 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2023-03-15 21:00
I came up with something which efficiently dries out the bore on a bass clarinet without the dismantling hastle to pass the swab . I doubt I'm the first to use this method and a good designer could no doubt come up with something more compact and better designed than my system .I used a small centrifuge fan adding an electronic timer and flexible tube to feed a gentle air flow through the bore......You just remove the mouthpiece , inset the pipe and hit the start button and its dry as a bone in 15 mins .i don't see this device as entirely replacing swabbing however , as it only removes moisture , but I believe that it works better than swabbing to eliminate moisture inside the tone holes .
I came up with this idea for my wife ,who tends to squeeze in a good part of her practice time by grabbing odd moments in her busy day, but then runs off leaving her bass wet in the stand. I found myself acasionally checking the bore grumpily and half expecting a parrot to take my eye out .
I imagine a refined design of this dyer as being like a small , compact hairdryer that just fits in place of the mouth piece , only with a timer and not a heating element , although a very mild warming of the air would no doubt speed up the drying time.Perhaps bore blow-dryers are already being marketed . All I know is that it both works really well and is very convenient .
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: SecondTry
Date: 2023-03-15 21:35
nice Julian:
I on the other hand am far less patient for the drying process to occur (on my Soprano.)
The "tools of my trade" are a absolutely clean shop vacuum from a big box store,
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Stinger-2-5-Gallon-1-75-Peak-HP-Compact-Wet-Dry-Shop-Vacuum-with-Filter-Bag-Hose-and-Accessories-HD2025/308699706
whose hose is connected to its exhaust side, and its accessory kit
https://www.homedepot.com/p/MULTI-FIT-1-1-4-in-Micro-Cleaning-Accessory-Kit-for-Wet-Dry-Shop-Vacuums-VT1215/100139249
whose tool on the right being my "weapon" of choice to attach to the open end of the exhaust hose.
To dry out the instrument I stick the aforementioned hose accessory, connected of course to the hose and energized vacuum, up the bell of a reed removed instrument. I tend to cover the instrument's tone holes and aim the top of the instrument away from me as water comes out of the open mouthpiece When this is complete, with the vacuum still connected as prior, I take the mouthpiece off, stick the top of the open barrel under my chin and cover most tone holes, alternating which ones I cover. I've never found the vacuum's power to be an issue with compromising pads, but never is not at least one, if not a couple tone holes open at all times when I've got the instrument under my chin as described prior.
Next I disassemble the instrument and blow the inside and outside of each section and the openings made accessible through disassembly, opening tone holes to do so.
FWIW I have a portable device too that with the right two most adapters in the picture allows me to effect same at gigs---much that I tend to just use a swab in such circumstances.
Post Edited (2023-03-15 21:37)
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Author: lydian
Date: 2023-03-15 23:32
The problem with evaporative drying is mineral and other residue. Probably kind of hard on the wood as well. Not to mention how inconvenient it would be at gigs and rehearsals. But if it works for you, that's great. I'll stick with my 15 second swab regimen.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2023-03-16 02:53
There's a good reason why pullthroughs and mops have been used for aeons and why a modified hairdryer has never been used for this purpose.
Pullthroughs will wipe the bore and remove anything on its surface whereas blow-drying will evaporate the water and leave dirt, dust and mineral deposits. Over time, they'll just build up and leave the bore and toneholes all crusty. I've seen a clarinet that was played and put away wet for what must've been decades and the bore was completely encrusted with what looked like black sugar crystals which took lot of scrubbing with a nylon trumpet case brush to remove.
If mineral deposits are allowed to build up, removing them will require acid to dissolve them and then wash and rinse out and neutralise the joints which won't suit wooden clarinets at all well, whereas using a pullthrough in the normal manner will keep the bore clean, although grease, oils, fluff and other stuff will still build up in the toneholes which is where regular servicing comes into the equation.
The only time I've seen a hairdryer recommended for use is the instruction cards that came with Valentino Greenback pads where they show installing them and heating with a hairdryer and clamping them closed to create a deep impression in them, but that isn't required at all as they can be seated in the normal manner by floating them on a layer of hot glue (and not shellac as that requires more heat which will distort them). And not exactly a good thing to do with plastic clarinets (Buffet B10 clarinets used these pads) as the heat isn't concentrated and heating up one area of the plastic joint can end up softening or melting it. The heat from a hairdryer will however square up the rounded edges of the pads if you want the edges all looking nice and crisp and that can be done to the pads before installing or when they're in the pad cups before they go on the instrument.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Connor1700
Date: 2023-03-16 06:36
As Mr. Wonderful would say.... take this idea out behind the barn and SHOOT IT! Thanks for the chuckle, though.
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2023-03-16 10:51
So what your saying is that this idea is about as good as my idea for a remote sensor activated ,rotating brush/ vacuum box cat flap ..... Or my idea of people wearing their underpants outside their trousers to save on laundry bills .
< sigh! >
Guess I'm just destined to be a frustrated genius ( and only make 50% accurate statements ). Ha- Ha !
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2023-03-16 17:07
...And you may laugh Connor....But the chances of ever becoming a Superhero are greatly reduced for people with narrow views on how to wear their underparts. .
But to return to the topic seriously .. YES ! ..I appreciate that air drying will leave deposits that are likely to be resistant later to swabbing . Personally I'm someone quite happy to invest the time required for proper instrument care ,but I'm damned if I'm going to dutifully swab my wife's bass every time she leaves it on the stand wet. It's only a hard rubber Ridenour 925c , and I've already told her that if she ever wants a Contr- bass ,then she can start by getting a new husband . ( Above all a richer one ..Ha-ha !).
My wife at least uses the blow dryer which saves me from getting grumpy, even if it's not ideal for the instrument itself .
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-03-16 17:23
This is a discussion that has been raised by busy women/Mum players in the past. We're at home a lot so have lots of time to play, but also have constant sudden interruptions, so that swabbing is impractical.
Nobody has yet come up with a solution, but I love that you are trying.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2023-03-16 21:28
>> something which efficiently dries out the bore on a bass clarinet without the dismantling hastle to pass the swab <<
Swabbing isn't really a hassle but let's say your method is good...
>> in 15 mins <<
Why would you use a method that takes about 13 minutes longer and requires you to carry quite a bit more stuff...?
Post Edited (2023-03-16 21:29)
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2023-03-25 14:53
Well !....
Having accepted Chris P 's legitimate critique regarding the air drying of bores as leaving residues ,I'm not planning on endorsing this idea any further. However , having used this method for about half a year now ,together with a couple of proper swabbings a week, I have to say that the bore still appears to be clean and polished .Swabbing never fully gets moisture out of tone holes anyway ,so in that much the issues relating to moisture evaporation deposits are appreciable to all ....such as they are .
As to my blower being a rediculus invention taking you 15 mins .....well obviously IT takes 15mins ,but your time investment in using it is about 5 seconds .
And clearly it's only really practical for home use .
These are my last words on this topic .
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2023-03-26 13:37
Not debating that it works... but does it really dry the entire instrument? I assume you leave it assembled when you dry it that way, otherwise you'd need to repeat it for every section, or need three driers.
Can it reach anywhere that wet with all the open tone holes? I doubt the lower section would even be wet if you play nothing but throat notes, so the same but in reverse.
I prefer to disassemble when I finish playing rather than leaving it assembled and coming back to mess with it again, but it's just preference. I guess it could be useful when you take a break.
I assume it doesn't dry the sockets, so you'd still likely swab a bit in addition to it (unless you don't bother drying them regardless), and probably swab the mouthpiece (at least most people do), so swabbing the entire instrument isn't that much of a hassle anyway.
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-03-26 15:49
I also wondered about disassembling and drying the sockets. Those are the bits that take the time for me.
I was thinking, somewhat wryly, that the answer maybe to disassemble in a frantic hurry and lay all the bits on an airhockey table. But the more I think about it, the more I feel that someone would probably happily market this design.
I wondered also - are there really crystals inside the clarinet? I know horn people swear that it is only pure water inside the horn, but maybe clarinets are different?
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-03-26 17:07
Attachment: dryer.jpg (520k)
The Bb clarinet version could look like this in the attached image.
With tall columns to hold each part and little holes where the cool air squirts out to dry the parts. (The columns would be thinner and longer than I drew them.)
There would need to be holes carefully positioned to dry the tenons (labelled).
The part marked "cool air in" would need to have a sort of hairdryer-type thing attached that blew cool air quietly into the stand.
For the posh expensive one, it would be one of those silent fans like the Dyson bladeless silent fan (https://www.dyson.co.uk/fans-and-heaters/cool/features). Budget version to use a regular hairdryer.
Before we know it there would be adverts saying "No more bore damage from swabbing - protect your instrument with clarinet saver! Only $699"
Adult learner, Grade 3
Equipment: Yamaha Custom CX Bb, Fobes 10K CF mp,
Legere Soprano Sax American Cut #2, Vandoren Optimum German Lig.
Post Edited (2023-03-26 17:11)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2023-03-26 18:01
You'll have to replace the word tenon with socket in that diagram as barrels, bells and the lower joint all have sockets. The mouthpiece, top joint and lower joint are the ones that have tenons.
Tenon = male
Socket = female
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-03-26 18:12
Attachment: dryer2.jpg (18k)
Thank you very much, I didn't know that. Here is again, edited.
This design doesn't help at all with the fact that I am too weedy to get my clarinet apart and together without machinery to help. I'm going to need to go to weight lifting classes.
Adult learner, Grade 3
Equipment: Yamaha Custom CX Bb, Fobes 10K CF mp,
Legere Soprano Sax American Cut #2, Vandoren Optimum German Lig.
Post Edited (2023-03-26 18:15)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2023-03-26 22:13
Use a hand towel or a chamois leather wrapped around the joints to give yourself more leverage (by increasing the overall diameter) if you're finding it difficult to grip the joints.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2023-03-26 23:33
Thanks, I'll try that. :-)
I keep thinking about how difficult it is for women (Mums) to fit in practise and I think the devil is in the detail really.
I wondered if I could explain, because I really think that Julian is making an important point. We are always asking why women disappear from careers after having kids, and I think this little detail of practise that he has raised is a critical part of it.
The problem is that as Mums at home, we have this pattern for constant interruptions that can't be ignored.
For example, we play 5 scales and then the doorbell rings, and grocery shopping has to be put away. Then we play another 5 scales and the phone rings (we have to answer the phone in case it's the school). Then an email has to be written in response to the phone call. Then there is another urgent email in the inbox. Then 5 scales and we have to open the door because a parcel is delivered.
The irony is that Mums at home have a golden opportunity to practise such a lot. This is because they are at home so much and have totally privacy, and a lot of time. The flip side is that the time is parcelled up into a series of random 5 minutes slots, that are spread out throughout the day.
If the clarinet could be left assembled and wet, I could easily fit in 2 hours of practise in a day, in many ten minute increments. But if the clarinet has to be disassembled, dried and put away, then I can only schedule one half our of practise every three days. That is a really big difference.
I don't know, but I imagine that that must be the same for professional musicians who are on career break with little kids (men and women these days). I can imagine that their chance of return would be greatly improved if products were designed that could help them get round this problem.
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The Clarinet Pages
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