 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-09 01:53
A little background on me: I'm currently a mechanical engineering student who's been clarinet for over 10 years who also plays saxophone.
Lately, I've been really into learning about clarinet history, the different systems, keys, etc. Among the first of my interests is the full Boehm (which I now own) which had a low Eb. I recently got my own 3d printer and decided to try my hand at creating a removable extension for my Yamaha student clarinet to add this note. (First two pictures) Because the lever is PLA plastic, it flexes a little too much for my taste, but other than that, it works as planned.
After this, I set out to create a low D extension for my low Eb bass clarinet since I also play bari sax and wanted to play the same music. Overall, this one was a little easier and more useful and doesn't have issues with flexing. I'm actually pretty happy with this and hope to make two more extensions to give me the range to low C in the future.
Post Edited (2018-04-09 02:01)
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-09 03:32
not the best quality videos but here's some demos
Bb clarinet extension demo: https://twitter.com/jaetaro12/status/983115404015882240
bass clarinet extension demo: https://twitter.com/jaetaro12/status/983117675571200005
Post Edited (2018-04-09 03:32)
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-09 04:19
Impressive! I got lucky with the tone hole on my Eb extension but it took a while for my D extension. I hope to introduce some metal into my designs eventually
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Author: Ken Lagace
Date: 2018-04-09 04:27
I strongly encourage you to read and absorb "Clarinet Acoustics" by Lee Gibson printed by Indiana University Press. The clarinet has so many inherent acoustic difficulties that need help. You may have a great future designing acoustical fixes for our imperfect instrument. And you have the training to understand the details in that book than I can.
Here is more that is a bit over my head!
http://www.sfoxclarinets.com/Mathematics.html#acleng
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-09 04:36
Thanks Ken, this might be useful in the future. I don't know if this will ever become more than a hobby for me, but this info might be useful for my experiments, especially the tuning and speaker hole info. (I'll admit, I don't totally understand everything either, I'm only a second-year undergrad :P)
Learning about, playing, and working on instruments has really become a interest, dare I say passion or obsession for me lately. I've had thoughts of working in a music repair shop during the summer, so we'll see. I hope something comes of it.
Post Edited (2018-04-09 04:46)
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2018-04-09 04:47
Have you considered learning to braze/silver solder? You are clearly very mechanically inclined and I imagine it would be very easy for you to learn. I first learned by purchasing a cheap oxy-propane torch from Home Depot and some flux and silver solder from eBay. I then practiced soldering random bits of clarient keys together until I could make a clean solder. Learning to silver solder would take your tinkering to the next level, not to mention it is a valuable skill that will serve you well as an engineer.
Also now I really want to see that PVC contrabass. That sounds awesome!
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-09 04:47
Maybe I should try resuming my PVC contrabass clarinet project: (it never got past the initial length phase) https://www.instagram.com/p/BXY522lgE6k
Post Edited (2018-04-09 04:55)
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-09 04:54
I have not really considered it, but I might now. The only kind of soldering that I tried was with wires, but I never took the time to get good with it.
As for clarinet parts, how should I get them? Just buy a parts lot on ebay?
Post Edited (2018-04-09 04:55)
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-09 05:00
Funny how you should mention that recorder... It was the inspiration for me to start this project! XD
(Now I'm thinking of making a square clarinet also)
Post Edited (2018-04-09 05:01)
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2018-04-09 05:07
Yeah I bought a bunch of parts on eBay. Also I got a large box of broken clarinets when I went to a local music store and mentioned I fix instruments. I struck up a great conversation with the repairman there and he ended up giving me all of the broken instrument pieces they had no use for.
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2018-04-11 13:19
Ken Lagace wrote:
> I strongly encourage you to read and absorb "Clarinet
> Acoustics" by Lee Gibson printed by Indiana University Press.
> The clarinet has so many inherent acoustic difficulties that
> need help. You may have a great future designing acoustical
> fixes for our imperfect instrument. And you have the training
> to understand the details in that book than I can.
>
> Here is more that is a bit over my head!
> http://www.sfoxclarinets.com/Mathematics.html#acleng
The "science" in Lee Gibson's book is not the best.
It would be better to read Benade's Fundamentals of Musical Acoustics and, if you can cope with the maths, Nederveen's Acoustical Aspects of Woodwind Instruments.
Also this article for the basics.
http://www.sfoxclarinets.com/baclac_art.htm
Post Edited (2018-04-11 13:23)
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2018-04-11 13:37
A suggestion. You could perhaps mitigate the bendyness a bit by using a steel rod for the long sections and epoxy it to 3d printed parts for the mechanisms, pad cups and touchpieces.
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-12 01:20
Thanks Dibbs, I've attempted to look into Benade's work in the past but I remember not being able to understand much of it (it was a quick glance though). I might give it another look in the future.
Also, the flex is really only a issue for the Bb clarinet extension. This note is available on an A clarinet which a serious clarinet player would likely already have or a Bb full Boehm. Therefore, I would limit the realistic audience to students or recreational playing, in which it is still a relatively niche use. If I decide to sell these, I'd probably try using a metal rod for the lever and leave the remaining parts as 3d printed. I'd like to end up having the final product be made out of better materials, wooden body with metal key work, but this seems like a distant thought as of right now.
To me, I think the bass extensions are a little more useful in general. They also do not suffer from flexing issues. Again, I'd like them to made out of wood and metal, but I think I could still be able to market some 3d printed things too (it'd be cheaper too). If I decide to sell these, I think the bass extension would do better than the Bb clarinet extension.
As for progress on the extension to low C:
The extension for low C# is nearly done, just need to make a rod shorter and reprint the keys. A body that was made previously for low D was initially too long for low D but the right length for low C#. This extension works with or without the body section intended for low C.
The extension for low C is more involved because I am unable to use the key on the bell to produce the note; it comes out as a very sharp C or a very flat C#. I think I will try printing another extension body with just a key and use the hole on the bell (usually covered when playing low Eb) as the venting hole. I think this should work, but I am open to suggestions if others have them.
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Author: Mojo
Date: 2018-04-12 16:32
My Kessler low C bass appears to use the same bell designed for low Eb bass clarinets. It has a low C that is in tune but the C# is flat. I calculated that the hole in the bell is about 1/4” too low. Annoying but probably done to keep costs low. The C# is very rarely used.
MojoMP.com
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
MojoMouthpieceWork@yahoo.com
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2018-04-12 17:11
On my Selmer low C bass the low C is extremely sharp. I solved this problem by making a 4" long tube that gets inserted into the bell to bring the note down to pitch.
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-04-14 09:58
Attachment: IMG_7480.JPG (1925k)
Update: just finished the C# extension and keywork for the low C is printing right now.
On a student Bundy low Eb bass clarinet with C3 reading directly in tune (0 cents sharp/flat): low D (D2) sounds 4 cents flat, C# (C#2) sounds 4 cents flat and C (C2) sounds 2-4 cents flat. For my needs, this is probably more than enough.
I'm really excited to finally finish this project.
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Author: jordan.1210
Date: 2018-11-13 05:52
Sorry for leaving anyone interested in this project hanging. I was working on this at the end of last school year before I went on break. I got all the keywork done for the most part to the point of only needing to attach the pads. Then break started and I haven't worked on it since. (sorry!) I have the pads and the 3d model of the key for the pad to be attached to but I never attached them. I probably will when I have time (and am convinced I have everything right, don't want to mess up and have to buy more pads)
If anyone wanted to see a demo of the project playing (with keys that don't have pads, so plastic on plastic seals on tone holes) or anyone wanted to contact me like someone mentioned above, check my twitter: https://twitter.com/jaetaro12/status/1032538418280972288
The recording shows that the low C# and C have some minor issues that I believe is due to significant air leaks from the E and Eb vent holes (holes covered by the 3d printed Eb and D keys). I think I should be able to solve this by installing the pads.
In the meantime, I haven't forgotten about this project. I actual use it fairly frequently for the low D for fun reading bari parts or in the clarinet group I play with for fun since the low Eb and low D don't audibly suffer major intonation/tone issues like the low C and C# somewhat.
Post Edited (2018-11-13 05:56)
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The Clarinet Pages
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