 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: mqaa
Date: 2023-09-28 19:24
Vandoren has developed a new material for mouthpieces and a new BD6 HD mouthpiece made of the material: https://www.instagram.com/p/CxuwG0OM7l1/
Google translated text from Instagram:
Quote:
We are proud to present you today a new material, the result of many years of research: EBONITE HD, a high-density ebonite of musical quality, produced exclusively for Vandoren. 🎶
Its particular physical properties reinforce the natural acoustic qualities of standard ebonite and optimize the play sensation:
👉 The projection is excellent
👉 The volume is dense and full on all the fabric
👉 The detached is precise and easy
👉 The musician has strengthened support and control regardless of the nuance.
Black Diamond stakes for Sib clarinet will be gradually available from our regular dealers, starting with a brand new model: the BD6 HD!
✅ HD ebonite is 100% natural origin and certified non-toxic, in accordance with European Directive EU2009/48/EC, Annex II, Part III, just like the standard musical quality ebonite used by Vandoren for nearly a century.{/quote]
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Author: donald
Date: 2023-09-29 06:26
You do realise that you just posted Vandoren advertising copy?
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Author: mqaa
Date: 2023-09-29 10:50
I'm a real person playing the clarinet since I was nine and have been reading here for years now and thought people might be interested in this. I do say in the post that the text is translated from the Vandoren instagram post and not my own. Sorry if I offended somebody or broke the BB rules.
The post turned up on the french Vandoren feed so I thought most of you would not have read it and might be interested.
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Author: donald
Date: 2023-09-29 11:39
Hey it's ok buddy, I'm not too bothered, you were just making Vandorens job easy for them!
My thoughts are that a place like this is for people to share their experience of the new product, so bringing it up could make for some informative sharing... but probably best to avoid just repeating the advertising- companies like that SHOULD be paying for that exposure, not having it handed to them.
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Author: JAS
Date: 2023-09-30 17:02
I had not heard about this, and I found this post helpful.
That's all I've got.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2023-09-30 19:47
Those who use and enjoy the Gleichweit mouthpieces (plastic) know that the material is not really important to the sound (though I'd concede that when all things are equal it can make a slight difference.......as much as with ligatures).
Perhaps Vandoren could take some of those R&D dollars and put them toward making the VK1s consistent amongst the same strength.
.......just sayin'
......................Paul Aviles
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2023-09-30 23:55
Gawd, I wish people let the moderators do their work and kept out of criticizing everything. A little note with a link to the French post and a translation for something new. If you don't like reading it ... don't. You don't need to study rules, you don't need to call someone out because they only have 3 posts. It's s**t like this that makes the BBoard seem to be exclusive. If there's a problem generally we'll take the post down and contact the poster - but that's OUR responsibility, not yours. If you legitimately think there's a problem, contact us. We might not agree with you, we might. There was a post recently that was mildly sexual in nature that a person complained about. My sensibilities weren't violated, so I let the post stand, though one step farther and I would have taken it down or edited it. I had no problem with someone contacting me about it - I had read it and glossed over the offending statement, but I understand how it might have affected someone else.
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Author: donald
Date: 2023-10-01 01:43
Point taken Mr Charette, though note I never said he/she couldn't post it just to THINK about posting discussion rather than advertising copy.
Post Edited (2023-10-01 04:55)
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2023-10-01 11:44
To speculate on the actual topic, I imaging that this HD ebonite will tend to deliver a somewhat brighter sound.
When we insight rules, it's good to consider the actual reasons behind them.
If these reasons are not really applicable .....then neither is the rule.
I think that mqaa's intention was just to share what information they had on a new product that could be of interest to others, that information being no more at this time than Vandorens own pitch, which by offering word for word is more honest than changing a few words to make it technically copliant with the BBoard rules .
I don't believe for one moment that mqaa offered this information with any vested interest in the sales of the product.
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: sonicbang
Date: 2023-10-01 11:54
A couple of days ago I saw this thread here and I wrote a post on Facebook. I copy it here, as somebody may find it interesting. I copy my thread here as maybe somebody doesn't have access to this FB group.
"Seems like Vandoren introduces a new mouthpiece! I wouldn't be that thrilled just about a new facing, not even by a new interior or exterior design. This time, they will use a new material, so they finally change a variable that hasn't really been touched since the 90's.
<same Instagram link as in the original post>
Ten years ago, when I got my first Vandoren Perfecta mouthpiece, I got very excited about its qualities and the huge difference between the modern lineup was evident from the very first seconds. I was wondering if a company has all the knowledge to produce something this good, why wouldn't they do it again. So I wrote this email (edited to correct typos and to make it shorter):
"Dear Laurent Sultan,
I had a question about a week ago which I sent via the contact form of the official Vandoren website [...] I hope you can answer or forward my question. Thank you in advance.
It's not hard to recognize that trend in the music industry field which goes back to traditional designs along with innovative features. I mean the D'Addario company made mouthpieces from solid rod rubber stock (although the result is far from ideal, in my opinion), the legendary Morre reeds were reintroduced, and more recently Buffet built the redesigned version of the BC-20 clarinet and the line continues. The trend is clear: let's use what is already working and improve it with modern machinery and technology.
I have owned/played/had on trial many Vandoren mouthpieces and each of them had their own merits. What I missed from them I finally found in two old Vandoren Perfectas. The point is primary the material. The rubber used in those mouthpieces produces a fuller spectrum of overtones, effortless focus, depth of sound, and projection in every dynamic is much easier to achieve. No matter how the interior or facing is designed these days, without this material, something is always missing, just like when you don't find the salt while you are cooking.
I can imagine the Vandoren company could reintroduce this mouthpiece with great success. Those clarinetists whom I let my Perfecta try were simply amazed by its sound, response, and ease of playing. Today's trend to strive for an even more darker and covered sound slowly seems to run out of fuel. To be the first big company that leads back the clarinet world to the ringing sound quality can mean a significant edge. I bet Vandoren has Perfecta's blueprints and all that is needed to recreate the material and machine it. With a medium/medium closed facing, I believe it would be a great hit on the market.
Best regards,
Mark Szavin"
I got this reply, which I share with the permission of the person who wrote it (I asked for permission a few days later after receiving this):
"Dear Sir,
Thank you for your message which I'm forwarding to the management.
Best regards,
Laurent Sultan, Vandoren Paris"
A few other emails were exchanged, but I got no reply for the last one I sent. I gave it up, but two years later (2015) the Black Diamond series was introduced. My first naive thought was maybe the management was listening to my emails? Is this possible? Or the name is just a coincidence? When I tried a BD5 at the local music shop, it quickly became apparent that the material remained the same, and the sound was even 'darker' (personally, I found it duller, but I know some great players use it with success) than before.
But hearing about this newly introduced material got my attention again. Has anyone of you tried a prototype or something? How does the rubber compare to the Diamond Perfecta? I would be curious about any insider info on this one 😄"
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Author: Patrick
Date: 2023-10-01 19:12
I am curious about the price point and manufacturing process on this new mouthpiece. Seems like Vandoren has released very few details about the mouthpiece and I wasn’t at the last clarinet fest to try it out.
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Author: Jimis4klar
Date: 2023-10-14 17:01
Tip opening: 121.5 (1/100mm)
Facing length: medium
Product reference: CM1006HD
My question is If the material will be anything like the good old rod rubber Vandoren pieces... Like the Perfecta Diamond, which is the predecessor of the new BDs, and generally the same Vandoren models with engraved logos, which were better made than the new ones. If Vandoren becomes as great as used to be, that's very good news! Will try this mouthpiece anyway and see.
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Author: moma4faith
Date: 2023-10-17 00:05
I look forward to reading reviews of this new material once members of the BB board have a chance to try the new mp's out.
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Author: timg
Date: 2023-11-26 04:25
I just got hold of a BD6 and I'm quite pleased with it. I was looking for something with a slightly brighter sound than my BD5, and which could be pushed a bit harder, and that's exactly what I found.
The opening is slightly larger at 1.215mm, and it needs a bit more support than the BD5. The density is really noticeable, although I can't say what effect that has.
Using #3 "56 Rue Lepic" reeds and a BG Duo metal ligature.
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Author: Jimis4klar
Date: 2023-11-26 23:40
What's the highest strength of V12 It can support? I think It mentions that on the box? Unfortunately I can't try It yet, still not available on Amazon.
Post Edited (2023-11-26 23:41)
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Author: Patrick
Date: 2023-11-27 01:45
I plan on going up to LA to try it out towards the end of December. The new material is something that interests me. The BD 2 seems like another one worth trying.
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Author: timg
Date: 2023-11-27 02:29
BD6 recommended reed strengths are
2.5 - 3.5 (Traditional)
or
3 - 3.5+ (V12, 56, V21)
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Author: Jimis4klar
Date: 2023-11-27 14:41
Thanks. I generally play V12 3.5+ minimum on my mouthpieces. With 3.5 I don't get the stability I like, even if mouthpiece plays with 3.5 V12 at most. Let's see how BD6 will play.
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Author: Jimis4klar
Date: 2023-11-27 15:49
I've also seen BD2, probably for harder reeds as will have much closer tip. This one in HD material would be even more interesting.
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Author: J. J.
Date: 2023-11-28 01:21
I will never get tired of these posts that pretend like Vandoren is in some sort of decline and just needs to get back to their roots… while their mouthpieces dominate audition wins (one of the few partially objective measures available) year after year. Pros know what’s up.
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