author: Maylana
Date: 2023-12-17 02:22
Sorry, I wasn't able to try a different clarinet until yesterday. It sounded generally the same as mine, but this week I've been working on not like, being scared of the cs, if that makes sense, and it's still not perfect but it didn't squeak at all at my last rehearsal, so I suppose it's getting better, and I'm assuming it's going to continue getting better. I also learned I'm bad at breathing, which when I focus on that sounds better as well.
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-12-17 14:22
Hi Maylana,
That's great that you are thinking it through systematically like that and trying things. That is a great way to work out what is going on.
I also find that learning to breathe right is a huge learning curve with learning the clarinet. I find that doing long tones is very helpful because it lets me think about my breathing while not having to think about fingers.
I have had to work very carefully to learn how to breathe with my diaphgram instead of lifting my shoulders when I breathe. I know that when I am having to do very fast fingering it is very easy to lose control of the breathing.
If you would like to keep experimenting and telling us what you find, I would be very interested to hear about your discoveries.
Jennifer
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Author: Maylana
Date: 2024-02-25 03:30
Update:) Incase y'all wanted to know.
My squeaking has almost all but gone away, I think I was just overthinking it. I'm still working on my breathing, and I sort of made this like masking tape cage thing for my pinkies, so they can't go far from the clarinet, so we'll see if that works cause nothing else i've really tried has.
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The Clarinet Pages
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