 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: John Peacock
Date: 2018-02-05 18:10
Attachment: denman1.jpg (157k)
Attachment: denman2.jpg (218k)
Attachment: denman3.jpg (331k)
Attachment: denman4.jpg (293k)
I've long been an admirer of John Denman's performance of the Finzi concerto, and recently I came across some pictures on YouTube of the 1977 sessions where this was recorded. I was intrigued to see he was playing an instrument like nothing I have seen before, and I wonder if anyone knows what it was? I attach two stills from the 1977 Finzi, plus a couple that google turned up of him playing the same instrument in 1985.
Selected features:
* "waisted" tuning barrel
* mechanism above the throat A key, presumably for better Bb
* extra LH Ab/Eb key (rare in those days)
* flat tenon rings
* large metallic badge on the bell
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2018-02-06 02:02
Likewise John - I love that LP of the Finzi, arguably still the best version of this work.
I heard John perform at the Internation Clarinet Society meeting when it was held in London August 1984.
He was playing lighter jazz/swing items on this occasion but using this exact clarinet, the barrel was so unusual one could spot it a mile off.
It looked so unusual that I spoke with him about it in the bar afterwards, but sadly after all these years (and my advancing years!) the details are now murky.
However I do remember it dated from quite early, first half of the 20th century.
The London Sax Quartet were also playing that day so I'd bet that Paul Harvey must know the provenance of this clarinet.
Kicking myself that I didn't make notes back then.
I also didn't realise till then that he had started his playing life in my old band, The Life Guards. Colin Davis had also graced the clarinet section, but both had left a few years before I joined.
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Author: donald
Date: 2018-02-06 06:37
There is an interview with JD in The Clarinet where he describes his clarinet (early 20thC as noted above). Join the ICA and you will have online access to the magazine /index etc. I recall the interview was sometime in the early 1980s
Dn
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Author: donald
Date: 2018-02-08 13:30
The Clarinet, Volume 4 number 3- John Denman interviewed by James Gillespie, but that's not where he talks about his clarinet????? I KNOW I read about this in The Clarinet, must have been another article?????
Post Edited (2018-02-08 14:59)
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Author: John Peacock
Date: 2018-02-10 00:51
Some further internet digging eventually yielded a Facebook page that unlocked this mystery:
https://www.facebook.com/John-Denman-1933-2001-211771595539318
There, you can find some great photos of Denman's Bb (attached). It was restored by Stephen Butler, who was kind enough to confirm that the instrument was made by Albert, but that the tuning barrel and the Bb mechanism were made by the late Edward (Ted) Planas. A unique instrument; I hope it's being played.
In the course of this investigation, I've been able to use eBay to recover a pile of Denman recordings that are otherwise no longer available. It seems no-one plays in that traditional ultra-English way now (at least, not in the UK), but Denman's playing had great character, and it's been a pleasure to rediscover him.
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2018-02-10 01:37
Interesting research. Hasn't Lesley Schatzberger performed on a clarinet made by Albert? But was hers an Albert System instrument? E.J. Albert made some Boehm system instruments that Rossi says he used a a model for his large bore 15.0 mm clarinet. Was Denman's barrel part of the original Albert or an addition. I know that when he worked in Arizona, he was marketing his own brand of crystal mouthpiece in the U.S.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2018-02-10 01:59
Could they be by Martel? They look early 20th century (the keywork is delicate by later and current standards) besides the barrel which is a custom one. The bell looks like a Selmer BT/CT bell.
I haven't seen any Martels, but they were the make of clarinets the Louis Chas Draper models were based on.
Did he design and customise the extra keywork himself or was it done by Ted Planas, Geoffrey Acton or someone similar?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2018-02-10 02:10
Great story about him being in Denver, and going to a Music Store - he asked for a Vandoren #2.5 box, and the store clerk comes out with a box of #3's
says to him
"here, try this, all of the good players play these".......
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: donald
Date: 2018-02-10 03:14
There's other stories about John Denman, but because my sources are 3rd/4th hand I won't pass them on ;-)
When I'm next in at Ak Uni library I'll look through late 1970s/early 1980s Clarinet mags, there is DEFINITELY an informative article about this clarinet. The article I found the other night is an interview with him, but he doesn't talk about the clarinet. I KNOW he did so in another article etc.
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2024-02-01 21:08
I found a CD of John Denman in a charity shop the other day. It's a 'Carlton Classic'. The CD has the first and second Spohr concertos on it, together with the Spohr Danzi Variations and Weber Concertino. This isn't the famous version of the second concert, made in 1972, but another, with the Royal Philharmonic under Robert Bernhardt. The recordings were made on 21 August 1996k all in one day - so players had to earn their crust in those days too.
But a more curious point, related to the topic of this thread, is that the sleeve notes say, 'Clarinet by Yamaha'. The producer of the CD and author of the sleeve notes is Paula Fan, Denman's wife, so I'd assumed the description of the instrument is correct. There is a picture of Denman holding a clarinet. From what I can make out, it doesn't have the additional Bb mechanism or waisted barrel seen in the photos on this thread. Any ideas about this instrument?
From listening to the recordings, I would say he still has his sound, but the altissimo is a bit thinner/more pinched than on other recordings of his. I've never heard the first movement of the Spohr first concerto played so fast.
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Author: ruben
Date: 2024-02-02 00:26
I knew John Denman; a really unique artist. I think for the last 20 years or so of his life, he played a Yamaha. Before that, maybe he played Boosey and Hawkes 1010s like so many clarinetists of his generation. That said, he did fiddle with his gear; developed his own reed and mouthpiece. A superb reed, I might add. It's a pity they stopped making them.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: John Peacock
Date: 2024-02-02 13:32
Donald: yes, that set of 4 Spohr concertos was made when Denman was past his best, and the control just isn't there. But do have a listen to this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTBxCAShwh4
This is a much earlier recording of Spohr 2. It's claimed that this was the first time the piece had been placed on disc, so we owe Denman a debt for doing that. The vibrato of the English style of the period may still not appeal to you, but this is a well-executed example of the genre. This recording, and above all his version of the Finzi, should ensure that Denman's name is remembered.
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2024-02-02 16:00
John Peacock. That's definitely a version of Spohr 2 I'd recommend. A lot of style and individuality, which I don't think we find much of theses days. Very thoughtful transitions between sections of the music in terms of tempo changes and recognition of the underlying changes in harmony which Sphor used so masterfully. Bit 'seat of the pants' in the fast sectione as well, but there's a bit of that in many of his recordings.
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2024-02-04 12:35
Leslie Craven once told me with evident sadness , that there had existed a distinctive style of English playing which has now vanished. I didn't ( and still don't) know enough to understand what he was referring to . I think he described it as " looser". The subject came up after I suggested he write some stories about his life. He responded by inferring that restoring this old style of playing was higher on his list of dreams to see fulfilled. Listening to John Denman he definitely plays with a distinctive artfulness, but I don't know if he is an example of what Les was referring to.
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: ruben
Date: 2024-02-04 16:20
Julian, I knew John Denman and he told me pretty much modelled himself on Jack Brymer, meaning a very vocal vibrato. But the last 20 years or so, John was playing a lot of jazz (Benny Goodman style) and pop music and this altered his playing a bit.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2024-02-04 20:49
I'll try to find out from Les what he was referring to.
Thinking about it now I've become curious .
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2024-02-04 23:41
Well!..
Les cited Reginald Kell as a key example of what he had been talking about, so by " an old English style ", I think he was referring more to a period when predominantly English artists were introducing broader ideas into conservative thinking, regarding how the instrument should be played.
I think he feels that there tend to be conservative teaching methods that inhibit the playing art and its potential development .
I hope this doesn't digress too much from John Denman.
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: Nelson
Date: 2024-02-05 08:44
Hi, I haven't thoroughly read all the posts on this subject and I may have missed it but somewhere around the late 70s, John Denman was interviewed by Marvin Livengood (after the 1977 Denver gathering). I have a copy of the article but unfortunately the magazine's name is missing from my print. It was called 'The Man with the Golden Clarinets' . My scanner isn't working at the moment so cannot circulate. I believe this may refer to a later pair....not sure.
I spoke to John about his beautiful sound when he cam to Australia and touched on the dangerous topic of vibrato . His reply was "use it, but don't teach it"
On a slightly different tack, and UK oriented..
After reading one post, I did venture into the ad for Denman's own clarinet creation marketed by Bill Lewington it seems and was taken back to the time i lived in London through the great collection of photos from Bill's Shaftesbury Avenue days, a woodwind wonderland for a lad of 18..
I was wondering if anyone has any photos at all taken in/of Bill and Dennis's first shop in Macclesfield Street in Soho ...close to where Ronnie Scott's club stared out.. off Gerard Street and where I bought my first Leblanc in 1960
thanks
Nelson
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2024-02-06 01:27
Julian, as an Englishman and player I’ve taken much inspiration from players like Kell, Brymer, Denman De Peyer etc.
While that broader tone hasn’t entirely disappeared. I believe, rightly or wrongly, British playing has developed more clarity in tone without sacrificing that freedom and lyrical expression that has always characterised the British school.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: ruben
Date: 2024-02-06 02:30
Peter Cigleris has done much to promote fine and unfairly little know repertoire and to keep the Brymer, Kell flame alive. Many of the French contemporaries of Brymer and Kell sounded very technical. Brymer and Kell sounded totally vocal and effortless.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2024-02-06 14:09
The previously referenced Leslie Craven is another. Might add Mark Simpson (also a composer) to the list, who has, incidentally, switched to large bore Eaton 'Elites'.
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2024-02-06 15:14
Mark has always been a Peter Eaton player as I was originally.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2024-02-06 15:35
Yes, Mark Simpson has always been an Eaton player, but previously played the 'International' model.
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Author: symphony1010
Date: 2024-02-08 14:36
As a young clarinettist I grew up in north east Hampshire close to Guildford, just across the border in Surrey. My nearest professional orchestra was the Guildford Philharmonic, which was largely comprised of good London players heading out of town for a decently paid gig over the weekend. The conductor during my teenage years there was Vernon Handley and I encountered much of the central repertoire as well as Handley's specialisms during that time. John Denman was principal clarinet and my band director played 2nd. John's sound and style of playing were an inspiration and I think he was probably at his peak around that time. I can still hear him playing the solo in Tchaikovsky's Francesca da Rimini and warming the sound with his gentle vibrato.
He also gave recitals in Guildford and at one of these he developed a cough. A quick hand in the pocket and he promptly continued with a cough sweet whilst playing!
A few years later and I took up a scholarship at the Royal College of Music. My professor, Sidney Fell, had been principal clarinet of the LSO and at some point I told him how much I admired Denman's playing. He told me that Denman had been his second on some recordings including the Mendelssohn Incidental music to a Midsummer Night's Dream. In the famous scherzo he took delight in telling me that it wasn't quite fast enough for Denman's famous double-tongue and just at the limit for his single tongue.
You can hear the result here https://youtu.be/DS6Rqr-RYB4?si=NRUG2FafQeFw9cvw
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Author: ruben
Date: 2024-02-08 19:52
Symphony 1010: Thank you for sharing your experience of John. For me, he was never "past his peak". He was even playing very well even when he was dying of pancreatic cancer.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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